Advice Needed On (possible) Pre-owned Cue Purchase

DJSTEVEZ

DJSTEVEZ

Professor of Human Moves
Silver Member
So I'm looking at this pre-owned cue for sale over the Internet. The cue is by a well respected cue maker (who is no longer with us) and is in the exact style I always wanted, using veneer colors I love, but rarely used by the cue maker.

The price is a little more than I wanted to spend, but I suspect the real asking price has been inflated so as to arrive at the real desired price by the seller after a little negotiating.

The issue is the current owner is the cue's 2nd owner and there's absolutely no documentation to support who the stick was made by. Outside of some ring-work upgrades, the cue is identical to a standard catalog offering by the cue maker from back in the 90s. There are more and more "replica" cues out there that are being passed off as made by the cue maker than ever before. To complicate matters further, I happen to know (through Jim Rockford like investigation) this cue's seller is friendly with an up and coming cue maker in his area.

What say you all?
 
Have you considered getting the cue independently appraised?

George Balabushka is no longer with us and his cues are in demand. So it's my understanding Pete Tascarella, Mark Kulungian will inspect and authenticate a cue for a service fee.
 
DJSTEVEZ said:
To complicate matters further, I happen to know (through Jim Rockford like investigation) this cue's seller is friendly with an up and coming cue maker in his area.
Click to expand...

I'm friends with a few up & comer cuemakers myself.
If if the sellers relationship with this up & coming cuemaker worries you it shouldn't, it's those shifty old timers that scare me.
 
Here are pics of the cue. I know nothing of the seller or his standing and reputation. I don't want it to be construed that I'm casting doubt on the seller or for it to be inferred that I think he is anything less than 100% honest. These are MY concerns about the circumstances of the conditions of the possible sale.

In spite of the suggestions here, I won't name the seller. I didn't want to name the cue manufactirer of the cue, but with pics it's going to be obvious. The cue is clearly only a slight variation on the Scruggs model # 24 cue from one of his (circa) 1990s catalogs.

I have thought about having the cue independently verified by a separate cue maker I know to be a friend of & expert on Tim's work.

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Escrow is always an option. You get some level of protection and if there is any funny business going on, you are not out a bunch of money.
 
DJSTEVEZ said:
So I'm looking at this pre-owned cue for sale over the Internet. The cue is by a well respected cue maker (who is no longer with us) and is in the exact style I always wanted, using veneer colors I love, but rarely used by the cue maker.

The price is a little more than I wanted to spend, but I suspect the real asking price has been inflated so as to arrive at the real desired price by the seller after a little negotiating.

The issue is the current owner is the cue's 2nd owner and there's absolutely no documentation to support who the stick was made by. Outside of some ring-work upgrades, the cue is identical to a standard catalog offering by the cue maker from back in the 90s. There are more and more "replica" cues out there that are being passed off as made by the cue maker than ever before. To complicate matters further, I happen to know (through Jim Rockford like investigation) this cue's seller is friendly with an up and coming cue maker in his area.

What say you all?
Click to expand...

i havent read any replies
my 2 cents
if there is no marking on who made the cue
pass and buy another one
 
If you have to have it, ask Bob Frey to act as an escrow and write you a letter. Make sure he puts in writing that the inlays and logo are original to the cue.
 
If this is the cue in question I have no problem backing my claim.....I've owned a couple of these cues in similar fashion and I am willing to have this Cue verified by Mark Kulungian or by The cue maker too if needed to sell. Please contact me with any questions or concerns: chefboyjp@yahoo.com.

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Sent from my iPad using AzBilliards Forums
 
I used to own a similar Tim Scruggs cue except with different veneer colors, original wrap, and sharper inlays.
Same basic design, solid ivory joint, radial, and the same ringwork.

Looks like a nice one, collectible for sure
 
When you spend this much moola, always be as certain as you can.
Bob Frey's name was mentioned & here's another to consider as well.

Nick Serdula.....contact him and ask if he'd buy the cue as an original TS.
That man knows more about TS cues than most mere mortals on Az.


