Gambling
- Thread starter DynoDan
- Start date
Yeah he helped me take out an A player by stopping by to "sweat" the match like a long time pal. We had just met lol.
gambling and wagering
In my state gambling and wagering are distinguished from each other. I think it was hashed out when a couple of very important people were caught betting on their golf game.
According to my state, wagering is betting on your personal abilities. Gambling is betting on something you can't control, except for legal gambling like the Lotto. The law contradicts itself over and over, basically BS. However, what has been made clear is that a bet between two pool players who are shooting themselves is perfectly legal. Two people betting on the rail isn't. It hasn't been made clear as far as I know if a player on the table bets with a railbird. It would seem that the same bet is legal for one person and not the other!
I believe a major factor in killing off many pool halls is legal gambling. Unless betting on the rail, gambling at pool takes a lot of skill. Skill in setting up the bet these days, skill in play. It is a hell of a lot easier to pull levers or slap at cards on a screen. Skill has little or nothing to do with it. Everybody can stop off at a cafe and get their gambling jones covered with their cup of coffee. Stop by the truckstop for gas and play for fifteen minutes on the way to or from work. Head to off track betting that evening. Legal gambling is all around us, except for charity bingo. The casinos don't tolerate that open of competition and as the state was warned beforehand, once casinos come in they tell the state what to do, not the other way around!
The loss of a significant revenue stream from gamblers that couldn't easily get their gambling fix elsewhere has been very hard on pool halls. What has bailed them out somewhat is the hated league play that most serious players dislike for the noise and lack of courtesy many league players show. I try to stay out of halls on league and date nights. The halls probably wouldn't exist without them but impossible to focus on pool with some trash thumping out of the juke box at high volume, smoke that won't let me see across the room even with smoke eaters, and the total lack of knowledge or care about pool courtesy shown by many league players and people taking dates to the pool hall. Easy to see that they drink a lot of beer, eat a lot of food, buy some of those cigarettes right there at the hall.
I don't think that gambling has hurt pool's image that much, I think the loss of local gambling has all but destroyed pool halls. Also for the public to accept pool halls they need to be bright, decently decorated, and clean places. Also filthy language, particularly at high volume, offends John and Jane Q Public. Never mind that this is what they are playing on the juke box and the sweet looking lady at the table during league is using language that would make a sailor blush beet red!
Funny world! Pool needs more gambling, not less. Sports betting is huge. However, it has been proven over and over that particularly one on one sports offer too much opportunity to cheat the betters. Vegas was taken for a ride long ago and has a long memory.
We need more gambling at all levels. We also need to keep pool and pool players honest. Figuring out how to do that is the hard part.
Hu
In my state gambling and wagering are distinguished from each other. I think it was hashed out when a couple of very important people were caught betting on their golf game.
According to my state, wagering is betting on your personal abilities. Gambling is betting on something you can't control, except for legal gambling like the Lotto. The law contradicts itself over and over, basically BS. However, what has been made clear is that a bet between two pool players who are shooting themselves is perfectly legal. Two people betting on the rail isn't. It hasn't been made clear as far as I know if a player on the table bets with a railbird. It would seem that the same bet is legal for one person and not the other!
I believe a major factor in killing off many pool halls is legal gambling. Unless betting on the rail, gambling at pool takes a lot of skill. Skill in setting up the bet these days, skill in play. It is a hell of a lot easier to pull levers or slap at cards on a screen. Skill has little or nothing to do with it. Everybody can stop off at a cafe and get their gambling jones covered with their cup of coffee. Stop by the truckstop for gas and play for fifteen minutes on the way to or from work. Head to off track betting that evening. Legal gambling is all around us, except for charity bingo. The casinos don't tolerate that open of competition and as the state was warned beforehand, once casinos come in they tell the state what to do, not the other way around!
The loss of a significant revenue stream from gamblers that couldn't easily get their gambling fix elsewhere has been very hard on pool halls. What has bailed them out somewhat is the hated league play that most serious players dislike for the noise and lack of courtesy many league players show. I try to stay out of halls on league and date nights. The halls probably wouldn't exist without them but impossible to focus on pool with some trash thumping out of the juke box at high volume, smoke that won't let me see across the room even with smoke eaters, and the total lack of knowledge or care about pool courtesy shown by many league players and people taking dates to the pool hall. Easy to see that they drink a lot of beer, eat a lot of food, buy some of those cigarettes right there at the hall.
