Number of practice strokes

scottjen26 · Oct 28, 2011

I've been in a slump for about a month, been trying to go back to basics and see what physical and mental things need adjusting.

My usual rhythm is to take 2 - 3 practice strokes (aiming strokes technically) as I'm settling in, then 1 - 2 warmup strokes, then pause, verify aim, and shoot. In order to slow things down a bit, I tried an alternate rhythm I played with before, which is to get down on the shot and really verify my cue ball tip position and my line of aim before taking any strokes at all - basically pausing 2 - 3 seconds with some eye movement, then taking 2 strokes, pausing, and shooting.

So I found last night after switching to this "pause first" routine that I shot a few times with no aiming or warmup strokes at all! It just sort of happened, I picked up the aim using CTE as usual, pivoted on the way down, really focused on the CB position and OB aim, then I just felt ready to shoot and did.

So my question is - is there anything wrong with this 0 warmup stroke approach? I can't remember another player that shoots like that, i.e. no warmups at all. It was weird, sometimes I actually felt more tension creeping in after taking a few strokes then just really concentrating and pausing and then just shooting. The speed of the final stroke is all muscle memory anyway, and I didn't find a problem shooting anything from soft to firm speed using that approach, only when shooting a specialty shot did it feel more natural to warm up a bit to feel the shot.

Not saying I'm going to adopt this a permanent routine, just curious and what I found. If nothing else the whole experience slowed everything down for me and enabled me to find a few things that I had gotten sloppy with, hopefully with improvements in those areas I will get out of my slump soon, it was already better last night.

Thanks,
Scott

lee brett · Oct 28, 2011

scottjen26 said:
I've been in a slump for about a month, been trying to go back to basics and see what physical and mental things need adjusting.

My usual rhythm is to take 2 - 3 practice strokes (aiming strokes technically) as I'm settling in, then 1 - 2 warmup strokes, then pause, verify aim, and shoot. In order to slow things down a bit, I tried an alternate rhythm I played with before, which is to get down on the shot and really verify my cue ball tip position and my line of aim before taking any strokes at all - basically pausing 2 - 3 seconds with some eye movement, then taking 2 strokes, pausing, and shooting.

So I found last night after switching to this "pause first" routine that I shot a few times with no aiming or warmup strokes at all! It just sort of happened, I picked up the aim using CTE as usual, pivoted on the way down, really focused on the CB position and OB aim, then I just felt ready to shoot and did.

So my question is - is there anything wrong with this 0 warmup stroke approach? I can't remember another player that shoots like that, i.e. no warmups at all. It was weird, sometimes I actually felt more tension creeping in after taking a few strokes then just really concentrating and pausing and then just shooting. The speed of the final stroke is all muscle memory anyway, and I didn't find a problem shooting anything from soft to firm speed using that approach, only when shooting a specialty shot did it feel more natural to warm up a bit to feel the shot.

Not saying I'm going to adopt this a permanent routine, just curious and what I found. If nothing else the whole experience slowed everything down for me and enabled me to find a few things that I had gotten sloppy with, hopefully with improvements in those areas I will get out of my slump soon, it was already better last night.

Thanks,
Scott

play with what is your natural rhythm, if you play outside of your rhythm the brain will swith off and you will start to think and struggle.

I dont use any warm up strokes, marco fu doesnt either.. if this feels comfortable then stick with it, as long as you sight the ball correctly and align properly with a nice pause. there isnt problem

Scott Lee · Oct 28, 2011

Scott...Like Lee said, do whatever works best for you. That said, having zero warmups doesn't allow the subconscious brain to get to that red llight/green light position, where you really decide "Am I ready...or not?" That's not to say that it cannot work for some players. What I gave you was a process that you picked out, and decided upon. Whatever someone does, it needs to be the same every time, on every shot. I watched Darren Appleton carefully in the finals of the US Open last weekend, and he was very deliberate in his approach, doing the same thing every time. He rarely missed, or missed position. Sometimes just overthinking things can distract a player's rhythm. You may be doing this. Good luck with your progress.

