Question about using BHE

LuckedOut · Aug 31, 2012

When using back hand english, is it better to line up the shot so that your stroke is straight and then adjust your back hand?......

.....or line up the shot so that when you adjust your back hand the stroke is now straight. :embarrassed2:

I hope I phrased this right. I'm asking the question because if I line up for canter ball, then adjust for english, I'm finding that my stroke plane is off to one side or the other.

I've been practicing BHE and it works much of the time for certain shots, just looking for the best method to line up so that my stroke plane is consistent.

SpiderWebComm · Aug 31, 2012

LuckedOut said:
When using back hand english, is it better to line up the shot so that your stroke is straight and then adjust your back hand?......

.....or line up the shot so that when you adjust your back hand the stroke is now straight. :embarrassed2:

I hope I phrased this right. I'm asking the question because if I line up for canter ball, then adjust for english, I'm finding that my stroke plane is off to one side or the other.

I've been practicing BHE and it works much of the time for certain shots, just looking for the best method to line up so that my stroke plane is consistent.

You're not stroking down your sight line with BHE. If you're looking for a consistent stroke plane, BHE isn't for you. With BHE, your cue's angle of attack into the face of the CB will vary greatly depending on the spin needed.

Hope that helps. For the record - I don't think anyone really has a consistent stroke plane. They might think they do, but I'm pretty sure it varies.

Patrick Johnson · Aug 31, 2012

LuckedOut said:
When using back hand english, is it better to line up the shot so that your stroke is straight and then adjust your back hand?......

.....or line up the shot so that when you adjust your back hand the stroke is now straight. :embarrassed2:

I hope I phrased this right. I'm asking the question because if I line up for canter ball, then adjust for english, I'm finding that my stroke plane is off to one side or the other.

I've been practicing BHE and it works much of the time for certain shots, just looking for the best method to line up so that my stroke plane is consistent.

The step that makes backhand english work is first lining up the shot as though you're going to shoot it centerball. If you can line up accurately for english without going through the steps, then you don't need backhand english.

pj
chgo

LuckedOut · Aug 31, 2012

Thanks SWC, the one thing I've tried to pay attention to when using BHE is that my cue goes straight back and through the cb to the line I have adjusted to.

Just didn't know what the better method was to arrive there.
BHE is the only method I've tried that works on back cutting a ball into the corner with inside english to go three rails with any consistency.

But then again, I'm fairly new to using a system for aiming with english, it works better than guessing.

Not Dead Ted · Aug 31, 2012

There is something to be said for looking at the cue ball last, when using BHE. This helps you make sure to stroke along the post pivot line, avoiding "steering" the cue back to the original aim line.

BilliardsAbout · Aug 31, 2012

Patrick Johnson said:
The step that makes backhand english work is first lining up the shot as though you're going to shoot it centerball. If you can line up accurately for english without going through the steps, then you don't need backhand english.

pj
chgo

Que? What do you mean here? I don't follow.

8pack · Aug 31, 2012

BilliardsAbout said:
Que? What do you mean here? I don't follow.

Just do this.. first lining up the shot as though you're going to shoot it centerball. Then pivot..

BeiberLvr · Aug 31, 2012

8pack said:
Just do this.. first lining up the shot as though you're going to shoot it centerball. Then pivot..

Yep, that's what I do, and I find it works pretty well.

Patrick Johnson · Aug 31, 2012

LuckedOut:
When using back hand english, is it better to line up the shot so that your stroke is straight and then adjust your back hand? ... or line up the shot so that when you adjust your back hand the stroke is now straight.

Click to expand...

Me:
The step that makes backhand english work is first lining up the shot as though you're going to shoot it centerball. If you can line up accurately for english without going through the steps, then you don't need backhand english.

Click to expand...

BilliardsAbout:
I don't follow.

Here's another stab at it:

Backhand english doesn't work if you don't first aim centerball, so the answer to LuckedOut's question is "line up the shot so that your stroke is straight and then adjust your back hand".

And by the way, regarding the other choice (prealigning to the after-pivot direction), if you know before pivoting which direction the cue will be stroked after pivoting then you probably don't need the pivot.

Is that any clearer?

pj
chgo

Shaky1 · Sep 1, 2012

8pack said:
Just do this.. first lining up the shot as though you're going to shoot it centerball. Then pivot..

