As more bashing against deanoc continues...we now sympathize for him

[johnnysd]

Here is my take..... I have bought 7 cues using Dean directly and as part of his special cue projects.

I was and still am very pleased with my business dealings with Dean and especially, my cue-makers.



Regardless of the criticism being expressed, I would do business with Dean again in a friggin’ heartbeat.

How ironic it is these attacks on Dean’s integrity are essentially from folks that never did business with him.



The only time to really pay attention to this topic is if and when you read criticism of Dean from former customers.

So far I’ve only read positive comments and Dean’s i rating attests to it as Cocobolo Cowboy has previously posted.



Yes, everyone is entitled to their opinion. The only ones that truly matter are those expressed by Dean’s actual customers.



NUF CED!


Matt B.

Good for you. I would ban him from this board. It's not the first bad thing he has done or continues to do.

 

[lorider]

Sometimes there is a thing called "goodwill" because deanoc is a major player in the industry therefore him commissioning or requesting a build is enough to garner the premium he charges.

Goodwill ? Lmao

Here is my experience dealing with a so called highly respected cue dealer.

I had a cue i wanted to trade and add a thousand or so for a cue the dealer wanted three thousand for. Now i knew my cue was worth a minimum of 25 hundred but i was willing to take 18 hundred or 2 thousand in a trade and not even haggle with the price of his cue.

He looks at my cue and says i will give you 12 hundred on trade .no friggin way. He then claims my cue has no ivory in it. Since i am no expert on ivory and and knowing since he dewls in cues and has more experinence with ivory he got me wondering if I was lied to when i bought my cue.

I walked down the aisle...this was at a venue with several cue dealers and makers in attendance. I stopped and asked 2 different cue makers their opinion about my cue and if it had ivory in it or not. I didnt tell them about my experience with the cue dealer. They both told me it was indeed ivory and when asked one maker said he woukd not sell it for less than 3 thousand.

Here is the kicker. This dealer had a cue by the swme maker with less points...no ivory ...no silver stitch rings...no abalone shell ..all which my cue had and he was asking 1800 for it. Basically this highly respected dealer was trying to rip me off.

I later sold the cue for 2500. Same price i paid for it.

 

[logical]

Goodwill ? Lmao



Here is my experience dealing with a so called highly respected cue dealer.



I had a cue i wanted to trade and add a thousand or so for a cue the dealer wanted three thousand for. Now i knew my cue was worth a minimum of 25 hundred but i was willing to take 18 hundred or 2 thousand in a trade and not even haggle with the price of his cue.



He looks at my cue and says i will give you 12 hundred on trade .no friggin way. He then claims my cue has no ivory in it. Since i am no expert on ivory and and knowing since he dewls in cues and has more experinence with ivory he got me wondering if I was lied to when i bought my cue.



I walked down the aisle...this was at a venue with several cue dealers and makers in attendance. I stopped and asked 2 different cue makers their opinion about my cue and if it had ivory in it or not. I didnt tell them about my experience with the cue dealer. They both told me it was indeed ivory and when asked one maker said he woukd not sell it for less than 3 thousand.



Here is the kicker. This dealer had a cue by the swme maker with less points...no ivory ...no silver stitch rings...no abalone shell ..all which my cue had and he was asking 1800 for it. Basically this highly respected dealer was trying to rip me off.



I later sold the cue for 2500. Same price i paid for it.

To be fair, a cue is only valuable to a dealer at a price he can make what he feels is an acceptable profit on. Timing can play into this too. Is he cash heavy or light. High or low inventory. How fast does he think he can resell. Its unfortunate that he was either dishonest or not knowledgeable about the ivory but it's important to not let emotions rise. Focus on the numbers. Gun shows are the same way as are most other hobby gatherings. If the number is wrong, just smile and move on.

Sent from the future.

 

[Johnny Rosato]

lorider, who is the dealer? A lot of folks might not want to deal with him.

 

[Bic D]

How many cues did Deanoc sell like this?

 

[garczar]

How many cues did Deanoc sell like this?

What difference does it make? One was too many. The fact that he concocted the bs story in the first place is bad enough.

 

[Bic D]

What difference does it make? One was too many. The fact that he concocted the bs story in the first place is bad enough.

I was just curious because the fines, prison sentences, and other consequences that follow a conviction for wire and mail fraud vary considerably, with fines from not more than $25,000 to not more than $2 million and prison terms from not more than five
years to life.