I don't think that gambling has hurt pool's image that much, I think the loss of local gambling has all but destroyed pool halls. Also for the public to accept pool halls they need to be bright, decently decorated, and clean places. Also filthy language, particularly at high volume, offends John and Jane Q Public. Never mind that this is what they are playing on the juke box and the sweet looking lady at the table during league is using language that would make a sailor blush beet red!
Funny world! Pool needs more gambling, not less. Sports betting is huge. However, it has been proven over and over that particularly one on one sports offer too much opportunity to cheat the betters. Vegas was taken for a ride long ago and has a long memory.
We need more gambling at all levels. We also need to keep pool and pool players honest. Figuring out how to do that is the hard part.
Hu
All part of a traditional education sadly missing with today’s youth. Spotting the ‘novice stranger’ & ‘brother-in-law’ hustles was once merely part of growing up.
The traveling ‘flim-flam’ man interaction was also what once kept us from falling for the more expensive internet/phone con games many adults (that should know better) succumb to nowadays. The small early loses to hustlers & con artists in my youth was always money I considered ‘well spent’ (IMHO).
Damn straight archer was a true terror in the 90s. No exaggeration there.
And I recall reading a stat years ago about some country in the South Pacific wher the amount wagered annually by citizens was like 3x the wages they earned. Not sure how that could be, maybe it is like partners 1 pocket, where they are passing the same $100 around for a year!?
And I recall reading a stat years ago about some country in the South Pacific wher the amount wagered annually by citizens was like 3x the wages they earned. Not sure how that could be, maybe it is like partners 1 pocket, where they are passing the same $100 around for a year!?
Not what he told me when I met himA couple of guys asked him to play for money is what brought it up.
Earl was there as well, he said he does not gamble anymore(an has not for a very long time) either.
"Gambling is part of our culture,"
Maybe that is why pool is having such a hard time becoming a Professional Sport??
I understand gambling exists in all sports, but, don't see any real benefits to it. For every person who can "afford" to gamble or is a "good gambler" I think there are 1000 more who are losing and causing strife in their lives. "Money is the root of all evil", I tend to find this to be true. I work hard for my money and don't like the nervous feeling I get about losing it on a bet. Just my feelings and opinion on the topic.
TFT
gambling isn't the issue, espn gives out spreads on football games. thats a BS excuse. the game is boring to watch for non players, fatcs. some matches go on for 3 hours, who wants to watch that shit. I don't. I don't care who plays. the only way to make pool interesting is to pay the players even and let them go nuts with their stroke and shots, make people go WOW! how did he do that. let them compete for a trophy. like other sports. if theyre fighting for their livelihood, they have to play smart, sometimes long drawn out races, and the tournament money for most is so little that they supplement with money games. I don't call gambling, I call it money matches.
Zackly. This is where the xtreem kids need to be present. Ain't gonna happen without major corporate assistance. (which they already have too much of...)
JA can still play. Oscar beat him in a big session about 2 years ago in Atlanta but there were other reasons that JA wasn’t at his best then.
When everything lines up right-forget it he can play super strong. His stamina isn’t what it was, that’s certain. But he’s still tough action. He was born with so much talent. SVB has had to work harder to play great than JA did. Not a knock on SVB or JA just the way it is. Filler is massive talent as well. Then there’s the rest of us...... banging balls forever and can’t play a lick compared to those elite players.
Fatboy<——-banging balls since 1981
For some reason it seems I’ve had a different experience with gambling than most in this thread. Gambling in pool, for me, has always been a huge part of the game. Almost as much as the game itself. I live in the buckle of the Bible Belt (MS) and there’s normally always a few people matched up no matter what time of day it is. One pocket is crazy popular so finding action is super easy. And for some reason a lot of players gamble in 1-hole that could never catch a run in 9-ball. Another thing I’ve noticed, is that whenever I play in a tournament there’s usually a few teenagers running around with huge egos trying to find a game. Id say it’s entertaining to watch kids barking at people twice their age. Im not a huge gambler, but I think it’s fun to play”gentleman’s games” for like $5-10 a game or short set. Just enough to make it entertaining but not so much that you and your opponent can’t drink and have fun talking smack back and forth. I understand people who don’t gamble, I don’t understand people who won’t play for free, but I can definitely say that gambling on pool games is here to stay.
-B
-B
What about Calcutta? That’s not technically betting on the rail, but isn’t necessarily by competitors. Is that legal where you are? Or anywhere? I’ve always wondered about that..
