....And you wonder why they now play poker?

Handsumm

Handsumm

Banned
Let's face it....poker has a lot more attention nowadays than the great game of pool. The idea that one get win millions their first time in a big tournament has brought out all of the poker hopefuls (players call them 'fish') trying to become an instant star. With the ESPN World Series coverage and the online community, there are now more poker players than ever.....and that means MORE MONEY.

I always here people ask why there is no money in pool. Why do the very best players still only bring in 6 figures.

For example, I just watched the "Fatboy / Bucktooth video." Both claim to have huge bankrolls, and woof up all sorts of nonsense everytime they are seen. What did Fatboy have in the bag? 100 grand maybe? That ain't no F-ckin' bankroll!! They might have more cash and/or more gamble than most pool players, but that is by no means (in the gambling world) a big bankroll.

Look at high stakes poker. Those guys have bankrolls. $500,000 buy-ins on national television. You don't ever see that kind of money in the pool world. Or that kind of coverage. ESPN recently even outsourced the filming at the WPBA nationals. There is no money in it for them. So my question is this..

Why does "high-stakes" have completely different meanings in the pool world as opposed to the poker world? I have seen and heard of many poker players that used to play pool, but realized that there is considerably more money in poker. They occasionally match up for high stakes, but probably only with other poker players or high stakes gamblers, not professional pool players.

Until there are thousands of amateur pool players lining up to play Shane or Efren or Busta, etc. there will be no true "High Stakes" gambling on pool like we see on tv for poker.

Although that would be nice......

The only way I see a tv show in which average players can gamble high stakes with pros is if they gave up ungodly weight, which obviously isn't necessary (and not really possible) in poker.

My 3 cents
 
What really slays me are those pool/poker players that bawk when you ask for some 20-50 sets and they say they won't play for that much money, yet the same person drops 400-1k at a poker table. I don't get it.

Televised poker has really hurt my side business. :(
 
belmicah said:
Let's face it....poker has a lot more attention nowadays than the great game of pool. The idea that one get win millions their first time in a big tournament has brought out all of the poker hopefuls (players call them 'fish') trying to become an instant star. With the ESPN World Series coverage and the online community, there are now more poker players than ever.....and that means MORE MONEY.

I always here people ask why there is no money in pool. Why do the very best players still only bring in 6 figures.

For example, I just watched the "Fatboy / Bucktooth video." Both claim to have huge bankrolls, and woof up all sorts of nonsense everytime they are seen. What did Fatboy have in the bag? 100 grand maybe? That ain't no F-ckin' bankroll!! They might have more cash and/or more gamble than most pool players, but that is by no means (in the gambling world) a big bankroll.

Look at high stakes poker. Those guys have bankrolls. $500,000 buy-ins on national television. You don't ever see that kind of money in the pool world. Or that kind of coverage. ESPN recently even outsourced the filming at the WPBA nationals. There is no money in it for them. So my question is this..

Why does "high-stakes" have completely different meanings in the pool world as opposed to the poker world? I have seen and heard of many poker players that used to play pool, but realized that there is considerably more money in poker. They occasionally match up for high stakes, but probably only with other poker players or high stakes gamblers, not professional pool players.

Until there are thousands of amateur pool players lining up to play Shane or Efren or Busta, etc. there will be no true "High Stakes" gambling on pool like we see on tv for poker.

Although that would be nice......

The only way I see a tv show in which average players can gamble high stakes with pros is if they gave up ungodly weight, which obviously isn't necessary (and not really possible) in poker.

My 3 cents
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That's because ANYBODY can play poker. Seriously, you can buy a book and be competent within a day. Pool takes serious time to master and being able to make the final rounds of a major pool event is simply unachieveable for 99.999% of the pool playing world. However, any accountant with $40 can find himself at the final table of The World Series of Poker so long as his pocket 8s happen to trump Aces.
 
Jude Rosenstock said:
That's because ANYBODY can play poker. Seriously, you can buy a book and be competent within a day. Pool takes serious time to master and being able to make the final rounds of a major pool event is simply unachieveable for 99.999% of the pool playing world. However, any accountant with $40 can find himself at the final table of The World Series of Poker so long as his pocket 8s happen to trump Aces.
Click to expand...

