526 consecutive balls

You DID see the 'wink' emoji,right?? Being facetious. I saw/met WM twice. He seemed ok but wrapped way too tight. As for cues, i'm sure he signed a bunch of them saying this-n-that about them. That stuff has gone on in all sports forever.
Joe DiMaggio was very similar to Mosconi in temperament. Both guys were super serious competitors- they both defined the sports slogan" he had the will to win" - unfortunately both guys carried that competitive nature over to dealings with folks in everyday life - much too serious.

I had a very unfortunate incident with DiMaggio once, my meeting with Mosconi was a little better- but he was not "Mr. Personality" either. Phil Esposito - the hockey great was a much nicer guy to be around than the other two paisans :)
 
sjm said:
"When Willie continued his 526 ball run, he continued past 100 as a favor to his friend who had arranged the exhibition."
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Not literally accurate as to the reason Willie continued past 100. He had to continue to shoot past 100 in order to reach the prearranged 200-point limit (set by room owner and friend, George Rood) at which the match was set. After having officially won -- as everyone knows he was heartily urged, by all in attendance, to continue shooting. Here are the record run circumstances according to notable billiards historian and former Chairperson of the BCA Statistics and Records Committee, Mike Shamos:
------------------------------------------------------------------
"The following facts can be established through contemporaneous
evidence: On March 19, 1954 at the East High Billiard Club in
Springfield, Ohio, Mosconi played an announced exhibition against Earl
J. Bruney, a local Springfield player. (Usually Mosconi advertised in
advance that he was going to give an exhibition but it was up to the
local room to determine who his opponent would be.) Mosconi beat
Bruney, 200-3
, in the exhibition on an 8-foot Brunswick table. The
length of his unfinished run was not recorded, but he was urged to
continue. After approximately two additional hours, he reached 526 and
missed a shot. It is also not recorded what type of shot he missed on,
and recollections of various people are contradictory on this point.

At least 36 people were present at the end of the run, since they
signed a statement attesting to the run on the stationery of the East
High Billiard Club. The Billiard Archive has a copy of this document.
It is signed by, among 35 others, "Earl J. Bruney (opponent)". Howard
Barrett did not sign it. This does not mean he wasn't there, just that
he may have had his reasons for not signing.

While Barrett says in the current Pool & Billiard Magazine that
Mosconi ended his regulation game with a run of only 33, I consider it
unlikely (but not impossible) in view of the fact that Bruney only
scored 3 points. Mosconi always promised the room owner that he would
run 100 in an exhibition. If he did not run 100 on his way to a total
of 200
, and his last run was 33, he must have taken at least three
innings and probably more. That means Bruney would have had at least
two chances to shoot and we would expect him to score more than 3
points. It is more likely that Mosconi broke for Bruney, Bruney ran 3
and then Mosconi ran 200. He felt in the zone, and so was persuaded to
continue to try to break his previous record of 365, which he set in
Wilmington, NC in 1953. (This paragraph is just speculation.)

The New York Times reported the story on March 21, 1954. The BCA
recognized the run as an exhibition high run several days after it
occurred. The requirement for exhibition high runs back then was that
the run must have occurred in an announced exhibition on a table
satisfying BCA specifications and been witnessed. The reason for
requiring announcement in advance is so the public, and especially the
press, are notified and have a chance to attend. If the exhibition is
not announced, but is made known only to close friends of the player,
you can imagine that all sorts of questionable records would be
claimed. There is no category of BCA record for practice runs, since
these do not occur in a competitive situation and are usually not
witnessed. There are several stories of practice runs in the 700s.
Whether or not they occurred, they are not records.

Later in his life, Mosconi, apparently too proud to admit that he
ever missed a shot (admittedly a rare event), started telling people
that he just got tired and put his cue down, and so it is written in
his (auto)biography, "Willie's Game." But it's just not true.

Much has been made of the fact that the run of 526 was made on an
8-foot table. However, I have never seen a convincing argument that
such a run is easier on an 8-foot table than on a 9-footer. While the
shots are shorter on a smaller table, the chance of the balls getting
tied up is greater, particularly right after a break shot. There is no
question that such a run is easier on an 8 or 9-foot table than on a
10-foot table. (Straight pool high run on a 10-foot table: 309.
Amazingly, this record was set by Crane and TIED by Mosconi.)