He could be charged with multiple counts depending on the number of sticks that were sold however I'm sure that it would all get consolidated down to 1 count in the end.

 

[garczar]

I was just curious because the fines, prison sentences, and other consequences that follow a conviction for wire and mail fraud vary considerably, with fines from not more than $25,000 to not more than $2 million and prison terms from not more than five
years to life.

He could be charged with multiple counts depending on the number of sticks that were sold however I'm sure that it would all get consolidated down to 1 count in the end.

Could all be true but i doubt anyone is going to do this. Just filing a suit costs money plus its a major pita. I did it once and jumping thru all the hoops over this amount of $$ isn't worth it. The possibility of having to travel for a court appearance makes it even more not worth the effort imo.

 

[Bic D]

Could all be true but i doubt anyone is going to do this. Just filing a suit costs money plus its a major pita. I did it once and jumping thru all the hoops over this amount of $$ isn't worth it. The possibility of having to travel for a court appearance makes it even more not worth the effort imo.

You make some good points but just to be clear, it would be a criminal matter not a civil matter and therefore would cost no money to have someone brought up on felony charges.

Someone had mentioned that this isn't the first time that something fishy was done...its just going to take someone that gets pissed off enough or if the right people catch wind of his actions.

 

[garczar]

You make some good points but just to be clear, it would be a criminal matter not a civil matter and therefore would cost no money to have someone brought up on felony charges.

Someone had mentioned that this isn't the first time that something fishy was done...its just going to take someone that gets pissed off enough or if the right people catch wind of his actions.

Yeah that's true. If nothin' else it may scare one enough not to pull this crap.

 

[HawaiianEye]

To be fair, a cue is worth whatever somebody who bought a cue thinks it is worth to THEM, not what it is worth to somebody else. I have a cue that cost me out of my pocket $218 and have turned down over a thousand for it MANY, MANY times and I would never get my highest offer if I tried to sell it on here.

I don't want to sell the cue for whatever is offered. I don't need the money.

In your case, you have admitted you have not bought a cue.

QUICHER BICHIN BOUT SUMPTIN U AIN'T GOT

 

[ShootingHank]

To be fair, a cue is worth whatever somebody who bought a cue thinks it is worth to THEM, not what it is worth to somebody else. I have a cue that cost me out of my pocket $218 and have turned down over a thousand for it MANY, MANY times and I would never get my highest offer if I tried to sell it on here.

I don't want to sell the cue for whatever is offered. I don't need the money.

In your case, you have admitted you have not bought a cue.

QUICHER BICHIN BOUT SUMPTIN U AIN'T GOT

True. A cue’s worth is based on what the buyers are willing to pay.

Misrepresentation and deceit is wrong in which is why we’re having this conversation.

 

[TATE]

You make some good points but just to be clear, it would be a criminal matter not a civil matter and therefore would cost no money to have someone brought up on felony charges.

Someone had mentioned that this isn't the first time that something fishy was done...its just going to take someone that gets pissed off enough or if the right people catch wind of his actions.

Just to be clear, this is in no way on the scale of a criminal fraud. This would not be prosecuted as a crime. It is simply deceptive advertising.

Now if he claimed Jackpot prevented cancer, knowingly took the money without delivering the cues, or stole the cues, that would be criminal. If he knowingly wrote a bad check with intent to defraud, that could be criminal.

The district attorneys have better things to do than bust small timers like Dean for false advertising.

 

[HNTFSH]

Just to be clear, this is in no way on the scale of a criminal fraud. This would not be prosecuted as a crime. It is simply deceptive advertising.

Now if he claimed Jackpot prevented cancer, knowingly took the money without delivering the cues, or stole the cues, that would be criminal. If he knowingly wrote a bad check with intent to defraud, that could be criminal.

The district attorneys have better things to do than bust small timers like Dean for false advertising.

A theft by deception charge can range from a misdemeanor level offense up to a first degree felony offense. ... The range of punishment for a felony theft by deception can range from probation to twenty years or more in prison.

 

[CocoboloCowboy]

=

The district attorneys have better things to do than bust small timers like Dean for false advertising.

That why it not safe to walk on to a Car Dealer Showroom, because there is no punishment for how a lot of them conduct business.

Unless you live in a small town were everyone know where everyone live, shop, and goes to church.