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com

FranCrimi · Oct 28, 2011

scottjen26 said:
I've been in a slump for about a month, been trying to go back to basics and see what physical and mental things need adjusting.

My usual rhythm is to take 2 - 3 practice strokes (aiming strokes technically) as I'm settling in, then 1 - 2 warmup strokes, then pause, verify aim, and shoot. In order to slow things down a bit, I tried an alternate rhythm I played with before, which is to get down on the shot and really verify my cue ball tip position and my line of aim before taking any strokes at all - basically pausing 2 - 3 seconds with some eye movement, then taking 2 strokes, pausing, and shooting.

So I found last night after switching to this "pause first" routine that I shot a few times with no aiming or warmup strokes at all! It just sort of happened, I picked up the aim using CTE as usual, pivoted on the way down, really focused on the CB position and OB aim, then I just felt ready to shoot and did.

So my question is - is there anything wrong with this 0 warmup stroke approach? I can't remember another player that shoots like that, i.e. no warmups at all. It was weird, sometimes I actually felt more tension creeping in after taking a few strokes then just really concentrating and pausing and then just shooting. The speed of the final stroke is all muscle memory anyway, and I didn't find a problem shooting anything from soft to firm speed using that approach, only when shooting a specialty shot did it feel more natural to warm up a bit to feel the shot.

Not saying I'm going to adopt this a permanent routine, just curious and what I found. If nothing else the whole experience slowed everything down for me and enabled me to find a few things that I had gotten sloppy with, hopefully with improvements in those areas I will get out of my slump soon, it was already better last night.

Thanks,
Scott

Sometimes when you change something, it highlights your sense of awareness and that's the real reason why you feel improvement rather than the actual physical thing that you changed.

I have a rule that whatever changes I make to my game have to pass the test in competition. That's when things will break down if they're not solid. Test yourself in competition and if it works, then go for it. I've tried the drop and shoot method (no stroking) and I like it in practice but I don't like it for myself in competition. It's just a personal preference thing.

Maybe you can use it as a tool to slow yourself down when you feel you're moving too fast.

JoeyInCali · Oct 28, 2011

FranCrimi said:
Sometimes when you change something, it highlights your sense of awareness and that's the real reason why you feel improvement rather than the actual physical thing that you changed.

I have a rule that whatever changes I make to my game have to pass the test in competition. That's when things will break down if they're not solid. Test yourself in competition and if it works, then go for it. I've tried the drop and shoot method (no stroking) and I like it in practice but I don't like it for myself in competition. It's just a personal preference thing.

Maybe you can use it as a tool to slow yourself down when you feel you're moving too fast.

Do you chart your winning percentage or progress Fran ?

As far as practice stroke, I thought you do them until your motion looks totally in-line with the shot, pause/backswing/pause then shoot .

FranCrimi · Oct 28, 2011

JoeyInCali said:
Do you chart your winning percentage or progress Fran ?

As far as practice stroke, I thought you do them until your motion looks totally in-line with the shot, pause/backswing/pause then shoot .

Joey, I keep two journals, one for practice and one for competition. I don't chart percentages but I make detailed notes about what went right and what went wrong.

Your question about practice strokes --- not sure if you mean 'you' in general or me? As for me, I always take practice strokes now. I haven't used the drop and shoot method for a long time because I feel that I don't need it right now. As to how many, I take as many strokes as I need for any given shot. For me, it varies.

The Renfro · Oct 29, 2011

I got a close up look at all of the players on the tv table at the Open and can tell you that the number varies by player and will also vary by how well the player is playing.... In Mika's match he started out with slow and deliberate warmup strokes and when he started to play poorly he was rushing thru the smooth rhythm he wad exhibited early in the match...

The best at being smooth and consistent regardless of the shot were John Morra and Thorsten... They would take several long warmups to ensure alignment... several medium ones like they were searching with the warmup for the speed to use and then some small and micro strokes addressing exactly on the cueball where they intended to hit... After the micro warm ups they would bring the cue all the way back, pause and then fire... They did this to the point where I always knew when they were going to pull the trigger......