The story surrounding Mike Eufemia's claimed run of 625 is very
complicated. The upshot is that it is not recognized by the BCA
because it did not meet the standards for an exhibition high run
record."
Mike Shamos
Chairperson, BCA Statistics and Records Committee

----------------------------------------------------------------------
My Source for the mention of the above statement by Mr. Shamos is:

http://untoldstoriesbilliardshistory.blogspot.com/2010/04/willie-mosconis-high-run.html

Arnaldo ~ Essentially Willie ran 326 more balls after his 200-ball run within the exhibition match itself.
The way I read it, everything after the location and date are guesses, assumptions and opinion.

But I am in no way suggesting he didn’t run 526 that day...the details seem to have faded. Mosconi wrote that there were over 300 spectators...

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I was in Chicago around early 70s at the US Open. In between matches I'm in the arena area and Cue Ball Kelly is brushing a table. While talking he makes the comment, a few weeks earlier he was racking balls for Babe Cranfield and he ran 411. Thinking about that I went looking for something on Cranfield and found this.

 
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Second, yes, I believe running balls is harder on the nine footer than on the eight footer. I've played my share of straight pool on both and found it harder on the nine footer. Of course, others may have had a different experience. but this is the first time I've heard anyone on AZB suggest that it's not easier on the eight footer. That said, it's definitely a matter of opinion.
Of course you know, Stu, that it was Shamos doing the "suggesting" (within his comments) on AZB and not myself.

With regard to folks who have experienced 14.1 to be easier on nine-footer (as I have also), think of navigating your car thru very crowded traffic as one scenario, then in a second scenario think of the other cars now more comfortably spaced apart as you work your way thru. Or in a less accident-conjuring way, working your way forward on a less crowded NYC street when you're late for an appointment. Easier to weave around the idiots who stand immovably chatting with each other in the middle of a sidewalk as folks necessarily weave around them.

In the old-style 14.1 we grew up on, as your skills progressed in emulation of the masters, you were essentially playing on a 4 1/2 x 4 1/2 table with good short position play.

Arnaldo
 
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Now you’re just showing us you don’t have a clue. I think I remember reading he used a Rambo. That’s a little nicer than a valley, right?
Oh you must be talking about the carbon fiber and the CNC machines that they used to build Willy's Q...right.

Over the last couple decades cue technology has not gotten any better in your world I guess.

Troll
 
You guessed it, here are the tips I just up on my cues tonight.

Plus tips I guess have not gotten any better over the last couple decades either.
 

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You guessed it, here are the tips I just up on my cues tonight.

Plus tips I guess have not gotten any better over the last couple decades either.
French champion and Chendavert were as good as anything today. Add to that players knew how to modify their tips to their liking. Every pool room had a file on a chain hanging on the wall.
 
Oh you must be talking about the carbon fiber and the CNC machines that they used to build Willy's Q...right.

Over the last couple decades cue technology has not gotten any better in your world I guess.

Troll
But what you said was that Mosconi had poor equipment. You weren't making a point about carbon fiber or any advancements in the last 70 years...you tried to say Mosconi had a junk cue.

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Oh you must be talking about the carbon fiber and the CNC machines that they used to build Willy's Q...right.

Over the last couple decades cue technology has not gotten any better in your world I guess.

Troll

The only thing cnc has done for cues is ease of repeatability and helped break the mold in inlay. Measurement has been capable of high tolerance long before cnc was invented. Carbon fiber is only a better material due to less waste of material due to culling.


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With regard to folks who have experienced 14.1 to be easier on nine-footer (as I have also), think of navigating your car thru very crowded traffic as one scenario, then in a second scenario think of the other cars now more comfortably spaced apart as you work your way thru. Or in a less accident-conjuring way, working your way forward on a less crowded NYC street when you're late for an appointment. Easier to weave around the idiots who stand immovably chatting with each other in the middle of a sidewalk as folks necessarily weave around them.

In the old-style 14.1 we grew up on, as your skills progressed in emulation of the masters, you were essentially playing on a 4 1/2 x 4 1/2 table with good short position play.

Arnaldo
In our local club, they always do the 14.1 high-run challenge on the 8 foot table. The owner said that it makes it easier and more people will enter.
 
