Parallel vs BHE vs tuck and roll vs "intuitive" English vs whatever else you use.

CeaseLess

CeaseLess

Active member
I'm a parallel english guy. I get down on the shot, parallel to the shot line, with an already adjusted aim for deflection and throw and shoot straight. It does require a small amount of thinking so it's not exactly automatic and was wondering if jermey Jones style of automatic adjusting would be simpler in the long run. I'm consistent with my shooting but thinking about trying other methods that might have other advantages. What method do you use to apply english, in theory or practice, which do you find most consistent and comfortable, and why do you think the method you use is best? Let's not start world War 3 boys, just a good, informative conversation/ debate. -CeaseLess-
 
CeaseLess said:
I'm a parallel english guy. I get down on the shot, parallel to the shot line, with an already adjusted aim for deflection and throw and shoot straight. It does require a small amount of thinking so it's not exactly automatic and was wondering if jermey Jones style of automatic adjusting would be simpler in the long run. I'm consistent with my shooting but thinking about trying other methods that might have other advantages. What method do you use to apply english, in theory or practice, which do you find most consistent and comfortable, and why do you think the method you use is best? Let's not start world War 3 boys, just a good, informative conversation/ debate. -CeaseLess-
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Shoot them enough and you should just get down on the shot line. I'm not saying you won't ever have to micro adjust but the goal is no adjustments at the table.
 
CeaseLess said:
I'm a parallel english guy. I get down on the shot, parallel to the shot line, with an already adjusted aim for deflection and throw and shoot straight. It does require a small amount of thinking so it's not exactly automatic and was wondering if jermey Jones style of automatic adjusting would be simpler in the long run. I'm consistent with my shooting but thinking about trying other methods that might have other advantages. What method do you use to apply english, in theory or practice, which do you find most consistent and comfortable, and why do you think the method you use is best? Let's not start world War 3 boys, just a good, informative conversation/ debate. -CeaseLess-
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I do it like you: drop onto the shot line pre-adjusted for squirt/throw - although I don't think of it as "parallel", since it's angled from the non-spin aim line.

pj
chgo
 
Patrick Johnson said:
Which probably means you use a low-deflection cue, so pivoting farther back works.

FHE (Front Hand English), pivoting closer to the bridge, works best with higher deflection cues.

pj
chgo
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Actually not. I do hold long - ish, to all the way long - but all long ferrules on my cue. Don't have the full range of every shot but it's sufficient. I just know the territory.
 
straightline said:
Actually not. I do hold long - ish, to all the way long - but all long ferrules on my cue. Don't have the full range of every shot but it's sufficient. I just know the territory.
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Oops, I reversed the definitions: BHE is for shorter pivots (higher deflection) and FHE is for longer ones (lower deflectio). I'll edit my post above.

pj
chgo
 
Patrick Johnson said:
I do it like you: drop onto the shot line pre-adjusted for squirt/throw - although I don't think of it as "parallel", since it's angled from the non-spin aim line.

pj
chgo
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Makes sense. Parallel-ish. When you spin the cueball is your whole cue stick to one side of the no spin shot line, or are the tip and butt diagonally crossing the shot line?
 
boogieman said:
Shoot them enough and you should just get down on the shot line. I'm not saying you won't ever have to micro adjust but the goal is no adjustments at the table.
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Yea, that's where I'm at, just messing around with different methods to see if something works better in specific situations. What method do you use?
 
CeaseLess said:
I'm a parallel english guy...
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To me, that means that the cue stick, when you stroke, is offset from the center of the cue ball to get the side spin you need and is also parallel to a line joining the center of the cue ball to the center of the ghost ball.

Is that what you mean by "parallel english"?