I made it a point to pay attention to this exact fundamental as I am by nature a drop and shoot player and am working on being a little more disciplined and consistent.....

scottjen26 · Nov 1, 2011

Thanks for the feedback, some good advice.

I'm definitely trying to "find" that natural rhythm - I haven't been 100% happy with what I've been doing going back to when I started playing again in February. Something in the number and timing of strokes coupled with my eye movement between the CB and OB just isn't working. When I do what is natural, I feel like my ball pocketing and overall play suffers on all but the best of days, when I shoot lights out. Problem is I can't rely on a rhythm that only works when everything is in sync and I'm in dead stroke.

As Fran astutely pointed out, I think my recent change, which wasn't meant to be permanent necessarily, highlighted everything I was doing that wasn't feeling comfortable or right. I noticed occasional issues with my alignment, focus, and grip pressure/angle, all of which I can now work on. It just surprised me that the side effect of me pausing first for 2 - 3 seconds before shooting resulted in me wanting to shoot the ball with no warmup strokes naturally, only taking some on certain types of shots. Not necessarily something I'm going to do long term, but I sure shot well that way. I practiced briefly yesterday, and I found that I could revert back to my "old" rhythm just as well now that I'm aware of those few things I found. If nothing else maybe I discovered a tool for the future when things go wrong.

Scott Lee - I know we mapped out an initial process during our lesson in May, but I wasn't 100% committed to it and not happy with it or other variations I've tried since. I know we had to get through that process as part of your lesson plan, and you said I could change it later, but what I need is help figuring out what variations work well for me. I keep trying to work on this on my own for the 6 - 8 hours a week I have for practice, it's just not enough and very frustrating, especially now that I'm in this slump mode. I know that I think too much about certain aspects of the game, but that's the way my brain is wired, and that same drive and obsessiveness is what got me to the level I'm at in this sport and others. Perhaps it's more limiting once I reach the higher levels, but I feel once I can decide on something and put it aside I don't question it anymore.

I believe I need a coach who can understand how I think about things and work with me to explore the questions I still have, refine my routine and shooting style, and analyze and correct mistakes while playing. There have only been a few people I've really connected with in various sports I've played, and for pool at least I'm not sure I have a lot of options in my area. And being realistic, this is really just for personal gain, there's not much chance of me drastically improving and going pro or anything, this is just for self satisfaction and maybe finally being able to shoot more consistently at the level I'm capable of which would enable me to have better success in tourneys etc.

Thanks much for the feedback, I appreciate it. I think I'll continue to try and figure out what's missing from my routine and hopefully one day it will all fall into place!
Scott

The Renfro · Nov 1, 2011

Scottjen26,

I can offer up this small bit of advice... Making a change without a definite reason for the change usually won't yield results... Currently your brain is comfortable with a quick rhythm likely because you are not in the habit of feeding it much information before making a decision once you are down...

To change this dynamic you are going to have to re-qualify what information is needed to make a decision to pull the trigger.... Or at least reorganize the methods and timeline on when the information is gathered....

One case in point is feeling the speed for the shot. I tend to have a fast tempo once I am down... Any more than 4 practice shots seems like an eternity... I have always stroked the cue thru my bridge while standing upright... I have my sense of speed determined before I get down to shoot....

I have my English picked out before I get down and have already subconsciously adjusted the aim line when getting down.....

My 4 pre-strokes are useful for only one thing and that is verifying that my mechanics are moving the cue on the line I wanted......

For me to use more than 4 and feel comfortable I have to be aware of what the usefulness of extra strokes will be.... I can use a few to test my feel for speed and I can use a few to double check the tip contact... If I do these extra strokes with those intentions I have no problems using 12 practice strokes.... I also add different points while down where I can decide to stand back up if something feels wrong.....