 

[garczar]

That why it not safe to walk on to a Car Dealer Showroom, because there is no punishment for how a lot of them conduct business.

Unless you live in a small town were everyone know where everyone live, shop, and goes to church.

HUH??? You talking new or used?? HUGE difference. 99.999% of all used cars are sold as is. Unless seller offers a warranty you buy what you see, its up to you to have it checked out. As for new cars, you do have protections that vary from state to state. Have you ever bought a car from a dealer, any dealer, or you just like making the broad accusation?? Dean told people they were getting one thing when in fact they WEREN'T and he knew it and still sold the cues. Whether or not it played good doesn't mean shit here. He LIED to sell the cues. I still can't believe anyone still defends what he did.

 

[Bic D]

Just to be clear, this is in no way on the scale of a criminal fraud. This would not be prosecuted as a crime. It is simply deceptive advertising.

Now if he claimed Jackpot prevented cancer, knowingly took the money without delivering the cues, or stole the cues, that would be criminal. If he knowingly wrote a bad check with intent to defraud, that could be criminal.

The district attorneys have better things to do than bust small timers like Dean for false advertising.

With respect, your post couldn't be any further from the truth.

Mail fraud is one of the easiest crimes to prosecute and if or once the item crosses state lines, it becomes a Federal Offense, however the perpetrator's state will usually intervene depending on the severity of the situation.

There are basically just 4 elements for the crime of mail fraud to be met.

The perpetrator must have acted with the intent to scheme or defraud a person or entity.
The scheme must have involved material misstatements or purposeful omissions.
The scheme or fraud resulted in, or would likely have resulted in the loss of property, honest services, or money.
The perpetrator must have used the mail in some manner to further the scheme to defraud.

The victim doesn't even have to know that a fraud took place for the crime to be committed.

If Deanoc advertised that he was selling JP cues but instead sent out Schmelke cues AND accepted any form of payment....the moment it went into the mail, it was mail fraud and possibly a federal crime depending on where it was shipped.

While you are correct that DA's do have more important things to do....if 1,2,4,6 people all attempted to file warrants against Deanoc, they aren't going to be ignored.

 

[CocoboloCowboy]

HUH??? You talking new or used?? HUGE difference. 99.999% of all used cars are sold as is. Unless seller offers a warranty you buy what you see, its up to you to have it checked out. As for new cars, you do have protections that vary from state to state. Have you ever bought a car from a dealer, any dealer, or you just like making the broad accusation?? Dean told people they were getting one thing when in fact they WEREN'T and he knew it and still sold the cues. Whether or not it played good doesn't mean shit here. He LIED to sell the cues. I still can't believe anyone still defends what he did.

My point was big cities were Car Dealers can play games. Most are corporate stores, you General Manager is there one day gone the next. Repete sales they do not care about, it's a game of numbers. Dealer v/s sucker. Most do not know golden rule.

In small communities the car dealer most of the time is family owned, they are is your neighbor, you shop at same stores, go to same churches. They want to build a clientele, and have repete business.

That is the world 2020, before retiring I use to need a new business car about ever 14 - 16 months. Had dealing with the same fleet guy for years, no BS, he treated me fair, gave me fair prices, on trade, and new car, and I sent him more customers. He treated them the same.

 

[ShootingArts]

the number and total value may come into play

Just to be clear, this is in no way on the scale of a criminal fraud. This would not be prosecuted as a crime. It is simply deceptive advertising.

Now if he claimed Jackpot prevented cancer, knowingly took the money without delivering the cues, or stole the cues, that would be criminal. If he knowingly wrote a bad check with intent to defraud, that could be criminal.

The district attorneys have better things to do than bust small timers like Dean for false advertising.

Generally correct but the total amount and number of deals can come into play and the mood somebody is in. Even who somebody is that is accused. My brother-in-law got eight years for a crime he didn't commit, that the prosecutor's office knew from day one he didn't commit. They wanted him off the table for awhile.

Hu

 

[HawaiianEye]

Yeah, but if you want quality, and can afford $500 to $600, then get a Joss or a Schon.

Yeah, and if YOU want a quality cue, quit using this one and get a real cue.

I heard you and "Mouse-coni" play with this same type of cue. You saw him using it online and you wanted one Justin like his.

I don't know how it hits, but I'm sure you and that cue really "clicked" because you are still using it as your main player.

Did you get your cue from Best Buy or CompUSA?