I‘ve played for 50 years, this year, I’ve never gambled a cent (or whatever the currency is where I played). I play in 3 unaffiliated leagues and we all enjoy the game...no added spice by some need to gamble. I also play slowpitch, ball hockey and soccer...Again, nobody has any need to gamble.
I don’t care if others do. I’m glad they found enjoyment in wagering a few dollars. However I disagree that those of us who don’t gamble are somehow missing out on life. I also don’t drink, smoke or do any drugs. Happy not to need those activities to get an added rush from life. My favourite high from billiards is the challenge of quality safety play in Snooker or running a difficult lay out in 8 ball.
Anyways, I don’t care about the money, pros, gambling, etc. anymore than when I play ball slowpitch...it’s just a fun activity. Nostalgia for ‘the old days’ is usually more about our youth, good health, free feeling, etc. I fondly remember riding my dirt bike at insane speeds over crazy terrain and know it was likely less about the activity than being young and crazy.
Last edited:
I don't think it's so much about the decision to gamble or abstain; just that gambling breeds the best players. If it's not in your blood, nobody's problem. You might get shunned by the predator crowd; their problem.
Different set of rules
Gambling was a big part of South Louisiana culture since way before it was sold to the US. Some gambling that is illegal is still out in the open, all good. However, calcuttas are specifically legal. The law requires that nothing be taken out of the calcuttas. There have been the auctioneer's fees or the tournament director's fees taken from the calcutta but that is definitely illegal and didn't last long.
Calcuttas and betting on the rail seem like very close cousins to me. However, one is legal and the other isn't, because that is how the laws are written! It gets closer to english law all of the time but because of our history, Louisiana is the only state whose laws are based on french law, not english.
By the way, I'm only about seven miles off of I-55 a little over a hundred miles south of you. If you are ever cruising down 55 after this crap clears, we might get together.
Hu
Gambling was a big part of South Louisiana culture since way before it was sold to the US. Some gambling that is illegal is still out in the open, all good. However, calcuttas are specifically legal. The law requires that nothing be taken out of the calcuttas. There have been the auctioneer's fees or the tournament director's fees taken from the calcutta but that is definitely illegal and didn't last long.
Calcuttas and betting on the rail seem like very close cousins to me. However, one is legal and the other isn't, because that is how the laws are written! It gets closer to english law all of the time but because of our history, Louisiana is the only state whose laws are based on french law, not english.
By the way, I'm only about seven miles off of I-55 a little over a hundred miles south of you. If you are ever cruising down 55 after this crap clears, we might get together.
Hu
I love New Orleans, my absolute favorite city to visit (and gamble in). :smile:
One day I'll come down that way and look you up. I can still run two balls in One Pocket. That's about it though.
P.S. Talked to Ray Martin a couple of days ago. He's 85! I knew he still gave lessons so I asked him if he could still run 100 balls. He laughed and said he the last time was two days ago!
Last edited:
quite a guy!
Jay,
I talked to Ray a little, smoothed his way a bit when he first came here and didn't know forum etiquette. Quite a guy and I suspect as long as he can swing a stick he will be able to beat most anyone at straight pool.
I had the good timing to buy a little bar table for the back porch a few weeks ago. Much to my surprise I play like crap on it. Thought I was gonna run over that bar table being used to Diamonds.
I am a bit above New Orleans, about half way to Jackson MS. However, if you get in the general neck of the woods I would definitely like to meet you! Give a shout and we will make it work.
Hu
I love New Orleans, my absolute favorite city to visit (and gamble in). :smile:
One day I'll come down that way and look you up. I can still run two balls in One Pocket. That's about it though.
P.S. Talked to Ray Martin a couple of days ago. He's 85! I knew he still gave lessons so I asked him if he could still run 100 balls. He laughed and said he the last time was two days ago!
Jay,
I talked to Ray a little, smoothed his way a bit when he first came here and didn't know forum etiquette. Quite a guy and I suspect as long as he can swing a stick he will be able to beat most anyone at straight pool.
I had the good timing to buy a little bar table for the back porch a few weeks ago. Much to my surprise I play like crap on it. Thought I was gonna run over that bar table being used to Diamonds.
I am a bit above New Orleans, about half way to Jackson MS. However, if you get in the general neck of the woods I would definitely like to meet you! Give a shout and we will make it work.
Hu