Affect of damaged subrails on play

I can't remember the proper nose height of the cushions but I've read the older tables rails have a different angle than newer tables so when the newer style cushions are installed the nose height is a 1/16 or 1/8" high and the balls are not hitting squarely on the nose therefore causing it to not bounce as it should.

Humidity and loose clothe will also slow it way down
 
poolfencer said:
I tried searching but could not find a post regarding this issue. I have a table overy 100 years old that came from the USO in San Jose, ca. The rails were damaged over the years and the repairs were done very poorly. In some places the featherboards have to be tacked to stay because the slot is loose. Even with new cushions it has never had the bounce I would expect. My suspicion is the subrails. Any thoughts?
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Many responses here but there is a question that hasn't been addressed. You said the rails played dead. You did not say the rails play dead in certain spots. If the rails were damaged, the bounce would only be effected in those areas. The way you describe it they're dead all the way around. That is definitely a cushion profile problem.

Even if the cushion nose is at the proper height, which I kind of doubt, the cushion is at the wrong angle. It sounds to me they are angled up too much.
 
buckshotshoey said:
A little reading for the OP.... and everyone for that matter...

Pool Table Cushion Nose Height Effects - Dr. Dave Pool Info

Answers to frequently-asked questions about pool table cushion nose height.
billiards.colostate.edu billiards.colostate.edu

Championship rubber rail cushion height guide for Tour Edition

AllPool.net’s rail cushion height guide for Championship Tour Edition K-66 and K-55 for pool and billiard tables.
www.pooltablefeltcloth.com www.pooltablefeltcloth.com
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Could also be just old wood gone bad. New SR's and correct profile rubber will probably take care of his issues
 
garczar said:
Could also be just old wood gone bad. New SR's and correct profile rubber will probably take care of his issues
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Agreed... it could be a glue issue... but that would usually make spotty dead rail conditions, not usually all the way around equally.
 
I found this posted by RKC in a thread in the mechanic's section and thought it applied here.

"Ask anyone what the nose height is suppose to be and they'll tell you its 63 1/2% +/- 1% of the ball height, so 1 25/64ths to 1 29/64ths of an inch, or for simple purposes, 1 7/16", but they fail to understand that rule only applys if the rails are 1 11/16" thick, not 1 5/8" to 1 1/2" thick, those don't play right with a 1 7/16" nose height!"
 
Thanks for all of the replies. The nose height is 1 3/8 inches but the question of cushion angle is a good one since the issue does seem to be on all rails. Rexus had a good idea of posting this question in the mechanics section. Think I will give that a try.
 
poolfencer said:
Thanks for all of the replies. The nose height is 1 3/8 inches but the question of cushion angle is a good one since the issue does seem to be on all rails. Rexus had a good idea of posting this question in the mechanics section. Think I will give that a try.
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Cushion height may be too low. Do you know if the table had the original Brunswick Monarch cushions prior to the SuperSpeeds?
 
poolfencer said:
I am a pretty good woodworker, I have a complete shop and have made many musical instruments as well as furniture so I am not intimidated by the challenge. The cushions are Brunswick superspeeds that I put on so I think they are pretty decent.
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Superspeeds don't have to be the appropriate profile.
 
The sub rails may have been replaced before since it is an old table and may not have been done to specs. You could put a lot of money in the repair and end up with junk. Believe me get a real professional like (mentioned earlier) Trent in Toledo, Ohio or the Real King Cobra in the mechanics section. The typical person that recovers tables is not the person for your job.
 
Tennesseejoe said:
The sub rails may have been replaced before since it is an old table and may not have been done to specs. You could put a lot of money in the repair and end up with junk. Believe me get a real professional like (mentioned earlier) Trent in Toledo, Ohio or the Real King Cobra in the mechanics section. The typical person that recovers tables is not the person for your job.
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Jack Zimmerman would be another good choice for sounding board.
 
poolfencer said:
I tried searching but could not find a post regarding this issue. I have a table overy 100 years old that came from the USO in San Jose, ca. The rails were damaged over the years and the repairs were done very poorly. In some places the featherboards have to be tacked to stay because the slot is loose. Even with new cushions it has never had the bounce I would expect. My suspicion is the subrails. Any thoughts?
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These are T-rails, so they bolt into the slate from the side. The fact that you mentioned the loose feather strip, and being nailed in is an indication the rail liner the cushions are mounted to have pulled loose from the nails and glue used to mount them to the slate rail base, so it don't matter how tight you bolt them, the rail liner has play in it, like a Valley bar table with real loose rail bolts.
 
realkingcobra said:
Balls don't jump off the rails if the nose height is too high
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I believe you, however my old T rail table had high rails and when a ball was hit hard I could hear the ball jump a little . Not enough to see it jump but the sound was there.

I sure wish I knew about you when I had my old BBC Newport redone. It was a mess even after he did it twice. It is still not perfect in the pocket corner facings.
 
Tennesseejoe said:
I believe you, however my old T rail table had high rails and when a ball was hit hard I could hear the ball jump a little . Not enough to see it jump but the sound was there.

I sure wish I knew about you when I had my old BBC Newport redone. It was a mess even after he did it twice. It is still not perfect in the pocket corner facings.
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That little jumping sound you hear, but don't really see if hit hard is the ball being pressed downward on the slate so hard that when it banks off the cushion its deflecting up a little off the bed cloth then rolling out of it. It kind of sounds like a clicking sound, but not a jumping sound.
 
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