Just food for thought and a little mind trick I have found useful while fighting the same fight you are fighting now.......

quadrary · Nov 2, 2011

practice strokes

first i am not an instructor but i believe there are as many answers to this as there are players. I know that for me to be playing my most consistent game the answer for me is 1 or 2. i generally look at the layout as soon as i stand up after my oponent finishes his shot or immediately after my break as i turn toward the table fr4om changing cues and decide on my approach to the next 3 balls if playing 9 or 10 ball or to all 8 if playing 8 ball. first i find the shot line and while standing back on that shot line decide how i want to move the cue ball from the object ball to the position for the next shot. i then lay my cue on the rail on the line of the cue ball to object ball line for the shot, then take 1 long slow breath to relax and step into the shooting position already knowing what i want to do. Once i get down on the shot 1 take generally one practice stroke for a normal shot or 2 for a thin cut or difficult cue ball path with a lot of spin. Then i pause slow drawback and smooth stroke. If i am not ready within 2 practice strokes i stand up step back and start over. I find that for me if i am down longer than that the chance of a miss increases with each passing second. I generally shoot 95 percent of my shots with the same stroke as far as speed and move the cue ball by tip placement. Even for a shot where i could use a slow roll i tend use normal stroke and use a drag shot to slow the cue ball. This is wgat works for me you have to find what works for you.

scottjen26 · Nov 2, 2011

Renfro, I totally hear you…

I know I'm totally guilty of overanalyzing stuff. However, I'm also convinced that my natural rhythm as is is not working - not feeling comfortable at the table, missing shots I normally wouldn't, overthinking things, etc. I really can't remember exactly how I used to shoot before I took a break, and certainly not the way I did 8 years ago, which before my 5 - 6 year break was when I was shooting my best. I've learned new things now, and in some ways know more and shoot better than I did back in the day, I just can't get it to stick on a consistent basis which is killing me.

Perhaps the rhythm is fine and something else is off, but it doesn't feel that way. I've tried to speed up even further, forget about any sort of CTE etc. and just shoot the way I used to, and it works - for a while. I've tried slowing down like I described, and while it helps to diagnose some things that slow rhythm is definitely not for me, introduces too much thinking and tension. Need some balance between really committing to a line of aim vs staying loose and just firing at the balls with confidence. Been a definite backward slide for a month, and before that it wasn't great . Weird thing was after starting to shoot again in February and going through the normal reacquaintance phase, I was shooting really well a few months after, just lost my confidence or rhythm after that.

I frequently do an exercise that Jerry Briesath showed me, even if I don't always keep score. Throw out x number of balls - most people start with 3 or 4, then work their way up. Take ball in hand, and run the balls in order. The caveat - you have to run them "perfectly" - you can't overrun your position, leave yourself with crazy cut shots, really long shots, banks, etc. This is dependent on your ability as well, but you know when you messed up so to speak. If you do it, score a point. If you miss the ball or shape, score nothing, but you set it up again and figure out what you did wrong, even if means going back a ball or two. I will sometime repeat it multiple times to really hammer home the correct way if needed.

The goal is to complete 15 out of 20. When you can do that consistently, you add a ball. It's tougher than you think because of the "perfect" clause, no 3 rail recovery shots allowed…

For me, 3 or 4 balls is trivial, 5 is fairly easy, but add that 6th ball and it's a challenge to hit 15, requires good focus and consistency. Jerry said the best players in the world would have a tough time doing this with 7 balls and getting to 8, again because of the perfect clause - just think how many times a good player makes a full table cut shot, or a very thin cut, or a bank, or ends up good on a ball but not where they were intending to go, and retains their position at the table because of it.

Anyway, I'm usually 13 - 14 for 6 balls, so 65 - 70% let's say. But lately, it seems it's the opposite - I find some way to mess up 60 - 70% of the time! Just crazy, all sorts of things happening - missing balls because of lack of good aiming/eye movement/confirmation, because of english adjustments, because of poor mechanics or flinching/tension, etc. I think it all comes down to an overall lack of confidence frankly. At this point, just more and more self-analysis will have to do, since again I don't really have anyone who can help. I'm picking up little things here and there and just trying to work through them and come up with exercises or drills to ferret out stuff I really need to work on vs. just doing a quick fix that feels good for a while but will ultimately be worse in the long run.

