Center Ball

The worst insight into doing anything is asking yourself if top pros do it. They are top pros, remember. If you are able to shoot with accuracy while using english, and control the cue ball with english, then you gain the ability of having the cue ball go wherever you want on the table.

Now, players who can't do this shouldn't. Playing center ball on every shot for the first couple of years will give you a lot of insight into how you are able to shoot and how the cue ball deflects off of the object ball, for all of the reasons you already stated. But after you master the basics, it is ok to move on to advanced shooting techniques.

I doubt if a 'Pro' is anywhere near center-ball, most of the time, but then again there are times when a hit on whitey's midsection is required. It depends on the shot.
For us mortals, however, we probably tend to stay a little closer to home. :smile:

Eddie Charlton, an Australian snooker professional from the seventies and eighties, was well known for his aversion to sidespin.

Personally, I find the employment of english actually makes certain shots far easier, and not just for positional purposes either. If the shape permits, I prefer to stroke with a measure of outside spin on most angled shots to negate the throw.

Rubik's Cube said:

Eddie Charlton, an Australian snooker professional from the seventies and eighties, was well known for his aversion to sidespin.

Personally, I find the employment of english actually makes certain shots far easier, and not just for positional purposes either. If the shape permits, I prefer to stroke with a measure of outside spin on most angled shots to negate the throw.

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I heard that alot about snooker players.

There is a kid that plays with my group, and he hardly ever uses center ball. He also doesn't understand why the cue ball goes where it does, and why he misses a lot of the time (when he misses) and he never will until he starts off shooting center ball for a while.

jackpot said:

Do any top players play exclusively, or almost exclusively center. C. J. said
no, and I can't think of any. Not snooker, pool. The best player I knew that
played that way was Billy Stroud. So many here say this is the best way.
Well why don't top players play that way. It makes sense to play that way
as you take out at the least two variables, deflection and throw. Now the tables
are so fast and it easy to move the cue ball around, Not like years ago when
you had to spin it to get around the table. So it must be easier to aim using
some sort of spin. If it were easier they would hit CB on the game ball sense
position is no needed. But they don't.
jack

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Spin does not have anything to do with making aiming easier or more difficult. Its mainly about where they want the cue ball to go, but it also helps pocket balls too. If you watch pros aim on the game ball they are usually using a little "outside" spin and usually draw too. The "outside" spin helps 'throw' the object ball towards the pocket and the draw because it seems like they prefer to draw the cue ball to the center of the nearest rail rather than going forward 1 or 2 rails. More than likely you will need to adjust your aim somewhat depending on whether you are using center or inside/outside spin.

Watch some of the top players from Taiwan.

Mike Massey was saying, when commenting on a stream a while ago, that he has really gone back to centre ball most of the time (and has a little training aid he was selling to slip over your tip you would miscue if you hit off centre).

Did anyone see him on the stream from the recent event in Wyoming (where I think he placed second to SVB in the 8B)? I missed it, but I'd be curious to know if he really was doing this.

Gideon

Mark Wilson talks about the vertical axis being center ball in his book. You don't have to worry about swerve and deflection unless you are using side spin.

I feel like players should use the vertical axis whenever possible. Use the horizontal axis if needed when you get out of line to try and get back in line.

If you are in-line, you don't need to spin the ball unless you just want to show off.

GideonF said:

Mike Massey was saying, when commenting on a stream a while ago, that he has really gone back to centre ball most of the time (and has a little training aid he was selling to slip over your tip you would miscue if you hit off centre).

Did anyone see him on the stream from the recent event in Wyoming (where I think he placed second to SVB in the 8B)? I missed it, but I'd be curious to know if he really was doing this.

Gideon

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I love Mike Massey and his trickshots.
But I read some story here that some years ago at a tourney vs Ga Young Kim, he broke few golden breaks in a row which turned off GYK . LOL
i am guessing he must be master racker who can teach pros a few tricks

If I had to play just on the center axis I would probably quit playing.

It would be like playing tennis or ping pong with no spin.

If one thinks that they can hit the center axis consistently & almost never be off by just 2 mm, then have at it.

Hitting intentionally off to one side or the other & planning for that seems the most logical approach... to me.

CB squirt will be there for ANY off center hit. One might as well make it their friend & USE it to their benefit...

vs.

having it as an enemy & being afraid of it & continually trying to avoid it with no real consistent success as none of us are perfect with a perfect stroke.

Just food for thought.

i think what mark wilson says is spot on........there are some shots where u must use english to get position, that is a fact......but if u dont need it why use it.....but as players play for years and years i think they shoot the way they become comfortable. If u can shoot like bustamante why change?? but for beginning and intermediate players mayb we should use center ball for more consistency.

I started using english within weeks of starting the game when I was 13 yrs. old.

I think one should use it as soon as possible so as to not become afraid of it.