Matt B.
 
Of the hundreds and hundreds of Tim Scruggs cues that have been resold over the years, one that is obviously a Scruggs needs authentication from Bob Frey?
Sounds ridiculous to me, we are not talking about a Balabushka or Szamboti here, Tim Scruggs make thousands of cues over the years.
This is a very typical ivory jointed Tim Scruggs cue, with what looks like a nicely done refinish-rewrap.

There's nothing wrong with this cue being refinished and rewrapped by someone other that the Scruggs shop.
Many classic cues need refinish, repair, new shafts, and if the guy isn't around and someone wants a nice TS cue, there isn't a choice.
It is what it is, which is not a problem unless the work is poorly done.
This cue is still a players cue, not a wall hanger.
The fact that it was played with and needed some work could mean that it plays really good.

Edit: Now that I have a better screen, it looks original, not refinished
 
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cuesblues said:
Of the hundreds and hundreds of Tim Scruggs cues that have been resold over the years, one that is obviously a Scruggs needs authentication from Bob Frey?
Sounds ridiculous to me, we are not talking about a Balabushka or Szamboti here, Tim Scruggs make thousands of cues over the years.
This is a very typical ivory jointed Tim Scruggs cue, with what looks like a nicely done refinish-rewrap.

There's nothing wrong with this cue being refinished and rewrapped by someone other that the Scruggs shop.
Many classic cues need refinish, repair, new shafts, and if the guy isn't around and someone wants a nice TS cue, there isn't a choice.
It is what it is, which is not a problem unless the work is poorly done.
This cue is still a players cue, not a wall hanger.
The fact that it was played with and needed some work could mean that it plays really good.

Edit: Now that I have a better screen, it looks original, not refinished
Click to expand...

Cuesblues, thank you for your expertse and taking the time to share it with me. The gentleman I've corresponded with indicated that the cue is circa 27 years old and both of the (matching) shafts are original, including the tips, as is everything else on the cue. He said the 1st owner learned his wife was pregnant shortly after receiving the cue which was a custom order directly from Tim's shop. As one might expect, his Pool playing abruptly ended shortly thereafter. Some years went by and he put it up for sale to the present owner & current seller. The current seller has owned the cue for some time. If the tips on the cue are still original I would imagine the second owner didn't really play with the cue very much and probably bought the stick for its beauty and perhaps as an investment.

Again, the question is, is this a Tim Scruggs cue or just a real good replica?
I'm very reluctant to spend that kind of cash without some documentation.
I think we need someone to open a Cue Fax type of service for the buying & selling of pre-ownerd cues, lol. -Z-
 
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I'm sorry and I'm not an expert on who made what but that cue looks like a Scruggs to me. What makes you think it may be a knockoff? I didn't know people were knocking off Scruggs cues, except maybe a couple sneaky petes.
If they are I would like to know about it.
 
DJSTEVEZ said:
Cuesblues, thank you for your expertse and taking the time to share it with me. The gentleman I've corresponded with indicated that the cue is circa 27 years old and both of the (matching) shafts are original, including the tips, as is everything else on the cue. He said the 1st owner learned his wife was pregnant shortly after receiving the cue which was a custom order directly from Tim's shop. As one might expect, his Pool playing abruptly ended shortly thereafter. Some years went by and he put it up for sale to the present owner & current seller. The current seller has owned the cue for some time. If the tips on the cue are still original I would imagine the second owner didn't really play with the cue very much and probably bought the stick for its beauty and perhaps as an investment.

Again, the question is, is this a Tim Scruggs cue or just a real good replica?
I'm very reluctant to spend that kind of cash without some documentation.
I think we need someone to open a Cue Fax type of service for the buying & selling of pre-ownerd cues, lol. -Z-
Click to expand...

I don't know the price of this cue, but mine was a little nicer, unchalked, and at the time $3200 was considered to be "retail"
Now that Tim & Mike are gone, RIP to them, factor in everything and I think this is a $3200 cue.
The prices for TS cues with ivory joints go up exponentially.
 
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