Thanks again for the replies, every little bit helps…
Scott

FranCrimi · Nov 2, 2011

scottjen26 said:
Renfro, I totally hear you…

I know I'm totally guilty of overanalyzing stuff. However, I'm also convinced that my natural rhythm as is is not working - not feeling comfortable at the table, missing shots I normally wouldn't, overthinking things, etc. I really can't remember exactly how I used to shoot before I took a break, and certainly not the way I did 8 years ago, which before my 5 - 6 year break was when I was shooting my best. I've learned new things now, and in some ways know more and shoot better than I did back in the day, I just can't get it to stick on a consistent basis which is killing me.

Perhaps the rhythm is fine and something else is off, but it doesn't feel that way. I've tried to speed up even further, forget about any sort of CTE etc. and just shoot the way I used to, and it works - for a while. I've tried slowing down like I described, and while it helps to diagnose some things that slow rhythm is definitely not for me, introduces too much thinking and tension. Need some balance between really committing to a line of aim vs staying loose and just firing at the balls with confidence. Been a definite backward slide for a month, and before that it wasn't great . Weird thing was after starting to shoot again in February and going through the normal reacquaintance phase, I was shooting really well a few months after, just lost my confidence or rhythm after that.

I frequently do an exercise that Jerry Briesath showed me, even if I don't always keep score. Throw out x number of balls - most people start with 3 or 4, then work their way up. Take ball in hand, and run the balls in order. The caveat - you have to run them "perfectly" - you can't overrun your position, leave yourself with crazy cut shots, really long shots, banks, etc. This is dependent on your ability as well, but you know when you messed up so to speak. If you do it, score a point. If you miss the ball or shape, score nothing, but you set it up again and figure out what you did wrong, even if means going back a ball or two. I will sometime repeat it multiple times to really hammer home the correct way if needed.

The goal is to complete 15 out of 20. When you can do that consistently, you add a ball. It's tougher than you think because of the "perfect" clause, no 3 rail recovery shots allowed… For me, 3 or 4 balls is trivial, 5 is fairly easy, but add that 6th ball and it's a challenge to hit 15, requires good focus and consistency. Jerry said the best players in the world would have a tough time doing this with 7 balls and getting to 8, again because of the perfect clause - just think how many times a good player makes a full table cut shot, or a very thin cut, or a bank, or ends up good on a ball but not where they were intending to go, and retains their position at the table because of it.

Anyway, I'm usually 13 - 14 for 6 balls, so 65 - 70% let's say. But lately, it seems it's the opposite - I find some way to mess up 60 - 70% of the time! Just crazy, all sorts of things happening - missing balls because of lack of good aiming/eye movement/confirmation, because of english adjustments, because of poor mechanics or flinching/tension, etc. I think it all comes down to an overall lack of confidence frankly. At this point, just more and more self-analysis will have to do, since again I don't really have anyone who can help. I'm picking up little things here and there and just trying to work through them and come up with exercises or drills to ferret out stuff I really need to work on vs. just doing a quick fix that feels good for a while but will ultimately be worse in the long run.

Thanks again for the replies, every little bit helps…
Scott

Scott, have you ever watched Earl Strickland practice? It's all about finding his rhythm. When he first gets to the practice table he throws the balls out and shoots fast and loose ---He shoots long shots and shoots everything at a hard speed. He keeps shooting hard (and missing) until he starts to pocket balls more consistently. Then he starts to reel in his stroke. Then he throws out 15 balls and practices rotation.

I think that's a brilliant way to warm up your game. Everyone is so goal oriented that they often constrict their stroke right from the start. Earl accepts the early missing as he lets his stroke out and gradually finds his rhythm.

I ran into him practicing last week and I was very impressed with his routine. It made perfect sense to me. If you start tight it's harder to get loose but if you start loose, you're already ahead of the game.

BasementDweller · Nov 3, 2011

Scottjen26 -

***Not an Instructor but I love this topic***

I've had issues with this in the past also. What I finally figured out was instead of coming up with a certain number of warmup strokes I decided to focus more on my eye-pattern. Forcing the eyes to slow down and finding the right rhythm for them, as far as how they go back and forth from cue ball to object ball was the key for me -- not necessarily the number of practice strokes. Although I have found that I'm right around 5 practice strokes most of the time but I ABSOLUTELY DO NOT COUNT THESE STROKES. I tried that and it drove me crazy.

