Any ideas on something that's been bugging me?

CeaseLess said:
I recently bought a tiger pro shaft. The people at tiger always go above and beyond. The shaft plays and feels great. But I play a lot of bank pool and I usually bank with english to spin the object ball off the rail, and for some reason I wasn't able to get much spin transfer to the object ball off the rail with my tiger. I figured it was the onxy tip that was harder than I'm used to, so I went in and had them put on a ultraskin pro tip, which I've been playing with on a different cue for a while now. Got the shaft back, and still not much spin transfer. Went to the hall today and used my old dufferin cue that also has a ultraskin pro tip and I was spinning banks in like usual, used my old shaft and same thing, picked up a shitty house cue and they were all exactly the same amount of spin off the rail I was used to. Then went back to my tiger and it only gets about a third of the spin I'd expect. It puts a ton of spin on the cue ball and I'm able to throw balls straight into the pockets (straight shots not banks) but for the life of me I haven't been able to come up with a reason why it won't transfer spin to the object ball. Anybody more knowledge then me with a reason or at the least an educated guess? Thanks. -CeadeLess-
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This probably isn't what you want to hear but I think you just have to play with a new cue/shaft/tip to get used to it. They all play a bit differently.

Try staying closer to center, different speeds etc. I have some cues that are very stiff and you barely have to do anything but follow through to get a ton of spin. I have some cues you have to really put a stroke to the same shot.

When using one of my cues I have to tell myself (or others using it) "Let her eat." Meaning don't pussy foot shots but give a good stroke. The cue in question feels magical when you stroke it, but if you try bunting balls it feels really lackluster. Other shafts transfer spin better, and to me feel like you have to deliver a more pure stroke, closer to center ball and smoother.

Often times the deflection properties of a shaft are different. This means if it deflects less or more you have to hit it/aim slightly different. With a more LD shaft I often recommend playing closer to center ball, like within the diameter of a dime or nickel until you get used to it. In all honesty you can spin the rock to the moon and back without going more than 1 tip from center, but like anything you have to practice your delivery and stroke for it to work.
 
CeaseLess said:
I recently bought a tiger pro shaft. The people at tiger always go above and beyond. The shaft plays and feels great. But I play a lot of bank pool and I usually bank with english to spin the object ball off the rail, and for some reason I wasn't able to get much spin transfer to the object ball off the rail with my tiger. I figured it was the onxy tip that was harder than I'm used to, so I went in and had them put on a ultraskin pro tip, which I've been playing with on a different cue for a while now. Got the shaft back, and still not much spin transfer. Went to the hall today and used my old dufferin cue that also has a ultraskin pro tip and I was spinning banks in like usual, used my old shaft and same thing, picked up a shitty house cue and they were all exactly the same amount of spin off the rail I was used to. Then went back to my tiger and it only gets about a third of the spin I'd expect. It puts a ton of spin on the cue ball and I'm able to throw balls straight into the pockets (straight shots not banks) but for the life of me I haven't been able to come up with a reason why it won't transfer spin to the object ball. Anybody more knowledge then me with a reason or at the least an educated guess? Thanks. -CeadeLess-
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If you’re not miscuing, then it’s not the tip.
 
maha said:
so how can more than half of the maximum spin produce less than the maximum spin
more than the maximum spin can and certainly would produce less than the maximum spin.

i think i get what he is saying and understand naturally but it doesnt sound right at the start.

but no one will think about that. all they will and should, imop, think about where to hit on the cueball to get the spin they want.

however if hitting directly on the object ball the more spin on the cueball will send the object ball off its straight course. it wont be less when you use more spin than half of the maximum you can apply. in theory it may be, for slippy surfaces, but practically the cueball doesn't slip more so you get less spin. that has to break down proportionately as the surfaces become contaminated.
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Kinda.......
When increasing cue ball speed with spin, it spin transfer ''steers'' the object ball Less.
The dirtier or darker the obj. ball, expect more transfer of spin off the obj. ball at slower speeds.
When your....
Nearly straight in on your shot, & your somewhat close to the obj. ball. Your extreme outside spin hitting the obj. ball contact point will spin/walk whitey over.
 
maha said:
… if hitting directly on the object ball the more spin on the cueball will send the object ball off its straight course. it wont be less when you use more spin than half of the maximum you can apply.
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Actually, my understanding from the real experts here (I’m just the self-appointed messenger) is that it will be less. I think of it like car tires peeling out (slipping) on the pavement when spun too fast.