As for me, I put the cue stick along the line that looks right to make the ball and is hitting the cue ball for the spin I want. I would call that intuitive, I suppose. I absolutely to not call it parallel.
 
i also adjust my thinking and position based on how much english and speed i would use hitting the object ball full. as that is usually best if you can do that with the shot.
especially with lots of inside its nice if you can just aim to hit the object full in the face. makes the fast speed inside english long shots easier to judge and make.

but mostly with years of playing just walk up to the shot and aim how you need to to make the shot and position. if you have to think and analyze you will never get good.

i hit centerline of the cue ball and use speed and cheat the pocket for most shots to get position.
if cant then its usually high inside or low outside for other reasons.
 
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Bob Jewett said:
To me, that means that the cue stick, when you stroke, is offset from the center of the cue ball to get the side spin you need and is also parallel to a line joining the center of the cue ball to the center of the ghost ball.

Is that what you mean by "parallel english"?

As for me, I put the cue stick along the line that looks right to make the ball and is hitting the cue ball for the spin I want. I would call that intuitive, I suppose. I absolutely to not call it parallel.
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Yes, that's how I spin, offset and parallel. I feel like your style is a bit more natural and mine is a bit more analytical. I think that intuitive style might keep me more in the moment and flow and help my cue ball but it's complete different from how I shoot now. I have noticed it's made me much more consistent on heavy inside shots. Have you ever tried any other methods or is that how you learned?
 
CeaseLess said:
Yes, that's how I spin, offset and parallel. ...
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So far as I understand side spin, offset and parallel will not work for the vast majority of shots. Among other cases, it cannot work on shots for which backhand english works, because they give two different stick lines for the same amount of side spin.
 
Bob Jewett said:
So far as I understand side spin, offset and parallel will not work for the vast majority of shots. Among other cases, it cannot work on shots for which backhand english works, because they give two different stick lines for the same amount of side spin.
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It works on all shots of any speed. You might have not been adjusting for deflection enough. Where as you adjust for deflection with your method by "guessing" at the correct angle of your cue for that specific tip position, I adjust for deflection with parallel english by "guessing" at the correct new contact point on contact ball for that specific tip position. Cue straight, aim off vs cue off, aim straight. 2 ways of skinning the cat but we get to the same place. Any spin shot you can make with your method, I can make with mine, as long as it's within my skill of course.
 
"tuck and roll", wasn't that just something buddy made up for his (otherwise very good) instructional videos? i don't think i've heard it since.
 
CeaseLess said:
I'm a parallel english guy. I get down on the shot, parallel to the shot line, with an already adjusted aim for deflection and throw and shoot straight. It does require a small amount of thinking so it's not exactly automatic and was wondering if jermey Jones style of automatic adjusting would be simpler in the long run. I'm consistent with my shooting but thinking about trying other methods that might have other advantages. What method do you use to apply english, in theory or practice, which do you find most consistent and comfortable, and why do you think the method you use is best? Let's not start world War 3 boys, just a good, informative conversation/ debate. -CeaseLess-
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This ''auto adjust'' term.
What's this terminology saying to you?
Is it related to humidity, dirt, your walk up your swing, aiming?

All great players feel their shot line through their right hip.
(unless your Filler/left handed)

Don't think an instructor would say ''auto adjust your stance''.

Personally, walk up to the shot line swinging ''straight through'' your pre chosen cb contact point.
Simply put.... ''I walk up to the proper cueing''.
DON'T EVER SET YOU BRIDGE HAND ON TABLE ''then'' CHOOSE YOUR CONTACT POINT.
 
Island Drive said:
This ''auto adjust'' term.
What's this terminology saying to you?
Is it related to humidity, dirt, your walk up your swing, aiming?

All great players feel their shot line through their right hip.
(unless your Filler/left handed)

Don't think an instructor would say ''auto adjust your stance''.

Personally, walk up to the shot line swinging ''straight through'' your pre chosen cb contact point.
Simply put.... ''I walk up to the proper cueing''.
DON'T EVER SET YOU BRIDGE HAND ON TABLE ''then'' CHOOSE YOUR CONTACT POINT.
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I despise stating this cause it always causes bickering for some reason but I feel your last sentence explains why CTE/Pro1 works so well for me, you are zeroed in on a spot on the cue ball when you approach the table. I also use BHE and a wood shaft.
 
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