Dave told me when they made that vid, to watch for one cross side bank on the 9 (don't remember the time mark) where you can see a very slight "bump" in the tape. Was the only shot on the whole video that Dave had to repeat for edit.
Matlock.................
- Thread starter garczar
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phreaticus
Well-known member
There’s a few AZB threads with some breif stories & articles on the “Faceless Man”, but pretty slim pickings. Was hoping the gentleman that said he knew Elliot well might chime in with some new tales. This thread has some good tidbits on Elliot, Willis, Crane, etc
Where can you even find tables that have that mud ball? Seems like it was phased out 20 years ago
The good sneakarounds carried the ball with them and replaced it in the tables before asking to play.
Sneaky! Would it get stuck in the tray after scratches?
phreaticus
Well-known member
Funny timing. I just recently played in a dive bar that had a few beater Valleys with true old school filthy chipped up mud balls. First time for me seeing them since the late 80’s. Great fun, except the nutter I was bumping heads with played super strong 9b, one rack broke 6 balls in, including the 5, with $40 on the 5 & 9. 9b/6b on a coin op barbox took me back to teen years for sure. We were both feeing pretty good and I jokingly asked him if his name was David Matlock and just got a blank look back.
How did the table roll? Was it relatively level? How were the cushions? I’ve encountered some barboxes that are so beat up that they are basically unplayable.
I essentially learned how to play pool on barboxes with a mud ball back in the 90s. Other than the difficulty with draw shots, I can’t remember the impact on play- does it result in thicker or thinner cut shots? I want to say thinner, but again it’s been so long- I can’t really remember
I run into them once in a blue moon now. Usually an old place where the owner owns a table or two. I still use a lot of follow so when I find a big or heavy cue ball it gives me a big jump on those whose game is built around draw. If you could shoot near table length shots and draw or even stop the mud ball you got people's attention.
Six ball was the reason I hated nine ball on a bar box. My eight and nine ball breaks were strong, my six ball break much weaker. I hated winning nine ball only to give the money back playing six ball. Funny thing, I played a few places that played the six ball game first and it didn't annoy me nearly as bad! I used to rack ten balls and play by nine ball rules just to get out of having six balls left sometimes. I was still better than 50-50 playing six ball but all of the bad things on the break giving the other player an easy out were annoying. Did I mention I freaking hated six ball?!?
Hu
phreaticus
Well-known member
Tables were total beaters, dead rails, ripped cloth, huge bucket pockets. the whole deal. Fat heavy CB, just hard to draw & hop. Banking seemed off & everything seemed cuttable. Other than that, its just pool!
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phreaticus
Well-known member
Blasphemy! 9b+6b, $ on the 5,9 & 15. Two racks of rotation & 3 money balls for the quarters - best barbox game there is. String racks together like a pro, good therapy
6b, 10b, 8b - all the same triangle break to me - smack the head ball as square & hard as possible, mudball helps actually. Of course I prefer big clean tables, but dive bar pool has its own sweet charms!
Blasphemy! 9b+6b, $ on the 5,9 & 15. Two racks of rotation & 3 money balls for the quarters - best barbox game there is. String racks together like a pro, good therapy
6b, 10b, 8b - all the same triangle break to me - smack the head ball as square & hard as possible, mudball helps actually. Of course I prefer big clean tables, but dive bar pool has its own sweet charms!
Dive bars were my second home in the seventies and eighties!
Hu
Fer. Gutierrez.
Registered
Some folks keep confusing the 'mudball' with the big cueball. TOTALLY different critters altogether. Mudball is standard size with a lot of magnetic particles mixed in with the phenolic. Like playing with a giant wad of hard, heavy bubblegum. Deader than HulaHoop. Big ball is exactly that, BIGGER. They require completely different strokes and approaches to running out. Tulsa legend Fat Randy Wallace liked the mudrock on little Valley's. Matlock could/can play with one but his forte is the ABSOLUTE mastery of the large agate. Dave is a near world-class 3c player and has an extremely potent stroke which is perfect for his brand of sorcery.
Here is the thread for you to read: https://forums.azbilliards.com/threads/el-diablo-v-el-mundo.543733/
There were many bar table cue balls. There was a heavy standard sized cue ball, one with a big chunk of metal in it, one that had a layer of foil near the surface to react to the magnet, and the oversized cue ball. The oversized cue ball was the one we called the mudball for the simple reason it was off white. It didn't look too bad by itself but put it next to a white cue ball and it looked light brown. Not nearly as dark as the old break balls but clearly not white.
When the off color ball almost disappeared some people called the heavy cue ball a mudball. These were standard size but had a chunk of metal in them. One I saw broken had what looked like a section of heavy tubing or light pipe that reached almost side to side of the cue ball and might have been about one inch ID working from memory. If this piece of metal was out of place in the slightest the ball would be off balance. As close as the ends of the metal were to the surface, the phenolic flexing differently than the metal would be an issue too, what caused some of these balls to eventually break I believe.
The six dollar cue ball had the chunk of metal in it, I have been told the twenty dollar cue ball has the metal foil in it. Metal flecks seems like a reasonable approach but I haven't seen a ball that claimed to be made that way.
Big track players who were used to a cue ball that reacted the same as the other balls hated the mud ball. It didn't draw well at all. Those that simply accepted the mud ball for what it was learned to base their cue ball game on follow more than draw. The eight hundred pound gorilla, as I referred to the mud ball, was very predictable after contact with other balls, more predictable than other cue balls that might weigh slightly less than the object balls.
I accepted the mud ball for what it was and came to like it. I have heard Keith McCready liked it also. Definitely gave a little edge over big track exclusively players if you got them on the short track with a mud ball!
Hu
Canelo. He was a great player! He played Sammy Soto in the early 90"s on a bar box. He ran the 1st four racks then Sammy ran the next 4 then they both decided to call it quits since they didn't think they were going to get anywhere with eath other.
Then they became really good friends.