Rate my Game... 10b Ghost with commentary

[The_JV]

So here is the my most recent attempt at the 10 ball Ghost that I have also posted within the "Ghost Challenge" thread. There typically isn't much conversation within that thread about a person's game (or lack there of...lol), so I thought I'd openly request criticism from the forum and see what input others may have on my game.

Feel free to make any remarks you wish. I can take it... Thanks and enjoy...

 

[tim913]

I won't dig on anything minor, but it appears to me that your position play would improve if you actually chose a target to hit with CB after each shot. Maybe I'm wrong but you seem to be trying to put the CB in a general area to make the next ball and it's causing you to get out of line. If you pick a target for CB to get on the correct ANGLE for next shot then you won't need to use a lot of draw and spin to get back in line. Your shot making ability is saving you so far but against an advanced player it won't.

 

[JC]

Good shooting with a nice pace and entertaining.

It made me laugh in rack 5 when you tried to get crazy shape on the three with a two railer with the bridge because you didn't like it in the side. Then after it goes bad like those schemes usually do you throw the balls up table and the nine cuts the three right in the side showing how open it really was for that pocket.

It looked like one of the many bad decisions I make every time I play that I see on video later.


Is that an 8 foot table?

 

[The_JV]

I won't dig on anything minor, but it appears to me that your position play would improve if you actually chose a target to hit with CB after each shot. Maybe I'm wrong but you seem to be trying to put the CB in a general area to make the next ball and it's causing you to get out of line. If you pick a target for CB to get on the correct ANGLE for next shot then you won't need to use a lot of draw and spin to get back in line.

Interesting... This may just be a slight difference in how we play. I actually didn't get out of line much at all. I'll admit a few shape plays weren't completely as designed, (the 2ball ending in a sewer, and the 3 ball that I used to break out the 4, and I the think the 4 where I needed heavy draw rather than spinning up the rail) but for the most part I landed were I need to, to continue the rack.

That said, I do play for zones and not pin point locations. I'll make the effort to actually point to my desired shape the next time I decide to make another vid.

I'm curious about your comment on using a lot of draw. There were only three situations were I moved the CB with any decent amount of draw, (>1ft). Two of them were within the same rack and done on a whim merely because they offered no chance of coming up badly. The third was the recovery from the 4 to the 5. That was a bail out of sorts, but the pattern intent was the same. I just didnt get to use the long rail.

I do use a lot of siding. That's my game, and it's used to remain in line, not to continually recover.

Your shot making ability is saving you so far but against an advanced player it won't.

Curious what type of score you think an advanced player would post on a 10 ball Ghost set...? I made what I consider two real bad errors in that set. The attempted flyer on the 2 ball that resulted in a sewer. And coming up short on the 4 ball which forced a jump shot. Thank you for the positive comment on my shot making ability, but none of the made shots were honestly all that difficult. Most used rolling english to get to the next ball.

I appreciate the comments... thanks for taking the time

 

[The_JV]

Good shooting with a nice pace and entertaining.

It made me laugh in rack 5 when you tried to get crazy shape on the three with a two railer with the bridge because you didn't like it in the side. Then after it goes bad like those schemes usually do you throw the balls up table and the nine cuts the three right in the side showing how open it really was for that pocket.

It looked like one of the many bad decisions I make every time I play that I see on video later.


Is that an 8 foot table?

Thanks, I was hoping it wasn't too dry....lol

Ya, that shot on the 2 was dumb.... Most certainly not what I would have done if something was on the line. That said, I'm extremely comfortable with a bridge, so that really doesn't factor into the sillyness for me personally. ...and you're going to have to trust me, that the 3 ball shot into the side pocket, might have been 20% at best, if I was inline with it, and at the correct pace I wouldn't have gotten on the 4. The fish eye lens skews what you're seeing a little. Rolling the 2 and taking the rough shot on the 3 to the bottom corner was the right play. On a faster table I could have punched the 2 and gone back an forth.

