APA in Fulton NY A MUST READ STORY

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Played the last 14 weeks in a Monday night Master's APA league in beautiful Fulton NY. My first and only APA experience. I won 14 of my matches and our team came out 4 games under the 1st place team in total games won. So we had a playoff with the 3rd and 4th place teams playing each other, then we played them to see who plays the 1st place team.

It's 3 possible races to 7, one for each team member. We beat the 4th place team, who won the first match, 2 sets straight 7-2 and 7-3 so there is no 3rd set because they can't win.

The first set of the final match with my team and the #1 team goes 7-6 us. Then the hillbilly BS from the drunks on their team begins.

The guy I play thinks he's great, he isn't. Easily he's 3 balls below me and that's being nice. He's drunk and at the lag he fires to the end rail at break shot speed and the CB is off the table, meanwhile I'm an inch off the end rail. It's some kind of disrespect move towards me so I choose 9 ball to be played so he gets the break and this is how it goes below which is taken from my email to the league operator:



"After a nice break and run by JJ I had a shot at the 8 to setup a win, easy. He's behind my shot, talking to his team in the doorway and burps as loud as he can on my backstroke. I ask him to stop and just sit down and play pool.

He threatens me, Chad, another member of the opposing team, threatens me and a third player of theirs all come within a foot of me and say they will physically assault me.

Things calm down, Brian the room owner comes in to watch us play and referee a few calls. Nothing more is said at all between JJ and I for the 30 minutes it takes me to win 7 games straight by a score of 7-2. I go to shake his hand, he takes it then punches me in my right ear with his left hand as hard as he could. I hold onto his right hand in our handshake, grab 3 of his left hand fingers with my left and ask him "Now what?". Lou (my teammate) separates him from me.

His teammates and he all threaten me with bodily harm again for a few minutes, where I state I will call the police if this continues. It continues and I then call the police.

The third set starts and Lou (my teammate) wins the game that brings our team to 15 games, so the tournament is over.

The police arrive and diffuse things and I leave.

Now I hear from Lou that JJ has be banned from the APA and there is consideration of our playoff win being nullified.

I just called you by phone and you said you will call me back. I appreciate that.

AFTER OUR PHONE CALL ending at 945 pm

Good to talk with you Brad. It's unfortunate that the other team is now trying to use his physical assault of me as a grounds to dismiss our team's win.

Please consider their motivations in this scenario. Ask the room owner Brian to confirm that nothing was said between JJ and myself during the 30 minutes it took for me to win 7 games straight. He certainly has no reason to lie.

Please get back with me at your convenience to relay you decision regarding our winning the Fulton APA masters tournament."


So now the league operator has decided that the 2nd two sets must be replayed. Why?? The guy essentialy had a 2 game spot and after things calmed down I win 7 straight. Then he assaults me. For this they get a second chance?

So , if a continuation match is played, we have a one game lead with set one 7-6. They need to beat me and my teammate Lou by 14-12 over 2 sets. It is just about impossible for them as the guy I play now is a tremendous underdog, I would have to give him the 7 out on a BB or the world on a 9 footer to be close. My teammate is better than both of these players by a significant amount.

I am protesting this with the APA headquarters. Probably will change nothing. The finals are to be this evening and it will change nothing. It will be yet another blowout.

The guy who punched me is a punk, I'd destroy him if I didn't have a real job to wake up to each day. He lost a trip to Vegas he had won for his regular league and will be banned for a year for hitting me. He had no response for the level of my play, except to cold cock me. Makes no difference at all except I think he hurt his hand because I felt nothing.


This is why I dont play in leagues.

The other issue is there are too many lawyers in America-You cant punch any one with out a lawsuit forth comming(especially if you have $$$). In Zimbabwe you can smack a guy real good and an hour later buy him a beer and its cool. but in america people try and profit off a assult(now if weapons are involved then yeah its a different thing) Or beating the hell out of someone when they are helpless on the ground is not acceptable. But in Zim you can pop someone a good shot and that usually clears things up and it ends there. If you injure a person they yes your accountable, but a pop in the jaw aint gonna hurt anyone physically, just their pride. The pussification of America is growing stronger every year.
 
This is why I dont play in leagues.

