What is a Shaft Taper?

Jacoby has Black V4 and Ultra Pro shafts with 19" pro taper. Is that the maximum for any company?

View attachment 832699

Jacoby is building two Kielwood shafts for me that should arrive next month.
There are two different pins but aside from that the shafts are same diameter.

Since Jacoby uses a longer taper than all my other cue shafts which is 14-15”,
I’m uncertain if it will be great or just okay. I wasn’t going to instruct them how to
build my shafts aside from trying to build the heaviest version they could make.

Other than the weight, the shafts are their standard 12.75mm with 19” pro taper
and I also specified the tips (Kamui Black Clear Soft) so got my fingers crossed.
The shafts are 29.5” & 1/2” ferrule. I’m hoping the shafts will weigh around 4 ozs.
 
Do not further complicate a complicated subject.
Crayons, please.
A Crayon has a conical taper at the working end to start, and it starts life often with a truncated tip. Often there is a step up in diameter at the base of the cone, and its diameter remains constant from there, holding a cylindrical shape. It would be incorrect to call the barrel or handle of a Crayon a “cylindrical taper.” That would be nonsensical.

As a Crayon is used, resharpened, etc,, the shapes and tapers get lost.

Freddie <~~~ hope this helps (but I can’t see how)
 
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A Crayon has a conical taper at the working end to start, and it starts life often with a truncated tip. Often there is a step up in diameter at the base of the cone, and it’s diameter remain constant from there, holding a cylindrical shape. It would be incorrect to call the barrel or handle of a Crayon a “cylindrical taper.” That would be nonsensical.

As a Crayon is used, resharpened, etc,, the shapes and tapers get lost.

Freddie <~~~ hope this helps (but I can’t see how)
I thought Predator had great marketing, but it appears they could learn a thing or two from Crayola. Not a single competitor comes close... I've never seen such industry dominance!

As far as re-sharpening, you're right, that taper does get lost. I don't think there are any industry standards for the "conical taper" sharpener.
 
There is no "standard" vocabulary. Its all up to the cue maker what the exact taper is, and what, if anything, he calls it.
Agreed. I wish more production shafts were the same diameter taper from start to finish. Right now I only see 1, and its only thanks to Fedor Gorst.

If you want a wood shaft you're SOL
 
Jacoby has Black V4 and Ultra Pro shafts with 19" pro taper. Is that the maximum for any company?

View attachment 832699

I have 4 Jacoby Ultra shafts. Two were purchased with 30" length and the standard 12.75 mm, and one was a 29" 12.75 mm.
Also have one 30" at 12.5 mm that I had them custom make at the 12.5 mm when they were building it. The three that I purchased at 12.75 mm, I have taken all of them down to basically match the 12.5 custom shaft I got from them.
While Jacoby advertises a 19" pro taper, and some think that means the shaft is the same diameter for that 19", that would not be even close to what it really is. It may be for carbon shafts, but not for wood, and seriously don't think you would want a wood shaft that does not taper up for the first 12"-19".
Their pro taper for the 12.5nmm shaft is, Ferrule-12.5 mm, 2"-12.6 mm, 4"-12.7 mm, 6"-12.92 mm, 8"-13.05 mm, 10"-13.11mm, 12"-13.18 mm, 14"-13.24 mm, 16"-13.66 mm
So while a pro taper, it still gets progressively larger and probably at the 19" area probably gets larger faster.
 
All of this is regarding wooden shafts. I think CF is going to open up possibilities that don't exist with wood. I spent over a month designing my shaft taper when I got a cue lathe. No doubt similar to others but this was mine. Somewhere along the way I confirmed my suspicion, zero taper for an extended length like Earl's shaft was rumored to be doesn't work! Like a fishing rod that flexes in the wrong place that shaft didn't flex until just before the taper over halfway to the joint. There was a sharp crack as I snapped that shaft after thirty minutes of testing. I didn't want somebody to fish it out of the garbage can and have my name associated with it. Dealing with wood, a long zero taper doesn't work. I'll start working down from the other direction.

A conical cue, usually a one piece cue, has exactly the same taper from tip to end of butt. Takes some getting used to but plays just fine with a stiff hit.

Then there is the modified cone or european taper. A fast taper from tip through bridge area but not as fast as near the joint and the area of the butt below the wrap area. Faster taper than a pro taper.

The "pro taper" generally has about one half to one mm taper per foot from tip through the bridge area.

The eliptical taper is a misnomer, generally refers to a compound curve when going from the taper near the joint to the bridge area. This allows more meat near the joint and creates a surprisingly different hit than a single arc transition. Probably more accurately called a poly arc taper but I have never seen it called that.

