Am I crazy or do side pockets on 7 ft tables play bigger for scratches than 9 ft?

Coos Cues said:
Was in the process of a routine runout last night in league when I scratched in the side while shooting the 8 ball. I wanted to come off the side rail a bit shy of the side pocket on two rails to approach the 9 correctly instead of across the shape zone. I shot a tip of outside and I cut the 8 right down the middle of the pocket had it not scratched in the side it would have rolled right into the zone so the speed was correct My team mate who plays maybe a little better than me told me I should have used inside to avoid that rail altogether but that bring the speed margin of error way down and risks a tougher nine ball. I hate to approach the shape zone across it but not as much as I hate giving a game away like tht.

I was genuinely surprised to scratch and play mostly on my 9 foot table at home. So I set the shot up at home today and never came within a half diamond of scratching on a lot of tries.

So my question is, I know the two sizes are the same length/width relationship but is there something about the smaller table that brings that side pocket into play on shots like this that is different than a nine footer? I swear there is but can't wrap my mind around how this could be from a geometry/physics standpoint. I feel the side pocket gets me a lot more often on 7 footers than 9 shooting the same shots the same way Am I nuts?
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You "outside English" guys,..... 🤷‍♂️
I will Agree with your friend and avoid the side rail in that case. A bit of Inside, increase speed a little and adjust your point of aim for the inside spin.
7ft. tables do have a larger area of vulnerability due the fact the pocket sizes are the same yet the distance has changed. How often do you see scratches when they run rails on a snooker table?
 
Cornerman said:
Feels like the 4:5 ratio is all you need 240” to 300”. The side pocket for a 9’ Diamond is 5”, so a theoretical 7’ table with equal pocket-to-rail relationship should be 4” .
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I kept it simple, since the side pocket was all that was being discussed.

5" pocket on 100" of surface = 5%
5% of 78" of surface = 3.9".

Margin of error = WGAF
 
jimmyco said:
I kept it simple, since the side pocket was all that was being discussed.

5" pocket on 100" of surface = 5%
5% of 78" of surface = 3.9".

Margin of error = WGAF
Click to expand...
This is the same simple math. The only difference is using 78 vs 80, which are two of the variants of bar tables.
 
Coos Cues said:
Was in the process of a routine runout last night in league when I scratched in the side while shooting the 8 ball. I wanted to come off the side rail a bit shy of the side pocket on two rails to approach the 9 correctly instead of across the shape zone. I shot a tip of outside and I cut the 8 right down the middle of the pocket had it not scratched in the side it would have rolled right into the zone so the speed was correct My team mate who plays maybe a little better than me told me I should have used inside to avoid that rail altogether but that bring the speed margin of error way down and risks a tougher nine ball. I hate to approach the shape zone across it but not as much as I hate giving a game away like tht.

I was genuinely surprised to scratch and play mostly on my 9 foot table at home. So I set the shot up at home today and never came within a half diamond of scratching on a lot of tries.

So my question is, I know the two sizes are the same length/width relationship but is there something about the smaller table that brings that side pocket into play on shots like this that is different than a nine footer? I swear there is but can't wrap my mind around how this could be from a geometry/physics standpoint. I feel the side pocket gets me a lot more often on 7 footers than 9 shooting the same shots the same way Am I nuts?
Click to expand...
No, not crazy. There's more overall linear pocket opening on a 7 foot table, even with the same sized pockets on a 9 foot table. And if it's a slop bucket it's even worse. I shoot your shot but aim to come no where near the side pocket. Looking at your diagram I think I'd aim one diamond from the side pocket to come about 3" off the rail and take a little tougher cut on the 9.
 
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No English at all with that cut angle, normal running cue ball gets the job done. I know amateurs love English. Side pockets are at least a1/2” wider than corners and love to suck in cue balls🤣

Everyone loves the cue you made me
 
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Sheldon said:
9' Diamond is 50x100" with 28" of pocket. 28 is 9.33333% of 300 (fudging a bit here since there is actually around 264.5" of rail if you subtract the pockets.)
7' Valley is 40x80" so 9.33333% of 240 is 22.399992
If the sides and corners of the valley are the same, they will be 3.733332" (22.399992/6)
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Isn't it the 7' Diamond thats 40" x 80" and the Valley is 38" x 76"??
 
Sheldon said:
Real old Valley tables were 38" wide. the newer ones are 40.
I just put some Penguin Pro rails on an old 38" one, and the pockets are really narrow. :LOL:
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When you say old and new how old and new are we talking? I don't think I have seen a 40" x 80" Valley yet. Are the pockets on new Valleys more Diamond like? I think I read on Valley's website about the new and improved Valley's, I think they mentioned something about improved rails, I would like to try one out.
 
Newer Valleys have 5 bolt rails, instead of 3 bolt. More consistent, less dead spots. Not much else is different. For what they are intended to be, they are pretty good.
 
They play bigger because the pockets are the same size, yet the tables are not the same size.
 
Dunnn51 said:
You "outside English" guys,..... 🤷‍♂️
I will Agree with your friend and avoid the side rail in that case. A bit of Inside, increase speed a little and adjust your point of aim for the inside spin.
7ft. tables do have a larger area of vulnerability due the fact the pocket sizes are the same yet the distance has changed. How often do you see scratches when they run rails on a snooker table?
Click to expand...
I'm not really an outside guy and can shoot inside very confidently it's the approach to the shape zone I was worried a about running across it instead of floating into it. Both my home table and the one at league are diamonds.
 
Side pockets on Valley 7’ tables are obscenely big and with a short shelf on all the pockets.
Goodness gracious, how absurd playing on a much smaller table with even larger openings
instead of smaller pockets. A 7’ table should have 4 1/4” CP and 4 3/4” SP, not bigger than
a 9’ table pockets. I know it’s for recreational pool but gosh, it’s intended to be a game of skill.
 
My 8' Valley table has 4-1/4" corners and 4-1/2" sides with Ridgeback Pro rails on it. Plays great.
 
Coos Cues said:
Was in the process of a routine runout last night in league when I scratched in the side while shooting the 8 ball. I wanted to come off the side rail a bit shy of the side pocket on two rails to approach the 9 correctly instead of across the shape zone. I shot a tip of outside and I cut the 8 right down the middle of the pocket had it not scratched in the side it would have rolled right into the zone so the speed was correct My team mate who plays maybe a little better than me told me I should have used inside to avoid that rail altogether but that bring the speed margin of error way down and risks a tougher nine ball. I hate to approach the shape zone across it but not as much as I hate giving a game away like tht.

I was genuinely surprised to scratch and play mostly on my 9 foot table at home. So I set the shot up at home today and never came within a half diamond of scratching on a lot of tries.

So my question is, I know the two sizes are the same length/width relationship but is there something about the smaller table that brings that side pocket into play on shots like this that is different than a nine footer? I swear there is but can't wrap my mind around how this could be from a geometry/physics standpoint. I feel the side pocket gets me a lot more often on 7 footers than 9 shooting the same shots the same way Am I nuts?
Click to expand...

Well if you play the same position area, 1/2 a diamond off the side on a 9 footer will bring you to right about the side pocket on a 7 footer. Plus are these the same model table with the same cloth and rails? There are a ton of random tables that have rolls into the pockets or some other quirk.
 
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