I knew it was a bad decision well before I pulled the trigger. I just wanted some hero points if I pulled it out....lol

Thanks for the comments... appreciated

 

[Z-Nole]

Good shooting. I'm scared what I would look like if I set up a camera. It would show how much rum I drink know too. My old garage table played like yours- big pockets and dead rails. It got frustrating as hell. I finally got around to putting new rails and cloth on it and trimming the pockets down to under 4.5". I recommend you bite the bullet and do the same. Your future you will thank you! And you will play better too.
But nice shooting dude.

 

[tim913]

Interesting... This may just be a slight difference in how we play. I actually didn't get out of line much at all. I'll admit a few shape plays weren't completely as designed, (the 2ball ending in a sewer, and the 3 ball that I used to break out the 4, and I the think the 4 where I needed heavy draw rather than spinning up the rail) but for the most part I landed were I need to, to continue the rack.

That said, I do play for zones and not pin point locations. I'll make the effort to actually point to my desired shape the next time I decide to make another vid.

I'm curious about your comment on using a lot of draw. There were only three situations were I moved the CB with any decent amount of draw, (>1ft). Two of them were within the same rack and done on a whim merely because they offered no chance of coming up badly. The third was the recovery from the 4 to the 5. That was a bail out of sorts, but the pattern intent was the same. I just didnt get to use the long rail.

I do use a lot of siding. That's my game, and it's used to remain in line, not to continually recover.

Curious what type of score you think an advanced player would post on a 10 ball Ghost set...? I made what I consider two real bad errors in that set. The attempted flyer on the 2 ball that resulted in a sewer. And coming up short on the 4 ball which forced a jump shot. Thank you for the positive comment on my shot making ability, but none of the made shots were honestly all that difficult. Most used rolling english to get to the next ball.

I appreciate the comments... thanks for taking the time

Not saying there's anything wrong with your current game, but everyone can improve. Like I said 'I might be wrong', but it appears you're playing position for your next shot, instead of playing position for the ANGLE for your next shot to get on the next shot. For example it seems like you shoot a ball, get general position for the next ball, and THEN figure out how to move the ball to the next shot and then the process repeats. Let's say I'm shooting the 3 and need to get on the angle for the (4to5). After I shoot the 3 I do not need to then figure out how to get (4to5) that was figured out when I shot the 3 and my CB is already in line to naturally go (4to5). I know I don't explain myself very well but when I got to the level where I could run a few racks I went to a few professionals for their opinion and they ripped me pretty bad but it was what I needed. Your game will have you beating probably 70 to 75 percent of the people you play which is great, maybe more depending on the talent in your area. A few inches out of line doesn't seem like much but against upper levels it will seem like a few feet when the pressure is on.

 

[The_JV]

Good shooting. I'm scared what I would look like if I set up a camera. It would show how much rum I drink know too. My old garage table played like yours- big pockets and dead rails. It got frustrating as hell. I finally got around to putting new rails and cloth on it and trimming the pockets down to under 4.5". I recommend you bite the bullet and do the same. Your future you will thank you! And you will play better too.
But nice shooting dude.

Thanks Nole,

Ya, I really want to just replace the whole table. Not sure how much work it would be for a mechanic to put decent pockets on this one and swap everything out. It got thrown together in a hurry when the covid lockdowns hit our area. Did it for the kids, but I play on it more than anyone...lol

 

[The_JV]

Not saying there's anything wrong with your current game, but everyone can improve. Like I said 'I might be wrong', but it appears you're playing position for your next shot, instead of playing position for the ANGLE for your next shot to get on the next shot. For example it seems like you shoot a ball, get general position for the next ball, and THEN figure out how to move the ball to the next shot and then the process repeats. Let's say I'm shooting the 3 and need to get on the angle for the (4to5). After I shoot the 3 I do not need to then figure out how to get (4to5) that was figured out when I shot the 3 and my CB is already in line to naturally go (4to5). I know I don't explain myself very well but when I got to the level where I could run a few racks I went to a few professionals for their opinion and they ripped me pretty bad but it was what I needed. Your game will have you beating probably 70 to 75 percent of the people you play which is great, maybe more depending on the talent in your area. A few inches out of line doesn't seem like much but against upper levels it will seem like a few feet when the pressure is on.

