Anyone still use a SS joint?

[overlord]

When I ordered that cue in 1984, players were using cues that were mid-19 ozs and heavier. 20 and 21 oz. cues
were common. The pool tables of the 60’s and 70’s, remember I started playing in 1960-61, used different cloths
than today. The tables played slower and I don’t know much about the elasticity of the rubber used for the rails.

It just seemed like it took more stroke to move the cue ball around. My Runde Schon weighs 20.5 ozs but I would
adjusr my grip and reposition my hand for the shot based on any English I might want to use. One thing I learned
real fast. My follow, stop, stun and draw strokes were better than with a lighter cue, However, horizontal English
suffered versus a lighter cue that was fine using vertical English but far superior applying horizontal English. 2 ozs.
wt. difference is huge to my way of thinking. Maybe if my cue was 18.5 ozs., rather than 20.5 ozs., I’d still use it.

Many pros are playing with extensions on these days and that adds weight to the cue.

I believe Fedor plays with like 18 ounces.

I play with a 20.50 ounce cue that is 66 inches long.

When I first started playing with an extension the cue was 22 ounces and I got used to it very fast.

Then I realized there was a 1.5 ounce weight bolt in the Mezz butt.

So I took it out. The Mezz is a cheap cue ( but high quality, Axi series ) with a big pin, plastic collared wood joint and the extension is carbon fiber and aluminum.

I've got the Ignite shaft so the cue is All Japan.

All my custom cues are in the closet.

Once I got used to the extra length a 58 inch cue feels like a toothpick.

 

[fuggles]

I've been playing almost 20 years with my Schon. Love it. I like the feel of SS. And I use a hard tip.

 

[NobodySpecial]

Of my 40 cues, exactly half are SS joints. Some are the compression-type SS joints.

It does seem like most of my newer cues have something besides SS. Not ivory, but white plasticky stuff.

 

[smiling_Hans]

Many pros are playing with extensions on these days and that adds weight to the cue.

I believe Fedor plays with like 18 ounces.

I play with a 20.50 ounce cue that is 66 inches long.

When I first started playing with an extension the cue was 22 ounces and I got used to it very fast.

Then I realized there was a 1.5 ounce weight bolt in the Mezz butt.

So I took it out. The Mezz is a cheap cue ( but high quality, Axi series ) with a big pin, plastic collared wood joint and the extension is carbon fiber and aluminum.

I've got the Ignite shaft so the cue is All Japan.

All my custom cues are in the closet.

Once I got used to the extra length a 58 inch cue feels like a toothpick.

Brilliantly put.

Once I got the complete Mezz starter kit as I like to call it. We’re talking about Mezz everything. Cue, breaking, and all the accessories, the customs are collecting dust.

I will miss the custom world. I will collect them but from now on I will get a custom build around low deflection shafts.

Basically send XYZ cue builder some mezz shafts and tell him to build a nice butt for it. LOL

In competition, it’s hard to take an opponent seriously is he’s playing with old sticks or fancy customs. Low deflection cues are just at another level.

Now I know how it feels when tennis player went from wood to synthetic rackets. More power and control. It changed the game.

There are little nuances that come with carbon fiber that non-converters will have to learn. I finally figured out everything about my mezz. Took almost 3 weeks to learn how to shoot with it.

 

[smiling_Hans]

This is the post revolution of the custom cue world. Ditch the wood shafts from production. Hook up with a supplier or just focus on butts.

You’re now at the mercy of new technology. I don’t want to pay the full cost of a cue.

I just want a nice butt without the shafts that most people are stuck with. All those horrible 13mm shafts that accompany this beautiful cues in the for sale section.

I’ve actually asked many if they would just sell me the butt.

 

[Bavafongoul]

Close to, yes. Every cue I ordered is 19oz.

Most of my 3/8-10 have a fairly muted hit, which I always loved. The Schulers have an even more muted hit. Ray did all the right things.

That said, my Tasc isn’t muted. It sings. First cue I can ever say that. So totally different feel. The most muted is the Schuler, which is not 3/8-10 flat faced. Tascarella on the other hand has the most amazing feedback.

Getting your cues to be close to 19 ozs. Is a smart approach for consistency. However, consistency is largely
dependent on how it breaks down into shafts and cue butts. For example, if all the butts were 15 ozs., which
would normally require a custom build unless the cue maker cheats by relying on a weight bolt, & all the shafts
we’re 4 ozs., that would be a much fairer test. A butt wt of 15 ozs. with a shaft wt. of 4 ozs. is different than a
15.6 oz. butt with a 3.4 oz. shaft. I’ve stressed this point for years the weight proportionality of the butt & shaft
is an important feature. I’ve never had a top name cue maker disagree with me because each of them uses it.