I really like having the pause at the back end of my stroke and I realized that the key to that is the eyes. I focus on the cue ball during my slow backstroke....pause while shifting my eyes to the object ball.....and shoot.

scottjen26 · Nov 3, 2011

Fran,

Great advice, as always - very impressed with your replies, especially since I've been able to start reading more on here again. I think I still have a VHS recording (!!) of one of your matches back in the day...

Your advice on loosening up applies to me for sure - I think in general, since I started playing again and trying to improve my consistency, I decided to adjust my old stroke to attempt to eliminate some of those misses that used to come from me being too loose. While I made a lot of shots that way, I could sometimes feel myself missing because of loose wrist action, or arm pumping, etc. Between that and my learning CTE/Pro1, and working on more mechanical adjustments for english, perhaps along the way I've become too regimented or mechanical in my approach. I thought I was doing the right thing to get better, but maybe not. Problem is now, even when I try to get back into that rhythm or frame of mind, I still miss, just for different reasons.

Definitely have quite a few options to explore. Changes I've made in the last 4 - 6 months:

- Refined my aiming, which overall has been a positive experience, thought it would help on longer, tougher shots and overall increase my ball pocketing percentage and consistency. It has, but now I feel like I rely more on the visualization and pivoting and less on actually looking at the ball and letting my brain feed back to me that I'm on or off the correct line of aim.

- Refined my english usage, I used to use a lot and was very comfortable with it but it was all done by feel. I decided since I was getting more precise with my shot making I would start using more center ball and accepting positions a bit more instead of tweaking everything with english to try and get perfect. Again, overall I think the right thing to do, but I got to the point I think where when I do use english if the mechanical adjustment doesn't work I miss the ball. Also, switching shafts and trying a 314 instead of a Z didn't help with this either, since the deflection is different enough to be a material difference

- Refined my preshot routine. Wasn't happy with my rhythm or eye movements, or lack thereof, so set out to perfect that. But I haven't found anything that just feels right, and I naturally seem to want to deviate from the norm on certain shots. Sometimes that Earl 2-stroke rhythm feels good, sometimes I need a slower approach, and it can vary from day to day and shot to shot. Not sure what to do about that

Anyway, even though I complain, I am a perfectionist and I'm still playing okay, just not to the level I used to or want to play at. Just trying to figure out what needs to happen to get there. Who knows, maybe the slump is just a precursor to an elevated state in my game once I get everything figured out.

BD - your comments on eye movements are right on, again something as I mentioned that I don't think I do well enough. I get very focused on the cue ball, even looking at the cue ball last on most shots, just the way I learned to shoot. I periodically try to look up at the OB, and while I still make the ball it just doesn't feel right. Probably need more practice time and commitment to that to change. So I'm still trying to figure out a way to incorporate better eye movement, and more focus on the OB or the aim line, into my routine. I've tried pausing as well at the back of my swing, and like that rhythm sometimes, but it's hard for me to move my eyes at that point, if I do it at all I prefer to move them at the pause before I initiate my stroke.

Scott

FranCrimi · Nov 3, 2011

scottjen26 said:
Fran,

Great advice, as always - very impressed with your replies, especially since I've been able to start reading more on here again. I think I still have a VHS recording (!!) of one of your matches back in the day... ........

Scott

Thanks for the kind words, Scott. I'm happy to report that my game is much improved and I continue to work on my game as time goes on. In the end, we're all students of the game.

FranCrimi · Nov 4, 2011

BasementDweller said:
Scottjen26 -

***Not an Instructor but I love this topic***

I've had issues with this in the past also. What I finally figured out was instead of coming up with a certain number of warmup strokes I decided to focus more on my eye-pattern. Forcing the eyes to slow down and finding the right rhythm for them, as far as how they go back and forth from cue ball to object ball was the key for me -- not necessarily the number of practice strokes. Although I have found that I'm right around 5 practice strokes most of the time but I ABSOLUTELY DO NOT COUNT THESE STROKES. I tried that and it drove me crazy.