You're explaining yourself perfectly fine, no worries.

Maybe what I should do, is stall a few moments between the break shot and starting the rack so I have the time to explain how the pattern will play out. If the commentary was live with the action I think it would be more clear to what my intent is. I'm incredibly new with the voice over stuff and was continually worried I would ramble to much...lol. I'll make it a point to describe the intented pattern. I can say that in the posted set, I was only scrambling twice. The bad shape on the 2 ball, and the awkward situation with the side pocket cluster.

I'm what's kindly known as a "deliberate" player. I take my time as I work through a table. This may be misconstruted as recalculateing, but for the most part that's not the case.

Thanks again, for the comments.

 

[smoochie]

So here is the my most recent attempt at the 10 ball Ghost that I have also posted within the "Ghost Challenge" thread. There typically isn't much conversation within that thread about a person's game (or lack there of...lol), so I thought I'd openly request criticism from the forum and see what input others may have on my game.

Feel free to make any remarks you wish. I can take it... Thanks and enjoy...

Solid overall.

Smooth stroke, nice and decent follow through, also nice and decent pull back on final stroke, I really like it because its a mix of not too long and not too punchy.

Very nice positional play, also very nice potting ability. I can tell you've been playing for a very long time if not since you were a little kid.

Those pockets seem a little big, what are their size? But even on smaller pocket you will still play as good I will reckon.

Final thought for improvement, if you get back issues on long session of play then this comment and suggestion may help you, but if you are not getting back issues then ignore this comment. Your form overall is decent and some people may call it textbook but I always disagree because we don't play snooker. I noted that your back leg is straight just like snooker players however this is not efficient in pool, but again if you're not having backpain then ignore this comment and again if you are actual having back pain then this is the reason and I swear I've seen it over and over during my life with pool player. Most of them want to straighten this back leg for god knows why, properly they love watching snooker and in their mind they think that making the back leg straight is cool and how it is suppose to be.

However, in pool I always advocate bending both knees - even if slightly it will help and your back will thank you. Think of deadlifts and how you will help the back by bending both knees, it's the same.

Again if your back is fine, then keep doing your stance and form its fine, but if you got back problems then bend both knees, give that a try! at first you may feel something is different but with time this will help you play even longer session with zero back pain.

To get a good look at how you suppose to bend both legs/knees, check Earl Strickland or SVB, or Neils Fejien or even Efren Reyes, all of them bend both knees and it is how people should stand for the benefit of their backs.

 

[Z-Nole]

Same for me- the table was for the kids but I enjoyed the heck out of it. The guy who did it for me was local and took the rails one day. A few weeks later he came over and put it back together. And I really enjoy it. At first I didn't like the pockets being under 4.5" but since it's only an 8' table it's actually perfect. And I've noticed my one hole game on the 9' is actually tightened up a bit.
It was a little expensive but the table is now perfect for only a grande.

 

[JC]

Thanks, I was hoping it wasn't too dry....lol

Ya, that shot on the 2 was dumb.... Most certainly not what I would have done if something was on the line. That said, I'm extremely comfortable with a bridge, so that really doesn't factor into the sillyness for me personally. ...and you're going to have to trust me, that the 3 ball shot into the side pocket, might have been 20% at best, if I was inline with it, and at the correct pace I wouldn't have gotten on the 4. The fish eye lens skews what you're seeing a little. Rolling the 2 and taking the rough shot on the 3 to the bottom corner was the right play. On a faster table I could have punched the 2 and gone back an forth.

I knew it was a bad decision well before I pulled the trigger. I just wanted some hero points if I pulled it out....lol

Thanks for the comments... appreciated

What made me chuckle is that I know the 3 was tough but the ghost was rubbing it in when you cleared the table and threw the nine ball up table and it made a perfect cut in the side: Here

 

[The_JV]

Solid overall.

