In the yearly ghost thread just concluded, we had a few members keep track of ALL of their 9 ball ghost attempts, both good and bad. The table above has the results. It is sorted by calculated ghost fargorate.
What FargoRate is the 9 ball ghost? Data included.
- Thread starter iusedtoberich
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In the yearly ghost thread just concluded, we had a few members keep track of ALL of their 9 ball ghost attempts, both good and bad. The table above has the results. It is sorted by calculated ghost fargorate.
The Ghost FR should tell you how tough the table is, but if it is a home table, the shooter might have "tuned" his game to the table and all its little idiosyncrasies.
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high enough to always shoot TPA 1.000 and give you all the breaks
They are playing against the ghost, which means they break and try to run out. If they run out they beat the ghost. If they don't the ghost wins.
The specific rules, particularly after the break and whether you ever get a 2nd chance, vary. But essentially "beating the ghost" means running out more often than you don't.
The numbers look about right to me. The ghost has previously been rumored to have a fargo in the low 600s. I reckon it's in the high 600s.
If a 650 goes hill hill with the ghost in a very long race, the ghost would be a 650 on that day on that table. If a 700 does the same, the ghost would be a 700 on that day on that table. If the 700 were instead to murder the ghost, the ghost would be less than 700 on that day on that table. Etc.
The ghost is great practice but i'd never use it to Fargo somebody. You get to break every game, win or lose. Playing a REAL person you might be in your chair a while(winner break of course). Best ghost match i ever saw was Efren playing ROTATION ghost in Calif. He beat the ghost at HardTimes race to 25. It was ridiculous. You have to break great and get a tad lucky as well. A lil of ER's deal:
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Still to me the better Player ( higher fargo)
runs out more times than a lesser player
So their percentage is a higher win rate
This exercise is rating each table, assuming the player's FR is correct. On a 700 table, a 700 is 50-50 with the ghost. On that same table, a 600 FR player wins half as many games as the ghost. An 800 beats the ghost by a 2-to-1 game ratio on that 700 table.
That's the theory. Whether the theoretical ratios hold up for a given table and a wide range of players has never been tested, SFAIK. I imagine that some players do much worse or better against the ghost than against a real player. I've seen players who did solo practice great but had trouble in tournaments.
And when it's humid, the table gets better.
That's the theory. Whether the theoretical ratios hold up for a given table and a wide range of players has never been tested, SFAIK. I imagine that some players do much worse or better against the ghost than against a real player. I've seen players who did solo practice great but had trouble in tournaments.
And when it's humid, the table gets better.
With all due respect that makes absolutely no sense
Playing the ghost means can you run out nine balls after the break?
The ghost’s Fargo rating has nothing to do with your rating
The ghost really has no forgo rating
Cause you’re really playing yourself
Can you run out or not?
However, there is a correlation to how well you run out based on your Fargo rating.
The better you are the more times you will run out
the highest win percentage meaning they ran out more times on a relative basis therefore they be the highest fargo
Also, your chart implied games not sets
To my knowledge, this is the only data anywhere of a somewhat long term ghost testing, where both good and bad play by the same player is included.
Me personally, I'd bet all day long on the ghost vs a 699 and below on a normal pool room 9' pro-cut Diamond. All day and tomorrow. 500 robustness on the player minimum.
race to what? i know a couple that might let you bet your nuts off depending on set length.
We've had discussions for years on here, even before fargorate, on "how good does a player need to be to beat the ghost"? This data was collected from members here doing the yearly ghost thread. In that thread, only the best sets from each member are written to the table. I had asked if any members from that thread would be willing to keep track of ALL of their attempts, good or bad. The ones in the chart did. Fargo only cares about games, not set scores. The chart is games only, not sets.
This data is of course not meant to be conclusive, and in fact is all over the place. But there is zero elsewhere like it.
I overheard Efren at the DCC about 2008 or 9. Someone asked him what was the best he ever played. He said something like "in the late 1970's I ran 4 racks of rotation in the Philippines". I'm not sure if he meant to the 15 ball or to 61 points.
You can't compare winning games in competition to playing the ghost. Please. Who really gives a shit what someone's 'GhostGo' rating is? The ONLY way they MIGHT mean anything is if the game is 'pro ghost' as in NO ball in hand. Even then its not the same. Playing actual comp. and playing the ghost are two totally different things. Why do people worry about this?
No, it's nothing like that. The question is simply: "how good do you have to be to beat the ghost?" Nothing more, nothing less. It's been a recurring question over the years. You're reading too much into it.
There used to be a good roadie from Colo. named Junior Harris. He said he was at a tourn. back in the mid 80's and as pre-match warm-up he watched ER run three racks of rotation. Guess what? Turned out Junior had drawn er and hadn't checked the draw sheet. ooops.
How much difference do you think the cloth makes? 30 points?
haha. I've seen him in person a few times. He was in Philly in the late 90s. One of the top local players. Maybe he'd be a 710-720 speed then I'm guessing. I think he might have moved to Texas after philly and found religion, last I heard 20 years ago.