 

[smiling_Hans]

Getting your cues to be close to 19 ozs. Is a smart approach for consistency. However, consistency is largely
dependent on how it breaks down into shafts and cue butts. For example, if all the butts were 15 ozs., which
would normally require a custom build unless the cue maker cheats by relying on a weight bolt, & all the shafts
we’re 4 ozs., that would be a much fairer test. A butt wt of 15 ozs. with a shaft wt. of 4 ozs. is different than a
15.6 oz. butt with a 3.4 oz. shaft. I’ve stressed this point for years the weight proportionality of the butt & shaft
is an important feature. I’ve never had a top name cue maker disagree with me because each of them uses it.

I get what you are saying with consistency but the joy of ownership is the personality of each cue. I don’t want to shoot with the same specs. It is essentially having a bunch of the same cues.

I like to pull out a cue and play to its characteristics. Keeps the monotony out of my shooting.

 

[DJKeys]

I played with compression steel joint Tascarella cues for years. My last Tasc I played with for 8 years alone. I ordered a new cue from Pete about a year ago (should be here soon) and sold my 8 year old playing Tasc, so I needed something to play with until my new one arrives (couldn't really afford to keep two High-End cues). I bought a Mezz EC 9 and ordered an Ignite shaft. I would have never done this in the past, but the consensus seemed to be that Mezz was a good bet for a production cue. With Mezz weight bolts, I got the cue and shaft to exactly 19.25 ounces and it is a great player. The EC 9 with the WX Sigma and Ignite was around $1200, not cheap, but certainly not expensive. Live and learn-

-dj

 

[smiling_Hans]

I played with compression steel joint Tascarella cues for years. My last Tasc I played with for 8 years alone. I ordered a new cue from Pete about a year ago (should be here soon) and sold my 8 year old playing Tasc, so I needed something to play with until my new one arrives (couldn't really afford to keep two High-End cues). I bought a Mezz EC 9 and ordered an Ignite shaft. I would have never done this in the past, but the consensus seemed to be that Mezz was a good bet for a production cue. With Mezz weight bolts, I got the cue and shaft to exactly 19.25 ounces and it is a great player. The EC 9 with the WX Sigma and Ignite was around $1200, not cheap, but certainly not expensive. Live and learn-

-dj

I have a mezz ignite. Since you are a Tasc shooter how does it compare to his shafts. I know they are two different materials but how do they play. Not so concern with carbon vs wood. More of how Tasc shafts play.

I’m thinking about ditching his shafts and sending him a couple carbons and tell them to build to it.

 

[DJKeys]

I have a mezz ignite. Since you are a Tasc shooter how does it compare to his shafts. I know they are two different materials but how do they play. Not so concern with carbon vs wood. More of how Tasc shafts play.

I’m thinking about ditching his shafts and sending him a couple carbons and tell them to build to it.

I wouldn't ditch his shafts. They are probably one of the best maple shafts available. They have good feedback and feel, though not low deflection at all. Two shafts are always included with Tascarella cues, so just get them and sell them if you want.

 

[grindz]

I've been playing with a JW, with a SS joint for almost 40 years. I'm used to it, and
can't think of a reason to change. I have other cues that have been added to the 'stable'
for whatever reason, and they are each just different from my JW... and don't get played
much because my primary feels like home.

td

 

[grindz]

Wood to wood has more power….7 to 12% more according to Iron Willy….so my snooker cues and carom cues were always wood to wood….I knew it by feel long before Alan McCarty gave those stats.
But my two favorite pool cues are SS…..I hate the hit of ivory…but I had a Tad with an ivory ferrule that broke great.

Interesting how UK snooker players all seem to play 1 piece cues, and 3c as well as N. American players
use 2 piece cues. Is that all just a cultural thing, or is there a real power diff.? Just curious.

td

 

[Chembry]

The two cues I play the most with have SS joints. One is a mid to late 90's Lambros and the other is an Ariel Carmeli made from a John Davis blank. I love the hit of both cues with CF shaft.

 

[Bavafongoul]

I get what you are saying with consistency but the joy of ownership is the personality of each cue. I don’t want to shoot with the same specs. It is essentially having a bunch of the same cues.

I like to pull out a cue and play to its characteristics. Keeps the monotony out of my shooting.

Well, I understand what you wrote, especially if you acquired any cue(s) in the secondary marketplace versus
ordering them from the cue maker. Even if you wanted a cue with certain specific specs, it is can be challenging
to find a cue with the specs you want. I know because I looked for several years trying to locate a Joel Hercek
cue but it had to match my other cues’ specs. I posted threads, offered a finders fee for referrals, even spoke with Joel a couple of times about how many cues like what I want he might recollect building. Bottomline is I never was able to
locate it. Joel did not build a lot of cues with a flat ivory joint and the ones I found were too heavy or the shafts weren’t
the correct size. My approach is very different than yours. I want all my cues to be as symmetrical as possible in specs.