Smooth stroke, nice and decent follow through, also nice and decent pull back on final stroke, I really like it because its a mix of not too long and not too punchy.

Very nice positional play, also very nice potting ability. I can tell you've been playing for a very long time if not since you were a little kid.

Those pockets seem a little big, what are their size? But even on smaller pocket you will still play as good I will reckon.

Final thought for improvement, if you get back issues on long session of play then this comment and suggestion may help you, but if you are not getting back issues then ignore this comment. Your form overall is decent and some people may call it textbook but I always disagree because we don't play snooker. I noted that your back leg is straight just like snooker players however this is not efficient in pool, but again if you're not having backpain then ignore this comment and again if you are actual having back pain then this is the reason and I swear I've seen it over and over during my life with pool player. Most of them want to straighten this back leg for god knows why, properly they love watching snooker and in their mind they think that making the back leg straight is cool and how it is suppose to be.

However, in pool I always advocate bending both knees - even if slightly it will help and your back will thank you. Think of deadlifts and how you will help the back by bending both knees, it's the same.

Again if your back is fine, then keep doing your stance and form its fine, but if you got back problems then bend both knees, give that a try! at first you may feel something is different but with time this will help you play even longer session with zero back pain.

To get a good look at how you suppose to bend both legs/knees, check Earl Strickland or SVB, or Neils Fejien or even Efren Reyes, all of them bend both knees and it is how people should stand for the benefit of their backs.

Thanks for the kind words.... Yep been playing in some form for nearly 35yrs. Cut my teeth playing snooker, as you can tell with the stance. ...and nope, no back issues. If anything more so my left shoulder. I tend to load up my upper body weight on my bridge arm, so if I don't make the habit of resting my fore arm on the table for a while, my shoulder tires.

The corner pockets are a tiny hair under 5" from point to point. That said, the points are flared (common cut for home brew tables unless ordered otherwise), so that 5" number is smaller within the jaws. Not sure on the side pockets. Probably the same. I'm the type of shooter that picks zones within pockets, so a tighter table doesn't hurt me to much in rotation games. I enjoy the extra breathing room when playing 14.1

Same for me- the table was for the kids but I enjoyed the heck out of it. The guy who did it for me was local and took the rails one day. A few weeks later he came over and put it back together. And I really enjoy it. At first I didn't like the pockets being under 4.5" but since it's only an 8' table it's actually perfect. And I've noticed my one hole game on the 9' is actually tightened up a bit.
It was a little expensive but the table is now perfect for only a grande.

This table was originally a gift from my mom to my father. He just wasn't getting the use out of it anymore, and wanted the floor space. He gave it to me and I had it in pieces for a couple of years. The intent was to refinish it completely during assembly, but again, the covid joy rushed me into whipping it together before I had the time to do it right.

I think you asked earlier... it's a 9fter. Fish eye camera is probably messing up the perspective.

What made me chuckle is that I know the 3 was tough but the ghost was rubbing it in when you cleared the table and threw the nine ball up table and it made a perfect cut in the side: Here

oh ya.. didn't notice that....lol That is funny

 

[Hits 'em Hard]

Playing on a home table doesn’t teach you proper routes. Doesn’t matter if you feel you’re in line or not. A couple of your harder hit shots could have been avoided with better route selection.

 

[sjm]

... it appears you're playing position for your next shot, instead of playing position for the ANGLE for your next shot to get on the next shot ...

This is how I see it, too. You're a classy player, JV, but I also feel that your angle management isn't quite as well conceived as it might be, and that's why when you miss speed, you're leaving awkward positions more often than you should.

In one sense, your position play is very aggressive, in that you are playing pretty close to the object ball and when you get what you have in mind, you are nearly always finding yourself on the right side of the ball and maintaining a good pattern. In another sense, however, you aren't always playing the longest lines into the correct side of the ball, and if you tidy it up, minor errors in speed control won't leave you on the wrong side of the ball as often.

Still, on balance, I'd say well played. You have a strong game.