The other issue is there are too many lawyers in America-You cant punch any one with out a lawsuit forth comming(especially if you have $$$). In Zimbabwe you can smack a guy real good and an hour later buy him a beer and its cool. but in america people try and profit off a assult(now if weapons are involved then yeah its a different thing) Or beating the hell out of someone when they are helpless on the ground is not acceptable. But in Zim you can pop someone a good shot and that usually clears things up and it ends there. If you injure a person they yes your accountable, but a pop in the jaw aint gonna hurt anyone physically, just their pride. The pussification of America is growing stronger every year.

You get sued for everything and anything, That's why Rich people hang out with Rich People, Both persons are already rich, Wait they would still try to sue each other, But when was the last time you saw bill gates punch warren buffet?
 
This is why I dont play in leagues.

The other issue is there are too many lawyers in America-You cant punch any one with out a lawsuit forth comming(especially if you have $$$). In Zimbabwe you can smack a guy real good and an hour later buy him a beer and its cool. but in america people try and profit off a assult(now if weapons are involved then yeah its a different thing) Or beating the hell out of someone when they are helpless on the ground is not acceptable. But in Zim you can pop someone a good shot and that usually clears things up and it ends there. If you injure a person they yes your accountable, but a pop in the jaw aint gonna hurt anyone physically, just their pride. The pussification of America is growing stronger every year.

I don't think that type of behavior is regulated exclusively to leagues. I've seen some crazy s*** like that go down at tournaments as well.

Remember when kids used to fight with thier fists, and when it was all said and done, they were friends the next day ?

It's a different ball game now. Kids look at each other the wrong way, somebody pulls out a gun.
 
Alcohol is not excuse

Being drunk is no excuse for acting the way my opponents did this day. The APA should not condone such behavior and validadte it by allowing league operator Brad Rees to railroad my team as he has. My team and I will be responding to the APA this week, seeking to have the sanction taken against us removed. We understand what happens when pool players in bars drink to get drunk and become aggressive. What we cannot understand is how the local APA league operator condones it.

I completely understand why the LO Brad Rees sanctioned me as he did and barred me from playing in the Masters Tournament in Vegas.
He's tight with all the members of the opposing team, they just wanted some scalp so they felt better about losing and the lifetime banning of their best player. Brad makes money from players in that county who would also only support the other team. It makes no difference wheter there is a reason to penalize me or not. Simple retribution is enough. There doesn't need to be any truth to it at all. No explaination was ever provided to me about what I was accused of and my team was never given an opportunity to respond with an appropriate defense.

I am working on the appeal to APA, who now must decide if they will give my team an opportunity chance to respond. I am hopeful that they won't just take the side of their LO, who is bringing in lots of money for them. I will gather information on the initial local board review process and determine if it was conducted properly, and if it was run improperly, as I suspect, ask that it be disallowed because it was a kangaroo court.

After learning the "rights" I have under appeal my team will file for a formal appeal. I am getting statements form my teammates and impartial witness who were there and saw the antics of the other team. We will all attest to the high level of restraint I employed during this match.

Should the APA feel that my conduct was inappropriate for a player who was antagonized in such a way then whatever sanction is imposed should still be appropriate to the infraction. Therefore they must consider the impact that barring me form playing the Masters Championship will have on my team. We will be essentially crippled, likely having just a 2 player team, thereby forfefitng any 3rd match that will be required.

The APA should be held to a high level of accountability to follow their policies when punishing a player who did nothing to warrant being physically attacked. It would be improper for the APA to allow Brad Rees and company to get away with handing out sanctions against my team as payback. Payback for penalties aready imposed on the opposing team for their brutish actions.

More to come next week and if I get a proper email address for APA central I'll be sure to post here so anybody who wants to can let them know how they feel about this.
 
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Very long post of my teams request for appeal with APA board

We will see how this goes, I will post the board's decision when it is handed down.