Awesomely said, Jude
You get a greeenie

Or, you would if the powers that be would let me
 
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Poker is more popular with people because it has more excuses. If you get beat playing pool you got out played. If you get beat playing poker there are umpteen reasons why you got beat that prevents you from looking like a loser. It doesn't take much heart to play poker. All you have to do is get a bankroll, read a book, and sit on your ass and you can be a good poker player. Grab a bankroll, read a book, and get in the box and see how you do.
 
To piggyback on what Jude said......
Which scenarion do you feel you have a better chance?
Playing a hand with Doyle Brunson, or playing a game of one pocket with Efren?

The more people like their odds, the more people will play.
 
I agree and I disagree...

Grab a bankroll, read a book, play a poker tournament/ordinary cash game at the nearest casino. You might do alright.

Grab a bankroll, read a book, sit down at GSN's High Stakes Poker game. I guarantee your face will get smashed.
 
Until there are thousands of amateur pool players lining up to play Shane or Efren or Busta, etc. there will be no true "High Stakes" gambling on pool like we see on tv for poker.


That is the reason. Poker is more of a game and pool is more of a sport. An amateur has a fighting chance against pro. It's even possible, especially live, for an weaker player to crush superior players for a year if variance is his friend.

It's the perfect suckers' game. Mediocre players who run hot often over estimate their ability, and when the odds finally catch up with them, they blame luck. After going bust, they scrap together another stake and just keep coming back.

I started a thread about a TV show idea I had called "High Stakes Pool" where wealthy amateurs can match up with pros.

http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=77342

I'd think it'd be interesting to see a pro play giving up huge weight. There'd be a lot of drama to see if he can outrun the 4 out he's giving to Joe Moneybags. Also, it'd be fun to see pool played at a lower level. Joe Moneybags, big ego and a D level game, has 3 simple balls to run for the cash and screws it up. I love pro pool, but sometimes it's monotonous. Run out, run out, run out. Missed shots equal drama.
 
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jude is right. pool is an amazing, beautiful game that takes years to achieve a decent level of competency, and the beauty of the game is subtle and mostly only understood when you can play a bit yourself.

poker is just a means to an end. an easy to learn card game with a heavy degree of luck to ensure everybody is in with a chance. hence it's popularity.
 
The obvious answer here lies in the the time it takes to become competent enough to make money. Now I know there is talk of pool players going over to poker because of the money. This is something that we should unpack a little. There is not anything inherent in playing pool well, that makes one succeed in poker. Nobody mentions this when we talk about players switching games. We shouldn't assume that these guys are making tons of money. If everybody is winning nobody is losing, and I know that is certainly not the case. More likely they simply enjoy playing poker more, because it takes much less work and time to learn, and the reward is much greater. And that is the crux of the issue, skill vs. luck. At no point could I go and compete in the world pool championships and think im going to come out on top. The motto for the World pool championships ISNT anyone can win. You can go buy a few books, watch a few episodes of poker on ESPN, and set up a couple of online poker accounts, and your well on your way to being able to compete with world class poker players. On a pool table there are no bad beats, and in poker there are no handicaps. So its the catch 22, it involves much more money because its popular, its popular because its easy, its easy because anybody can do it, anybody can do it because there is a lot of luck involved, and none of these things can be said of pool in the degree they can be in poker.
 
There is more money to be made in Poker, than Pool. This is the Dollars, and Cents of it.
zipmouth.gif
 
RunoutalloverU said:
There is not anything inherent in playing pool well, that makes one succeed in poker.
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Those pool players that go over to poker all have one trait in common. They were all adept gamblers....that is the reason why they succeed over in poker IMO.
 
DGunter said:
Those pool players that go over to poker all have one trait in common. They were all adept gamblers....that is the reason why they succeed over in poker IMO.
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Ummm, I still don't see the direct correlation. Negotiating a spot in 9-ball, and making a call on the river are two different things.
 
CocoboloCowboy said:
There is more money to be made in Poker, than Pool. This is the Dollars, and Cents of it.
zipmouth.gif
Click to expand...
Because there are more suckers in poker.:D
I know a person or two who have become lowlifes because of poker.
Gambling is a disease.
 
So what?

Actually, I do not see this as a real problem for me personally.

You might call me a chicken, or even a Klingon, but:

Pool is not a gambling entertainment for me, I meet with friends to play a friendly game. We even share the table-rent, and play alternating breaks. After an evening, we don't need to look into our pockets to decide who was the best player - it's a simple calculation. :rolleyes:

In my opinion, the problem with pool is that it is on the borderline between a gamble and a sport. Some get the kick from beating the odds and earning money doing so, others play for the fun of it. However, even the money-gamblers try to disguise their approach as a sport.