 

[smoochie]

Thanks for the kind words.... Yep been playing in some form for nearly 35yrs. Cut my teeth playing snooker, as you can tell with the stance. ...and nope, no back issues. If anything more so my left shoulder. I tend to load up my upper body weight on my bridge arm, so if I don't make the habit of resting my fore arm on the table for a while, my shoulder tires.

The corner pockets are a tiny hair under 5" from point to point. That said, the points are flared (common cut for home brew tables unless ordered otherwise), so that 5" number is smaller within the jaws. Not sure on the side pockets. Probably the same. I'm the type of shooter that picks zones within pockets, so a tighter table doesn't hurt me to much in rotation games. I enjoy the extra breathing room when playing 14.1

Oh a snooker background, that explains the stance and yes I can clearly tell if you noted already...but since no backpain then ofcourse ignore all what I said and keep at it!! really nice shooting buddy.

Also as I said smaller pockets will never hurt you I could tell that you were picking exactly which side of the pocket to pot the ball.

 

[The_JV]

Playing on a home table doesn’t teach you proper routes. Doesn’t matter if you feel you’re in line or not. A couple of your harder hit shots could have been avoided with better route selection.

Please if you have the time or inclination, point out which shots specifically and your suggestion on how to play them differently. Not questioning your input, but rather have the info to consider when approaching patterns in the future.

thanks for the comment

 

[The_JV]

This is how I see it, too. You're a classy player, JV, but I also feel that your angle management isn't quite as well conceived as it might be, and that's why when you miss speed, you're leaving awkward positions more often than you should.

In one sense, your position play is very aggressive, in that you are playing pretty close to the object ball and when you get what you have in mind, you are nearly always finding yourself on the right side of the ball and maintaining a good pattern. In another sense, however, you aren't always playing the longest lines into the correct side of the ball, and if you tidy it up, minor errors in speed control won't leave you on the wrong side of the ball as often.

Still, on balance, I'd say well played. You have a strong game.

Thanks for the comments...

Now that you've 2nd tim's thoughts, I'm really wondering if I'm playing way differently then some on the forum. I really didn't think things went too badly in that set. Granted I did mess up a few times, but only once did I end up in spot that wasn't completely manageable, (hook on the 4). I know the shot on that 2 looks reaaaaal bad, but that really isn't something I would do under normal circumstances, and was more of a "hold my beer" moment...lol. That shot was the only bad decision and the rest of the set seemed clean to me so I thought I'd open myself to the criticism knowing it would be a point of focus.

What I thought some might take away from the video, was even when I wasn't perfect on the next shot, I nearly always had an totally resonable option. That's honestly the way I play the game. Not "I need to be here", but more so "what do I have if I don't get it here".

I realize I move the CB differently than most. I just hope that viewers aren't preceiving my style of play as bad because it doesn't follow the norm.

Thanks again Stu. Your thoughts are well received

 

[sparkle84]

I'm going to have to watch it again because overall I didn't see many position route errors. I would have noticed I think because that's a main focus when I watch these things. I saw a few questionable decisions in your 14.1 videos but not much in the 10ball. Maybe the people critiquing aren't totally aware of the difficulties of that table.
The fact that you ran over 100 twice within a couple week period on that table is absolutely amazing to me. I'll watch it again and report back on anything that I find questionable.

 

[The_JV]

I'm going to have to watch it again because overall I didn't see many position route errors. I would have noticed I think because that's a main focus when I watch these things. I saw a few questionable decisions in your 14.1 videos but not much in the 10ball. Maybe the people critiquing aren't totally aware of the difficulties of that table.
The fact that you ran over 100 twice within a couple week period on that table is absolutely amazing to me. I'll watch it again and report back on anything that I find questionable.

Thanks for chiming in

Ya, I did add a few comments about the table condition and space limitations in the vid. They do factor in to my pattern play, but that reasoning is probably transparent to the viewers.

I play 14.1 in a very aggressive manner, so I don't doubt that my decision making in that game is suspect...lol. Glad I got the second century on video. Hopefully I'll find the time to do a voice over as to explain my questionable choices