The subconscious mind is an amazing entity & can do amazing things if WE do not put up conscious road blocks to inhibit it.

How can one expect to be successful when using english if one only rarely if ever does use it.

There are a number of threads regarding this subject.

Each individual should make their own determinations.

If you think you can hit the center axis consistently, then you're good enough to play like the pros do...

& they don't play on the center axis that much.

Again, just food for thought.

I think beginners need spin more than experienced players.

The table layout is a big factor in how the game is played...as long as the person at the table continues their turn at the table.

There are normally several different options and patterns as to how each ball can be played. Sometimes there are no options and you only have one choice.

As long as the balls are open on the table you can choose your angles at which to pocket the ball and to move the cue ball around the table. Some people will choose a sharper angle and use spin off the rail to move the cue ball and others will use a shallower angle and "drag" the cue ball around the table with "no spin" using the angle the cue ball comes off the rail. In both cases, the position of the cue ball can be placed in the same final position by high caliber players.

I prefer to use angles and less spin if that is one of my options for making the object ball and moving the cue ball to my desired location.

Aloha.

I try to use center ball (vertical axis) as much as possible. But hitting center consistently is tough, so I usually hit just a touch inside of center....

ghost ball said:

I try to use center ball (vertical axis) as much as possible. But hitting center consistently is tough, so I usually hit just a touch inside of center....

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I ALWAYS play inside center if that is an option.

Jack pot

how long have we known each other
come to me for any of your pool questions and i will have you shooting like me
in a few short sessions

i see that you must be playing too much cheap pool
all the balls react different when you raise the bet

also you will have less time for these stupid philosophical questions

throw,squirt and such stuff should never enter your mind
i can assure you they never enter mine

just send me a check for the usual and i will answer a few questions
quickly and you will start playing good again

oh yes,i am going to houston next week,does that stakehorse offer
still stand? if so send a larger check and i will cut you in for a
lucrative piece of the action

To save me typing Willie Mosconi's comments on centre ball.
http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=315283&highlight=mosconi

If you can't do this, anything that happens is an accident. :grin:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oUPd6zdmCpQ

HawaiianEye said:

I think beginners need spin more than experienced players.

The table layout is a big factor in how the game is played...as long as the person at the table continues their turn at the table.

There are normally several different options and patterns as to how each ball can be played. Sometimes there are no options and you only have one choice.

As long as the balls are open on the table you can choose your angles at which to pocket the ball and to move the cue ball around the table. Some people will choose a sharper angle and use spin off the rail to move the cue ball and others will use a shallower angle and "drag" the cue ball around the table with "no spin" using the angle the cue ball comes off the rail. In both cases, the position of the cue ball can be placed in the same final position by high caliber players.

I prefer to use angles and less spin if that is one of my options for making the object ball and moving the cue ball to my desired location.

Aloha.

Click to expand...

An advanced player learns to leave the cue ball on the correct side of the object ball. They can send the cue ball in the right direction with a natural angle, thick or thin, using spin or just a controlled stroke for position. The weaker player has to do more unnatural things to get back in line with weaker cue ball control.

ghost ball said:

I try to use center ball (vertical axis) as much as possible. But hitting center consistently is tough, so I usually hit just a touch inside of center....

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Zackley! It's nice to get a professional posting in these threads.
Why don't you have a black banner in your avatar?

HawaiianEye said:

I ALWAYS play inside center if that is an option.

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Another zackley! Who knew?

Best,
Mike

GideonF said:

Mike Massey was saying, when commenting on a stream a while ago, that he has really gone back to centre ball most of the time (and has a little training aid he was selling to slip over your tip you would miscue if you hit off centre).

Did anyone see him on the stream from the recent event in Wyoming (where I think he placed second to SVB in the 8B)? I missed it, but I'd be curious to know if he really was doing this.

Gideon

Click to expand...

I met Mike Massey a year ago. we were both walking into Buffalo Billiards in Reno..

Super nice guy IMO.

He gave me one of his training DVD out of the kindness of his heart and inside was a couple plastic cap things that fit over the tip on your cue that helps people to learn to hit center of the cue ball.

First off, everyone needs to know if they are hitting center of the cue ball when they want to.

So when I get back to my home town I am telling a few folks about Meeting mike and the plastic training tool and allot of guys tried it out......

Even the best players are not hitting dead center all the time when they want to...
After loaning the plastic training tool out and them not coming back

I made another shaft for my cue and made a clear plastic tip for it that I never chalk and that's how I do my hitting center ball drills .

I will shoot 10 or 15 racks practicing hitting center of the cue ball.

My main point I am trying to make, don't bs your self's If you are missing shots and you have no idea why then start practicing hitting center of cue ball.

Scotch tape over the tip will work too..

Every good pool player needs to know what part of the cue ball he is hitting and the center is the starting place .