What's more: Even if pool were a "pure" sport or even a "pure" gamble, there is still the old effect of changing trends: People played tennis in the 80's, golf in the 90's, and play poker nowadays. There might come a new time for pool, but there is probably no way to force that.

In the meantime, try to find your personal way to enjoy pool. If you need high stakes of x00,000.00 USD to find it, it's probably best to change your hobby.

Regards,

Detlev
 
What is being left out of this equation is that you don't have to WIN the poker tournament to make a LOT of money.

In Pool most travel to a regional event in hopes of just breaking even after expenses.


Also...pretty much in line with what has already been said...SVB made a good chunk of change this year at the DCC....I would be willing to bet you WON"T see his Mom playing next year...

You will see a few "Moms" in the WSOP next year.
 
BRKNRUN said:
What is being left out of this equation is that you don't have to WIN the poker tournament to make a LOT of money.

In Pool most travel to a regional event in hopes of just breaking even after expenses.


Also...pretty much in line with what has already been said...SVB made a good chunk of change this year at the DCC....I would be willing to bet you WON"T see his Mom playing next year...

You will see a few "Moms" in the WSOP next year.
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Good post, an overlooked aspect. I actually played with shirley williams one night at a local casino for 3 or 4 hours, nice lady, not sure im going to be shooting with shane's mom anytime soon.
 
Poker affords people the opportunity for SHORT TERM success. Thats why you see such diversity in tournament winners. However, there is a huge difference between tournaments and cash games. It is just like any other game or discipline, the better player is gonna win in the LONG RUN. I can go to a game and lose $2000, but if I win the other 4 out of 5 times in the same game and win $5-$10,000 then I've accomplished my goal. The better player can get beat in poker for sure , but the better players know that its a marathon and not a sprint.

Coincindentally, I know a little about this as I have played a ton of poker over the past 6-7 years. I get as upset as anyone when I take a bad beat and its hard to get past some of them, but I average around $500/week profit from my live game and have won on average $20,000/year for the past 4 years on the internet.
 
belmicah said:
Let's face it....poker has a lot more attention nowadays than the great game of pool. The idea that one get win millions their first time in a big tournament has brought out all of the poker hopefuls (players call them 'fish') trying to become an instant star. With the ESPN World Series coverage and the online community, there are now more poker players than ever.....and that means MORE MONEY.

I always here people ask why there is no money in pool. Why do the very best players still only bring in 6 figures.

For example, I just watched the "Fatboy / Bucktooth video." Both claim to have huge bankrolls, and woof up all sorts of nonsense everytime they are seen. What did Fatboy have in the bag? 100 grand maybe? That ain't no F-ckin' bankroll!! They might have more cash and/or more gamble than most pool players, but that is by no means (in the gambling world) a big bankroll.

Look at high stakes poker. Those guys have bankrolls. $500,000 buy-ins on national television. You don't ever see that kind of money in the pool world. Or that kind of coverage. ESPN recently even outsourced the filming at the WPBA nationals. There is no money in it for them. So my question is this..

Why does "high-stakes" have completely different meanings in the pool world as opposed to the poker world? I have seen and heard of many poker players that used to play pool, but realized that there is considerably more money in poker. They occasionally match up for high stakes, but probably only with other poker players or high stakes gamblers, not professional pool players.

Until there are thousands of amateur pool players lining up to play Shane or Efren or Busta, etc. there will be no true "High Stakes" gambling on pool like we see on tv for poker.

Although that would be nice......

The only way I see a tv show in which average players can gamble high stakes with pros is if they gave up ungodly weight, which obviously isn't necessary (and not really possible) in poker.

My 3 cents
Click to expand...


This is an apples and oranges comparison. The skill level demands are not the same mainly because:

Poker = 90% luck and 10% skill.
Pool = You better be skilled and know how to pray for luck.

Poker became popular mainly because of the amount of money that can be won that is simply astounding. Anybody with average intelligence and understands the card game can sit on a table and pick up cards. Ever notice how many poker amateurs beat seasoned poker professionals on big poker tourneys? Pool on the other hand is a different story. Not everbody can hit a round object with a stick to hit another round object hoping that the intended result is achieved.

The closest comparison I can think of that is a big money mill for individual sport would be golf. As many of us know, golf is a game that demands skill and an occasional sprinkle of luck.
 
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