Request for appeal of sanctions against Brian Lipes player#13201450
Masters finals tournament assault in Fulton, NY on 6/26/11
My team wins to the finals match over the winner of the 3rd and 4th place team playoffs. My teammate Tom wins his first set 7 games to 6. The second set is an opposing team member JJ and myself. Here is my account of the harassment and physical assault that I was subjected to during the event. Three members of the opposing team were visably intoxicated after drinking for several hours, and were highly aggressive towards me during the event.
The match started off with a break speed lag into the end rail where my opponent JJ sent the cue ball five feet into the air, as a means of disrespecting me. I calmly said “9 ball, your break”. After a nice break and run by JJ I had a shot at the 8 to setup a win, easy.**He runs about half of the next rack and I am now running out with an easy 8 ball to a simple 9 ball. He's behind my shot, talking to his team in the doorway and burps as loud as he can on my backstroke. I miss the 8 ball and he finishes the rack. At this point I ask him to stop and just sit down and play pool.* Members of his team and their supporters harass me verbally. Comments are made about me being a female sexual reproductive organ about the effect their distractions had on me.
JJ breaks the third rack and doesn't make a ball. The harassment continues as I go to shoot and I say that I am going to take my first break and walk past his supporters into the other room. At this point JJ threatens me, Chad threatens me and a third member of the opposing team*threatens me bodily harm over a period of 15 minutes, where I do not respond in kind. This is witnessed by my teammates and the pool room owner Brian.*
Things calm down, Brian the room owner comes in to watch us play and referee a few calls.* Nothing more is said at all between JJ and I for the 30 minutes it takes me to win 7 games straight by a score of 7-2.* I go to shake his hand, he takes it then punches me in my rightt ear with his left hand as hard as he could.* I hold onto his right hand in our handshake, grab 3 of his left hand fingers with my left and ask him "Now what?".* Lou, my team captain separates him from me ashe attempts to knee me in the groin. At this point the other two aggressive players on the opposing team and a few supporters are also coming at me in a very hostile manner looking to physically assault me. My team captain Lou gets in between the mob and I ad says for everyone to stop. He has known the individuals for years and I do not know of them outside of this sessions play.*
JJ is taken aside by his wife and supporters and the remaing two aggressive opponents continue to threaten me serious bodily harm and eve death for another 15 minute period. Again I do not respond in kind. In fact when they cme within a foot of my face and say they will hit me I say, “ Just do it then.” Eventually, I say that I will call the police if this continues.* It continues and I then call the police.
*The third set starts and Lou Diaz wins the game that brings our team to 15 games, so the tournament is over.
The police arrive and diffuse the situation and I leave.
Please consider their motivations in this scenario.* Ask the room owner Brian to confirm that nothing was said between JJ and myself during the 30 minutes it took for me to win 7 games straight.* He certainly has no reason to lie.



Events following the Sunday harassment and assault

After my leaving the league operator Brad Rees came and spoke to members of the opposing team, the room owner and my teammates Tom and Lou. Immediately Mr. Rees rules that there will be a rematch of the 2nd and 3rd sets. My team objects. I contact him the following afternoon and he states that the rematches will be held at 6pm. We have always started play at 7pm the entire 14 weeks of the session. I tell him this and that I cannot get out of work until 6 pm and he tells me that I can play 2nd then.

Monday afternoon I send him copies of the APA policies regarding zero-tolerance for physical violence offense where the other team is forfeited. I then call him to explain that I did nothing to distract JJ and he lost 7 games straight , while getting two kick shots following my safeties. Obviously he could not have been sharked if he never had another makeable shot.

We learn Wednesday morning that no rematch will be held and the events of the evening will be under review. By now I learn that Brad is under the belief that I “must have done something to cause” the harassment ant physical abuse I was subjected to. This line of thought is akin to a classic rape defense where the victim is blamed for causing the assault. This logic is in direct contradiction to the following APA policies that state that there is no action that can warrant harassment or physical violence as being justified. Certainly no testimony was provided thus far that shows that Brian Lipes did anything to provoke the opposing team.