That's how I do it too!

Cornerman · Sep 1, 2012

Fwiw, i normally do not start with a cueball center ball aim prior to pivoting. Of the dozen or two of the Houle-based systems, several do not start with a center ball on the cue ball.

To the original question, your final setup and warm up strokes should happen after the BHE pivot. If you are doing a Set, Pause, Finish stoke, there should be no difference whether you used BHE or not to adjust for english or to get your final stroke plane.

Find the Colin Colenso video.

Freddie

Patrick Johnson · Sep 1, 2012

So far in this thread we've talked about how to do "straight stroke" backhand english - pivoting the stick and then stroking straight in the new direction (the question was how to position the body for that).

Some sidebar info for those who may not know: There's another kind of BHE that uses a straight stroke and centerball aim for all the practice strokes and "swipes" only the last stroke sideways to apply "swiping" BHE. Some think that this puts more spin on the cue ball than a straight stroke. I think the loss of accuracy for no real gain is a bad bargain.

pj
chgo

Patrick Johnson · Sep 1, 2012

Cornerman said:
Fwiw, i normally do not start with a cueball center ball aim prior to pivoting. Of the dozen or two of the Houle-based systems, several do not start with a center ball on the cue ball.

You must use different pivot points...? Starting from one side of center are you able to apply sidespin in the other direction when needed?

pj
chgo

8pack · Sep 1, 2012

Patrick Johnson said:
So far in this thread we've talked about how to do "straight stroke" backhand english - pivoting the stick and then stroking straight in the new direction (the question was how to position the body for that).

Some sidebar info for those who may not know: There's another kind of BHE that uses a straight stroke and centerball aim for all the practice strokes and "swipes" only the last stroke sideways to apply "swiping" BHE. Some think that this puts more spin on the cue ball than a straight stroke. I think the loss of accuracy for no real gain is a bad bargain.

pj
chgo

This is how i apply english on most of my shots.I also think it puts more spin on the ball.With a ld shaft its not as tough as you think.

Cornerman · Sep 1, 2012

Patrick Johnson said:
You must use different pivot points...?

Probably, but not consciously. I think my cue's effective pivot point is pretty robust such that plus or minus an inch or so still gets the desired result.

But I think you're asking something else and I'm as guilty as anyone to not be able to explain how I aim.

Starting from one side of center are you able to apply sidespin in the other direction when needed?

Definitely!

8pack · Sep 1, 2012

swiping method

...................?

SpiderWebComm · Sep 1, 2012

8pack said:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3PQRSl3tr-I&list=UUjCcWYJAZOjA3F18A8iTL4g&index=9&feature=plcpFirst shot in this video im doing the swiping method.

Always like your videos -- the music always fits. The way you made the shot off the tit and had the music start banging to a crescendo was the nuts.

Ratta · Sep 2, 2012

8pack said:
This is how i apply english on most of my shots.I also think it puts more spin on the ball.With a ld shaft its not as tough as you think.

Well my friend- that s for sure something *how you imagine or feel*

Like PJ said, several guys using this *method*. And it works of course, too. Same principle just that you *kind of pivoting while your last stroke*. If you make it oldschooled way or like PJ said *while executing* will bring the same effect. But it s hard to discuss, what is easier or not. In my personal opinion the *static* way, to first sign up *like you would use no english* and then use BHE and pivot is easier.
lg
Ingo

Patrick Johnson · Sep 2, 2012

8pack said:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3PQRSl3tr-I&list=UUjCcWYJAZOjA3F18A8iTL4g&index=9&feature=plcpFirst shot in this video im doing the swiping method.

Nice out, Efren... including the swipe-stroke.

But I don't think there's anything you can do with a swiping motion that you couldn't do by lining up at the "swipe angle" and stroking straight.

pj
chgo

8pack · Sep 2, 2012

Patrick Johnson said:
Nice out, Efren... including the swipe-stroke.

But I don't think there's anything you can do with a swiping motion that you couldn't do by lining up at the "swipe angle" and stroking straight.

pj
chgo

Thanks

Im not positive you can get more using the swiping method, I just have been doing it for so long maybe I do it better than Bhe.

Question about using BHE

AzB Silver Member

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