Here’s Dr. Dave on the subject:
Maximum spin-induced throw (SIT) occurs with slow speed, stun, and about 50% sidespin (for a straight shot).

billiards.colostate.edu

Maximum Throw - Dr. Dave Pool Info

Answers to frequently-asked questions about the maximum amount pool balls can be thrown.
billiards.colostate.edu billiards.colostate.edu
Click to expand...

pj
chgo
 
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no way a cue could make spin transfer greater. if the cb is spinning and its not transferring then its the balls. dirt/chalk/sweat can greatly effect spin transfer.
CeaseLess said:
I recently bought a tiger pro shaft. The people at tiger always go above and beyond. The shaft plays and feels great. But I play a lot of bank pool and I usually bank with english to spin the object ball off the rail, and for some reason I wasn't able to get much spin transfer to the object ball off the rail with my tiger. I figured it was the onxy tip that was harder than I'm used to, so I went in and had them put on a ultraskin pro tip, which I've been playing with on a different cue for a while now. Got the shaft back, and still not much spin transfer. Went to the hall today and used my old dufferin cue that also has a ultraskin pro tip and I was spinning banks in like usual, used my old shaft and same thing, picked up a shitty house cue and they were all exactly the same amount of spin off the rail I was used to. Then went back to my tiger and it only gets about a third of the spin I'd expect. It puts a ton of spin on the cue ball and I'm able to throw balls straight into the pockets (straight shots not banks) but for the life of me I haven't been able to come up with a reason why it won't transfer spin to the object ball. Anybody more knowledge then me with a reason or at the least an educated guess? Thanks. -CeadeLess-
Click to expand...
 
garczar said:
no way a cue could make spin transfer greater. if the cb is spinning and its not transferring then its the balls. dirt/chalk/sweat can greatly effect spin transfer.
Click to expand...
I'm not making any claims, simply asking a question. I shot the same bank, with the same balls, on the same table, multiple times with 4 different cues, including a shitty house cue. I made pretty much all the banks with the other three cues, but I missed every bank short with my new shaft, using the same stroke, english and contact point on the rail. And other people have commented that they have had the same issue with spinning in banks using the same shaft as well as ob shafts.
 
Patrick Johnson said:
Here’s Dr. Dave on the subject:
Maximum spin-induced throw (SIT) occurs with slow speed, stun, and about 50% sidespin (for a straight shot).
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
Dave also says that maximum throw for a half ball hit requires no sidespin. I try to use this info by changing from 50% side to centerball as the cut angle increases from 0° (straight) to 30° (half ball).

pj
chgo
 
CeaseLess said:
I'm not making any claims, simply asking a question. I shot the same bank, with the same balls, on the same table, multiple times with 4 different cues, including a shitty house cue. I made pretty much all the banks with the other three cues, but I missed every bank short with my new shaft, using the same stroke, english and contact point on the rail. And other people have commented that they have had the same issue with spinning in banks using the same shaft as well as ob shafts.
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maybe with a lo-defl shaft you aren't hitting ob in same spot and getting less transfer. weird.
 
Patrick Johnson said:
Dave also says that maximum throw for a half ball hit requires no sidespin. I try to use this info by changing from 50% side to centerball as the cut angle increases from 0° (straight) to 30° (half ball).

pj
chgo
Click to expand...
I just added an edit with some updated information, if you have time to read it, I'd be interested in your take. -CeaseLess-
 
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