MATCH FORFEITURE
IMMEDIATE ACTION - If hostile physical contact occurs, THE
MATCH IS OVER! There are only two possibilities to consider: only one
team was guilty of hostile physical contact or both teams were guilty of hostile
physical contact. LEAGUE MANAGEMENT MUST EXERCISE ONE
OF THE FOLLOWING TWO OPTIONS:
a. Only one side was involved. In this case, the offending team loses all
points if it is a regular night of play on the weekly schedule, or loses the
team match if it is a Session Playoff or any kind of a tournament match.
The nonoffending team receives five points (75 points in 9-Ball) in the
case of a regular night of play, or advances to the next level in the event
of Session Playoffs or some sort of tournament play.
*
League Management has no alternative other than to enforce one of the above two
options. When considering the above options, League Management cannot
consider who started it, nor can League Management consider that the retaliation, if
it occurred, was justified. The only way both teams can avoid the same penalty is
for one of the teams to refuse to retaliate no matter what provocation they may have
to endure.
SUSPENSION
League Management must take action against any members involved
in physical contact violations, no matter how remotely League related
they are. It is not acceptable for a couple of members to take their fight
outside, or to agree to meet and fight it out at a later date. If, indeed,
they do fight at a later date and League Management determines it was
as a result of League play, then League Management must take action.
This action would be in the form of follow-up action. A fight that occurs
outside, but during League time, will be considered to be the same as one
that occurred inside. If a player threatens to wait outside until the match is
over, League Management should rule that the entire team match is
forfeited. How can a player and his teammates possibly concentrate on
finishing a match if they feel they will be facing a brawl later on? In other
words, a threat could be treated as physical contact in terms of immediate
action. There is certainly room for a lot of judgment in this area.
Follow-up action by League Management results in penalties such as probation,
suspension and permanent termination of League and APA membership. The
latitude of these penalties is left mainly up to League Management, but the
following guidelines should be observed:
a. To any person who starts a fight or brawl—permanent termination
of League and APA membership.
By Friday evening our team learns that the local board has decided to not allow me to play in the Masters Championhip. This is without my having ever been acccused of any infraction and not been given any opportunity to rebut any of the allegations brought upon by the opposing team who has obvious motivations for retribution because of the severe mandatory penalties that were placed upon them.
Appeal to dismiss the decision to bar Brian Lipes from playing in the Masters Championship in Las Vegas

The grounds of our appeal are as follows:
1) League operator did not allow our team the opportunity to hear the accusations brought against me at the board
2) I was not allowed to rebut any of the charges brought against me by my accusers, the same individuals who threatened me bodily harm, even threatened to kill me for upwards of 40 minutes in total
3) League operator immediately sided with his friends and business associate who helps him run half of his franchise and*is a member of the other team. First by ruling that we must have a rematch, which was completely incongruent with APA mandatory sanctions. Then by targeting me for sanctioning without cause
4) Mr. Rees denied me anything that would resemble a fair hearing by
*a) his refusing to allow me to present relevant testimony and supporting statements from impartial witnesses or members of my team who were present during the event
b)failing to communicate with me regarding my concerns, while all the while conversing with the offending team
c) never once asking if I were okay, injured ect.
d)*all the while talking with members of the opposing team and their wives, friends and whoever else could be found to bear false witness against me
5) Foremost, that Brian Lipes never did anything to cause or justify the harassment and physical aggression he endured and therby should not be sanctioned in any way
*
Closing arguments

When Mr. Rees made me aware of his ruling Friday evening he explained that " I must have done something" to make JJ hit me.*He still did not provide me with any description of any infraction that I accused of. The three individuals on the opposing team who harassed and physically assaulted me were all visibly intoxicated. This was attested to by the room owner who served them and all members of my team. Their motivations for seeking retribution against me were obvious, but Mr. Rees seemed to be completely unaware of them.

It is absurd that your league operator and his board of supporters from the county where these individuals reside could find a way to further victimize me, but they have.* Not only have I been wronged, but the 2 members of my team are now left to decide, to either not go to the Masters Championship or go without me. We essentially have a 3 player team because our 4th member is out of town for business the past 11 weeks and likely will not attend the Vegas event. If they play with just 2 players they will be crippled and have no chance of winning, forfeiting the 3rd set as needed. They were told they could pick a substitute. We have no readily available member and they feel their best chance to win is with the team as it was, with me on the roster.*
*
I am disgusted with the manner in which the APA league operator has handled this situation than the 3 drunken individuals who at least were honest in their intention to harm me.* First in his initial decision to hold a rematch which was completely incongruent with APA zero-violence policy.* He made this decision for the obvious benefit of giving the opposing team another opportunity because he is aligned with them. What kind of logic is it to punish me solely on the words of my aggressive drunken accusers, without permitting my team's rebuttal and make the conclusion that I "must have done something to make*my opponent hit me".
*
Meanwhile Mr. Rees tells me that no decision was made regarding how the 2 individuals who threatened me for over 30 minutes in total will be sanctioned.* I suppose since they are affiliated with Mr. Rees nothing will come of it.* Is there a continuation board meeting to decide this? What more do you need to make a ruling?* Is my saying they did this and my witnesses saying this not good enough to make a decision? It is readily apparent that*their lies and exaggerations about*were*sufficient enough to sanction me.**Clearly he is unwilling to punish his friends for far worse offenses than I was ever*accused of.*Mr. Rees could not make the right and just decision here because he would lose face with his friends on the opposing team and jeopardize financial gains he may lose with his*business associate on that team or players within that county.**
*
I am hopeful that my appeal will be given fair consideration.* Please expedite this decision as the final date to submit our team roster is July 14th. Please contact me as needed to discuss this appeal.
Thank you in advance for your consideration
 
Doesn't sound like an APA issue, sounds like a people problem. There are plenty of dumbasses spread out across APA, BCA, VNEA, and pool halls in general.
 