As should be obvious, some of these tapers can be combined. Also, anyone designing their taper feels free to call it whatever they please including names already in common usage. "Pro taper" is one of the most abused terms of all because it means whatever the cuebuilder or smith chooses it to mean.

I would not copy tapers if the taper was available from the original designer still. A matter of professional courtesy. For tapers that could not be purchased I measured every inch or two and created a similar shaft. I quit doing that except in rare instances. I had put a lot of work into my shaft design, if you wanted a different shaft, go to a different builder.

There is one taper rarely mentioned that used to be very common, the bottleneck. People overusing fine sandpaper or coarse Scotchbrite to clean their shafts, Mr Clean will give the same result, eventually wore the shaft down to where it grew smaller behind the tip into the bridging section until a rapid rise behind the bridging section. An interesting shaft to play with!

This is a brief introduction and every builder also uses their own names or whatever they please. My Pro Taper Poli Conic Cajun Special was of course the best shaft design!(grin)

I don't see why carbon fiber shafts can't have a taper profile on the inside and outside of the tube which should open up a whole world of possibilities including a zero taper outer shaft for many inches.

At present all a player can do is hit a lot of shafts and try to find one they like. Then go to the maker of that shaft and try to get one if they can. However, the shaft you buy may hit totally differently than the one you liked. Carbon fiber should at least offer greater consistency from shaft to shaft of the same brand and model. Remains to be seen. Those of us sensitive to such things may want the same lot number!

Hu
 
All of this is regarding wooden shafts. I think CF is going to open up possibilities that don't exist with wood. I spent over a month designing my shaft taper when I got a cue lathe. No doubt similar to others but this was mine. Somewhere along the way I confirmed my suspicion, zero taper for an extended length like Earl's shaft was rumored to be doesn't work! Like a fishing rod that flexes in the wrong place that shaft didn't flex until just before the taper over halfway to the joint. There was a sharp crack as I snapped that shaft after thirty minutes of testing. I didn't want somebody to fish it out of the garbage can and have my name associated with it. Dealing with wood, a long zero taper doesn't work. I'll start working down from the other direction.

A conical cue, usually a one piece cue, has exactly the same taper from tip to end of butt. Takes some getting used to but plays just fine with a stiff hit.

Then there is the modified cone or european taper. A fast taper from tip through bridge area but not as fast as near the joint and the area of the butt below the wrap area. Faster taper than a pro taper.

The "pro taper" generally has about one half to one mm taper per foot from tip through the bridge area.

The eliptical taper is a misnomer, generally refers to a compound curve when going from the taper near the joint to the bridge area. This allows more meat near the joint and creates a surprisingly different hit than a single arc transition. Probably more accurately called a poly arc taper but I have never seen it called that.

As should be obvious, some of these tapers can be combined. Also, anyone designing their taper feels free to call it whatever they please including names already in common usage. "Pro taper" is one of the most abused terms of all because it means whatever the cuebuilder or smith chooses it to mean.

I would not copy tapers if the taper was available from the original designer still. A matter of professional courtesy. For tapers that could not be purchased I measured every inch or two and created a similar shaft. I quit doing that except in rare instances. I had put a lot of work into my shaft design, if you wanted a different shaft, go to a different builder.

There is one taper rarely mentioned that used to be very common, the bottleneck. People overusing fine sandpaper or coarse Scotchbrite to clean their shafts, Mr Clean will give the same result, eventually wore the shaft down to where it grew smaller behind the tip into the bridging section until a rapid rise behind the bridging section. An interesting shaft to play with!

This is a brief introduction and every builder also uses their own names or whatever they please. My Pro Taper Poli Conic Cajun Special was of course the best shaft design!(grin)

I don't see why carbon fiber shafts can't have a taper profile on the inside and outside of the tube which should open up a whole world of possibilities including a zero taper outer shaft for many inches.

At present all a player can do is hit a lot of shafts and try to find one they like. Then go to the maker of that shaft and try to get one if they can. However, the shaft you buy may hit totally differently than the one you liked. Carbon fiber should at least offer greater consistency from shaft to shaft of the same brand and model. Remains to be seen. Those of us sensitive to such things may want the same lot number!

Hu
Great info. Thanks.

pj
chgo
 
Agreed. I wish more production shafts were the same diameter taper from start to finish. Right now I only see 1, and its only thanks to Fedor Gorst.

If you want a wood shaft you're SOL
wood would noodle out I think. Tad's standard taper is about as practical as it gets. I've heard one claim that the whole cue is a continuous cone. Rolls flush the whole length. Cue tech used to make a long ultraslim FG cue cheap. Never got around to getting one but that's my kind of taper. Hit as good as your stroke no matter the distances.
 
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