That's like trying to convince me the Belgium Browning's of the years ago are the same quality as a Benelli guns they build today....
Sure 🙄🙄🙄
 
That's like trying to convince me the Belgium Browning's of the years ago are the same quality as a Benelli guns they build today....
Sure 🙄🙄🙄
There is progress in everything, pool would be no exception. Who knows, Crane and Mosconi today may be playing with CF cues. Cues aside, the biggest difference is probably the equipment in general as well as the environment. I remember old time players telling about what it was like before air conditioning. The lighting was often bad, cloth different, balls different, rails different. The old T-rail tables often no two rails would bounce the same and actually change over time.

One old timer told a funny story of playing in an national tournament and they had windows open. About dusk swarms of gnats came in attracted by the lights over the tables. Before they could get the windows closed it was too late. The balls were rolling over them on the tables.
They always liked talking about playing in the summer with wet towel around their necks. While powder is kind of traditional around a pool room, there was a time it was an essential.

Check out picture 1, it looks like a tournament is going on. You think there is a shadow or two around those balls.
Picture 2 looks like a pool room where you or I may have played back then. I can just feel the balls skidding looking at the picture. How about those lights. you had to be part owl to play in there.
Picture 3, Imagine this guy on a new Diamond table
Today things, at least pool wise are defiantly better.
 

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That's like trying to convince me the Belgium Browning's of the years ago are the same quality as a Benelli guns they build today....
Sure

No actually it isn’t at all. I see you don’t know much about guns or cues. Give me just one way that carbon fiber makes a better playing cue than wood does that’s not subjective.

Life of service is also in question here. We have plenty of proof how long traditional cues can hold up.


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That's like trying to convince me the Belgium Browning's of the years ago are the same quality as a Benelli guns they build today....
Sure
It seems trying to tell you anything at all is a non starter


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It seems trying to tell you anything at all is a non starter


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And I'm sure Simonis has never upgrade their cloth over the last three centuries. Same cloth, they never found a better production standard.
🙄🙄🙄
 
It
Joe DiMaggio was very similar to Mosconi in temperament. Both guys were super serious competitors- they both defined the sports slogan" he had the will to win" - unfortunately both guys carried that competitive nature over to dealings with folks in everyday life - much too serious.

I had a very unfortunate incident with DiMaggio once, my meeting with Mosconi was a little better- but he was not "Mr. Personality" either. Phil Esposito - the hockey great was a much nicer guy to be around than the other two paisans
According to Mike Shamos, Willie went for high runs at some point. In 1953 he had a 322 (Platteville, Wisconsin) and then a 365 (Wilmington, North Carolina). In 1954 was his 526. So it definitely wasn’t just one night in Springfield, OH.
If Jean Balukas had competed with the men she could be a record holder but never told anyone because of the pool culture against her.

ah, no.

Lou Figueroa
 
I think we all give passes to people with eccentricities who we regard as doing things at a genius level. In a sense they have earned it. What the have can't be bought.

This is true.

Mosconi was a prima dona and a savant. He lived under the constant pressure of being Willie Mosconi. I once read about a guy taking his son to one of Mosconi’s exhibitions and telling him beforehand: Son, you’re about to see the greatest pool player who ever lived and he’s going to run 100 balls.

I’m sorry but I don’t know who could always, day-in-day-out, be on an even keel with those kinds of expectations and constant pressure.

Lou Figueroa
 
Oh you must be talking about the carbon fiber and the CNC machines that they used to build Willy's Q...right.

Over the last couple decades cue technology has not gotten any better in your world I guess.

Troll
And a Rambo is less than a Valley bar box cue in your world? Sorry your world sucks.
 
Mosconi . . . lived under the constant pressure of being Willie Mosconi.
Absolutely true, and your mention of Mosconi & pressure, reminded me that the pressure cut both ways, as beautifully exemplified when I read -- years ago -- one my favorite, widely publicized anecdotes about Willie. His unwittingly amusing (and more than a little arrogant) response that our mutually-beloved and always supremely confident Mosconi gave to a popular sports reporter during a Straight Pool final's pre-match interview.

Willie was asked whether he felt some pressure at the moment. Mosconi replied:

"Pressure? Oh no, never! I leave that feeling for the other guy . . .

. . . I only have to play pool -- he has to play Mosconi."

Arnaldo ~ True story
 
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