10-ball Drop Early Rule

Cornerman

Cornerman

Cue Author...Sometimes
Silver Member
I'm trying to makes heads or tails of the wording of the Continuous Rule Play:


9.8 Continuous Play

... If a player nominates and legally pockets the ten ball prior to the ten ball being the last remaining ball, the ten ball is re-spotted and the shooter continues.


I'm making an assumption that they mean:

If a player legally pockets his nominated ball, but on the same stroke the 10-ball is pocketed, the 10-ball is immediately spotted and the shooter continues.

Is that correct?


Freddie <~~~ needs a rewrite
 
Cornerman said:
I'm making an assumption that they mean:

If a player legally pockets his nominated ball, but on the same stroke the 10-ball is pocketed, the 10-ball is immediately spotted and the shooter continues.

Is that correct?


Freddie <~~~ needs a rewrite
Click to expand...

I would hope that's what they meant. I can't imagine what else it could be.
 
Cornerman said:
I'm trying to makes heads or tails of the wording of the Continuous Rule Play:


9.8 Continuous Play

... If a player nominates and legally pockets the ten ball prior to the ten ball being the last remaining ball, the ten ball is re-spotted and the shooter continues.


I'm making an assumption that they mean:

If a player legally pockets his nominated ball, but on the same stroke the 10-ball is pocketed, the 10-ball is immediately spotted and the shooter continues.

Is that correct?


Freddie <~~~ needs a rewrite
Click to expand...

sounds to me like it means if you play the 10 ball on a combo or carom, the ten re-spots but you continue shooting. I've seen people play the ghost like this but never seen it in a tournament or money game
 
Sounds like they are saying you can call and sink the 10 early (even illegally?) with no penalty?
 
The three responses confirm that the wording is goofy.

Freddie <~~~ give the rules committee my number
 
Cornerman said:
I'm trying to makes heads or tails of the wording of the Continuous Rule Play:


9.8 Continuous Play

... If a player nominates and legally pockets the ten ball prior to the ten ball being the last remaining ball, the ten ball is re-spotted and the shooter continues.


I'm making an assumption that they mean:

If a player legally pockets his nominated ball, but on the same stroke the 10-ball is pocketed, the 10-ball is immediately spotted and the shooter continues.

Is that correct?


Freddie <~~~ needs a rewrite
Click to expand...

I don't think so - that's covered in the previous sentence. This is saying you can't make the 10-ball out of turn and win, even if you call it and it's a legal combination or carom; but you do get to continue shooting. So maybe someone has a 2-10 dead combination but no other shot. You call the 10, the 10 gets spotted out of the way, and now you have your open shot on the 2.

I think the wording is pretty clear, but I can't say I've ever seen 10-ball actually played that way.
 
It looks like they have eliminated the called combo on the ten for an early win.

This is the rule as of today:

9.8 Continuing Play
If the shooter legally pockets a called/nominated ball on a shot (except a push out, see 9.4 Second Shot of the Rack – Push Out), any additional balls pocketed remain pocketed (except the ten ball; see 9.9 Spotting Balls), and he continues at the table for the next shot. If a player nominates and legally pockets the ten ball prior to the ten ball being the last remaining ball, the ten ball is re-spotted and the shooter continues. If the shooter fails to pocket the called ball or fouls, play passes to the other player, and if no foul was committed, the incoming player must play the cue ball from the position left by the other player.

This is what I downloaded and printed about two years ago:

9.8 Continuing Play
If the shooter legally pockets a called/nominated ball on a shot (except a push out, see 9.4 Second Shot of the Rack – Push Out), any additional balls pocketed remain pocketed (except the ten ball; see 9.9 Spotting Balls), and he continues at the table for the next shot. If a player legally pockets the called ten ball on any shot (except a push out) he wins the rack. If the shooter fails to pocket the called ball or fouls, play passes to the other player, and if no foul was committed, the incoming player must play the cue ball from the position left by the other player.

Interestingly the "effective from" date on both versions is Jan 1 2009.:confused:
 
BRussell said:
I don't think so - that's covered in the previous sentence. This is saying you can't make the 10-ball out of turn and win, even if you call it and it's a legal combination or carom; but you do get to continue shooting. So maybe someone has a 2-10 dead combination but no other shot. You call the 10, the 10 gets spotted out of the way, and now you have your open shot on the 2.

I think the wording is pretty clear, but I can't say I've ever seen 10-ball actually played that way.
Click to expand...

Ah... that makes sense if they've taken early 10s away.

I can't stand that they keep changing the rules, but I can't stand it more if the wording is for crap.

"An early 10-ball does not win" explicitly said would be nice, considering this is a new rule change.


So this is saying we can call an early ten ball, make it, spot it back up, and then continue shooting????

Freddie
 
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oldschool1478 said:
It looks like they have eliminated the called combo on the ten for an early win.

This is the rule as of today:

9.8 Continuing Play
If the shooter legally pockets a called/nominated ball on a shot (except a push out, see 9.4 Second Shot of the Rack – Push Out), any additional balls pocketed remain pocketed (except the ten ball; see 9.9 Spotting Balls), and he continues at the table for the next shot. If a player nominates and legally pockets the ten ball prior to the ten ball being the last remaining ball, the ten ball is re-spotted and the shooter continues. If the shooter fails to pocket the called ball or fouls, play passes to the other player, and if no foul was committed, the incoming player must play the cue ball from the position left by the other player.