I really like having the pause at the back end of my stroke and I realized that the key to that is the eyes. I focus on the cue ball during my slow backstroke....pause while shifting my eyes to the object ball.....and shoot.

I like your thinking. Like other sports, pool is a hand-eye coordination game. You picked out the most important aspects of your stroking process that are essential for your hand-eye coordination and focused on them.

Ratta · Nov 4, 2011

Ooooh yeah!!!

The Eye-Pattern- and how and when to move the eyes at the right moment is something, where many many people even dont think about. I see this so often, if i ask a guy about his *eye patterns*.......and he s looking at me like seeing a pink cow.....

I remember exactly when i was playing the 3 rd day after 10 years break from pool. RandyG was so nice and had a look at the short video. Just from one point of view....just running out a game of 9-ball-
What should i say- Randy immediatley told me...."hey Ingo, you were totally off with your eye-pattern...".
And all was good again...lol.
Off-Topic now: But Randy Goettlicher is such a knowledged and talented great guy- very thanksful that i ve met him-even if it was just about internet!

keep shooting,

lg
Ingo

Ratta · Nov 4, 2011

BasementDweller said:
Scottjen26 -

***Not an Instructor but I love this topic***

I've had issues with this in the past also. What I finally figured out was instead of coming up with a certain number of warmup strokes I decided to focus more on my eye-pattern. Forcing the eyes to slow down and finding the right rhythm for them, as far as how they go back and forth from cue ball to object ball was the key for me -- not necessarily the number of practice strokes. Although I have found that I'm right around 5 practice strokes most of the time but I ABSOLUTELY DO NOT COUNT THESE STROKES. I tried that and it drove me crazy.

I really like having the pause at the back end of my stroke and I realized that the key to that is the eyes. I focus on the cue ball during my slow backstroke....pause while shifting my eyes to the object ball.....and shoot.

Excellent!

scottjen26 · Nov 7, 2011

Just a quick update, since it may help others as well...

At the risk of ruining it, I think I may be on the road to recovery. Had a decent night Thursday for practice, not great but saw some minor improvements. Also got a chance to practice for a bit on Friday, and things really started coming together. I finally started to run single racks again without making dumb mistakes, even ran multiple racks a few times. That hasn't happened in a while, those mistakes were just creeping in everywhere.

Some things that helped:

- Focusing on my grip, based on advice I got here and from Stan Shuffett. Especially on Friday, I was feeling that I was holding the cue differently but in a very subtle way. Apparently a subtle and important way, something I made note of for the future. Made a HUGE difference to my stroke and confidence

- Focus on the object ball and shot at hand. I found that I slowed down when I needed to but kept up my rhythm on most routine shots, probably overall just slowed down 10 or 20 percent and it helped. Made sure I had good visual feedback on the shots, both when approaching the ball and while down on the shot, and paid more attention to my eye patterns and OB focus

- Establish that natural rhythm. I actually tried not to think about anything and just focused on making the balls, and found that I naturally slipped back into something very close to my former rhythm, and as I had more and more success with that it felt more and more natural

- Really paid attention to the new shaft I was trying, and stuck with it for both practice sessions. Found I was definitely tweaking too many shots with english improperly, with a bit of work I was able to get back to shooting shots requiring english effortlessly with some simple adjustments from my baseline center ball aim

Thanks again for the replies, it really helped reinforce some things and get me started down the right path again!
Scott

Number of practice strokes

scottjen26

AzB Silver Member

lee brett

www.leebrettpool.com

Scott Lee

AzB Silver Member

FranCrimi

AzB Silver Member

JoeyInCali

Maker of Joey Bautista Cues

FranCrimi

AzB Silver Member

The Renfro

Outsville.com

scottjen26

AzB Silver Member

The Renfro

Outsville.com

quadrary

Custom Leather Cue Cases

scottjen26

AzB Silver Member

FranCrimi

AzB Silver Member

BasementDweller

AzB Silver Member

scottjen26

AzB Silver Member

FranCrimi

AzB Silver Member

FranCrimi

AzB Silver Member

Ratta

Hearing the balls.....

Ratta

Hearing the balls.....

scottjen26

AzB Silver Member