If I wanted to switch cues, I want to yank a different cue out of my case and know it has the same specs as my other cues, 18.5 ozs., the same tip, Kamui Black Clear Soft, 1” ivory ferrules, butt weight of 14.5 ozs., & shaft wt. of 4.0 ozs.

A couple of my cues have shafts weighing 3.8 ozs but the other shafts are 4.0 to 4.2 ozs. The one thing I know, at least
for me, is changing cues is essentially seamless. I made sure to have my cue makers avoid using a bolt that weighed, if it
was needed, heavier than 7 grams (1/4 oz.). The bolt had to be headless and capable of being place in a cored butt in
different positions within the butt for the best balance. And of course, the cue should also have a big pin, flat ivory joint.

Joel told me he’s made cues like that but couldn’t immediately recall if the specs were compatible. He did say he made a
lot more piloted ivory cue joints that flat ivory. And we discussed expediting a cue to get made with my specs. He was
just the most pleasant, congenial cue maker I’ve ever spoken with and that includes cue makers I paid thousands of
dollars to build my custom cues. Joel is my all time favorite cue maker and Danny Tibbits is another one I much admire.
Never could find any of his cues with my specs either. As you see, we have a different philosophy about adding cues.

 

[Mensabum]

Type of joint has nothing to do with the hit. Balance point? Yeah but the joint doesn't dictate the 'hit'.

Gotta agree to disagree on that one gar!!

 

[Chili Palmer]

The cue I played with for decades had a SS joint. Currently I play with a Huebler with what I'm assuming is ABS or similar (it's white) joint and I now prefer that or a 3/8 x 10 wood to wood joint.

Close to, yes. Every cue I ordered is 19oz.

Most of my 3/8-10 have a fairly muted hit, which I always loved. The Schulers have an even more muted hit. Ray did all the right things.

That said, my Tasc isn’t muted. It sings. First cue I can ever say that. So totally different feel. The most muted is the Schuler, which is not 3/8-10 flat faced. Tascarella on the other hand has the most amazing feedback.

Can you define muted? I'm asking because when I hear "hits like a ton" I would consider that a muted hit.

Thanks.

 

[Mensabum]

The cue I played with for decades had a SS joint. Currently I play with a Huebler with what I'm assuming is ABS or similar (it's white) joint and I now prefer that or a 3/8 x 10 wood to wood joint.



Can you define muted? I'm asking because when I hear "hits like a ton" I would consider that a muted hit.

Thanks.

Always Thot muted was more in line with the implex joint, big pin and wood to wood jointed cues. A softer, smoother, firm-type hit. That's just me.
Well made cues sing. There's music in that feedback if you're willing to listen.

I bet you'd like some of the meds I'm on!!

 

[Chili Palmer]

Always Thot muted was more in line with the implex joint, big pin and wood to wood jointed cues. A softer, smoother, firm-type hit. That's just me.
Well made cues sing. There's music in that feedback if you're willing to listen.

I bet you'd like some of the meds I'm on!!

Most definitely like some of the meds you’re on

 

[MTfish]

I'm so torn on this right now. I played for years with a Schon or Huebler(s) and love those cues. For the last year I've been playing with a Meucci with a 3/8x10 pin and a "Pro" shaft from them, easily the lowest deflecting cue I've played with and I felt like the softer hit was somehow more forgiving on speed control, (not at all prepared to bet my live on that, just a feeling) and also feel the cue makes it really easy to draw the ball with. Having said that, my Dad's birthday is coming up and I grabbed his old Huebler to play with this week. I forgot how nice and solid they feel, and the weight forward balance with the SS joint seems to make the cue swing through the cue ball effortlessly. I also feel I can roll the cue ball a little more accurately with it, where as I can spin the ball easier with the Meucci. All of these things are probably in my head, but don't think I'll be abandoning either style of cue depending on game I'm playing, cue ball I'm playing with, and most importantly my mood.

 

[KAP1976]

I use to play with one years ago and it went into a threaded wood joint shaft. I always admired the balance from it but it seems very few cues are using them now. They are near extinction and the guys usually playing with one are older gentlemen. My friend who I haven't seen in a long time called to play me some pool and he has one. I shot with it and missed the balance because it has been years since I shot with one.

I actually prefer it now and my next cue will have one.

I know some cue makes still use them but most don't. How many of you guys still shoot with one and prefer it?

I have three playing cues -- 2015 Jacoby I won at their booth at Super Billiards Expo with a stainless joint (got it specifically because i liked the look with the joint), a Paul Drexler I ordered from him that has the stainless sleeve to give the look of stainless but has the universal joint, and a Predator Blak with the Uniloc. In terms of hit, the PFD is my favorite by far (and should be for what I paid) but there are times when I take the Jacoby out and it just feels...right...and thats the one I use for a few weeks.

I'm with you on the looks. I've loved the look of a stainless steel jointed cue since I was a kid.