This is what I downloaded and printed about two years ago:

9.8 Continuing Play
If the shooter legally pockets a called/nominated ball on a shot (except a push out, see 9.4 Second Shot of the Rack – Push Out), any additional balls pocketed remain pocketed (except the ten ball; see 9.9 Spotting Balls), and he continues at the table for the next shot. If a player legally pockets the called ten ball on any shot (except a push out) he wins the rack. If the shooter fails to pocket the called ball or fouls, play passes to the other player, and if no foul was committed, the incoming player must play the cue ball from the position left by the other player.

Interestingly the "effective from" date on both versions is Jan 1 2009.:confused:
Click to expand...

This is funny too: The link that says "Download PDF" from the "General Rules" tab links to this, called "New Rules" and seems to have this new 10-ball rule: http://wpapool.com/pdf/web/WPA_New_Rules.pdf
It's dated March 15 2016.

But if you go to the same "Download PDF" link from any of the other tabs, it goes to this: http://wpapool.com/pdf/web/WPA_Rules.pdf
which are from 2007, and it doesn't even include 10-ball.
 
Cornerman said:
Ah... that makes sense if they've taken early 10s away.

I can't stand that they keep changing the rules, but I can't stand it more if the wording is for crap.

"An early 10-ball does not win" explicitly said would be nice, considering this is a new rule change.


So this is saying we can call an early ten ball, make it, spot it back up, and then continue shooting????

Freddie
Click to expand...

Some kind of "errata" or list of changes with dates would be nice, eh? And this would seem to be a pretty big change. Good catch. What do you think about the rule?
 
WPA changed the rules earlier this year.
However they didn't change the date saying when they were last modified.

The last few 10ball comps in Europe have been played using the new rules.

In a nutshell, to win the game you need to legally pocket the '10' when it is the last ball on the table. (if it is pocketed legally or illegally when there are other balls left, it is respotted)

And before someone says it, you can still win with the '3 fouls rule'
 
BRussell said:
Some kind of "errata" or list of changes with dates would be nice, eh? And this would seem to be a pretty big change. Good catch. What do you think about the rule?
Click to expand...

Agreed.

And I hate the rule changes, but I get what they're doing.

Freddie <~~~ too OCD for change
 
BRussell said:
Some kind of "errata" or list of changes with dates would be nice, eh? And this would seem to be a pretty big change. Good catch. What do you think about the rule?
Click to expand...
There were no changes to the rules themselves from 2008 until the revision this year.

My Billiards Digest column for October covers all of the changes I could find to both the Rules and the Regulations.

In addition, for the 2016 season, there are some trial rules for nine ball in force:

9-ball professional rule

In 2016 the following racking rule will be used. This rule change will be valid for all 2016 WPA Ranked events and will be then evaluated by the WPA General Assembly in order to make the final decision with regards to the change.

Additionally, three point rule will be used for all WPA events (See Regulations 18.Three Point rule) .

2.2 Nine Ball Rack

The object balls are racked as tightly as possible in a diamond shape, with the one ball moved two ball diameters up the table so that the nine ball is placed at the apex of the diamond and on the foot spot and in the middle of the diamond. The other balls will be placed in the diamond without purposeful or intentional pattern.
​

As for the wording of the "ten last" rule, it's a little tricky to get it right especially if you consider that the meaning has to be clear for those who are not native American Pool English speakers and for those who are new to the game. I think the current wording is unambiguous but it might have been better to fully reorganize the whole flow-of-play discussion. There is an error in the following rule (9.9) where the case of spotting a called early 10 is omitted.
 
Bob Jewett said:
... The object balls are racked as tightly as possible in a diamond shape, with the one ball moved two ball diameters up the table so that the nine ball is placed at the apex of the diamond and on the foot spot and in the middle of the diamond. The other balls will be placed in the diamond without purposeful or intentional pattern. ...
Click to expand...

That language is mixed up -- nine ball at the apex??

How about this, instead:

"The object balls are racked as tightly as possible in a diamond shape, with the one ball at the apex of the diamond and the nine ball in the middle of the diamond and on the foot spot. The other balls ... etc."

The language about moving the one ball two ball diameters up the table is unnecessary.
 
AtLarge said:
That language is mixed up -- nine ball at the apex??

How about this, instead:

"The object balls are racked as tightly as possible in a diamond shape, with the one ball at the apex of the diamond and the nine ball in the middle of the diamond and on the foot spot. The other balls ... etc."

The language about moving the one ball two ball diameters up the table is unnecessary.
Click to expand...

Also just to be pedantic, The '1' ball is not moved up 2 ball diameters....It is less..
 
GB Basher said:
Also just to be pedantic, The '1' ball is not moved up 2 ball diameters....It is less..
Click to expand...
"Two rows" would have gotten it.

There is a diagram that comes with the rule:

CropperCapture[50].png
 
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