There are plenty of dumbasses spread out across APA, BCA, VNEA, and pool halls in general.

I have been sadly disappointed at the number of persons I have come across in the bars/poolhalls that have no integrity, poor etiquette, cocky/arrogant, cheat, are rude, or are just plain a-holes in comparison to people I have met in other walks of life. For this reason I have stopped playing in leagues. I may or may not return to at least ONE league somewhere in my future, but for now, I'm so overly burnt-out on all the BS. I will say this though, the main culprits were mostly in the bars, not the poolhalls.

Don't get me wrong though, I have also met some of the friendliest, easy-going, and considerate people there too!!!

Maniac
 
It must have been an slight oversight that the offer to gamble wasn't mentioned.


We will see how this goes, I will post the board's decision when it is handed down.

Request for appeal of sanctions against Brian Lipes player#13201450
Masters finals tournament assault in Fulton, NY on 6/26/11
My team wins to the finals match over the winner of the 3rd and 4th place team playoffs. My teammate Tom wins his first set 7 games to 6. The second set is an opposing team member JJ and myself. Here is my account of the harassment and physical assault that I was subjected to during the event. Three members of the opposing team were visably intoxicated after drinking for several hours, and were highly aggressive towards me during the event.
The match started off with a break speed lag into the end rail where my opponent JJ sent the cue ball five feet into the air, as a means of disrespecting me. I calmly said “9 ball, your break”. After a nice break and run by JJ I had a shot at the 8 to setup a win, easy.**He runs about half of the next rack and I am now running out with an easy 8 ball to a simple 9 ball. He's behind my shot, talking to his team in the doorway and burps as loud as he can on my backstroke. I miss the 8 ball and he finishes the rack. At this point I ask him to stop and just sit down and play pool.* Members of his team and their supporters harass me verbally. Comments are made about me being a female sexual reproductive organ about the effect their distractions had on me.
JJ breaks the third rack and doesn't make a ball. The harassment continues as I go to shoot and I say that I am going to take my first break and walk past his supporters into the other room. At this point JJ threatens me, Chad threatens me and a third member of the opposing team*threatens me bodily harm over a period of 15 minutes, where I do not respond in kind. This is witnessed by my teammates and the pool room owner Brian.*
Things calm down, Brian the room owner comes in to watch us play and referee a few calls.* Nothing more is said at all between JJ and I for the 30 minutes it takes me to win 7 games straight by a score of 7-2.* I go to shake his hand, he takes it then punches me in my rightt ear with his left hand as hard as he could.* I hold onto his right hand in our handshake, grab 3 of his left hand fingers with my left and ask him "Now what?".* Lou, my team captain separates him from me ashe attempts to knee me in the groin. At this point the other two aggressive players on the opposing team and a few supporters are also coming at me in a very hostile manner looking to physically assault me. My team captain Lou gets in between the mob and I ad says for everyone to stop. He has known the individuals for years and I do not know of them outside of this sessions play.*
JJ is taken aside by his wife and supporters and the remaing two aggressive opponents continue to threaten me serious bodily harm and eve death for another 15 minute period. Again I do not respond in kind. In fact when they cme within a foot of my face and say they will hit me I say, “ Just do it then.” Eventually, I say that I will call the police if this continues.* It continues and I then call the police.
*The third set starts and Lou Diaz wins the game that brings our team to 15 games, so the tournament is over.
The police arrive and diffuse the situation and I leave.
Please consider their motivations in this scenario.* Ask the room owner Brian to confirm that nothing was said between JJ and myself during the 30 minutes it took for me to win 7 games straight.* He certainly has no reason to lie.
 
man the story keeps changing ,and really gettin old . did you or did you not say lets play for 500.00. nobody gives a rats ass about your team. must read lol.
 
I have been sadly disappointed at the number of persons I have come across in the bars/poolhalls that have no integrity, poor etiquette, cocky/arrogant, cheat, are rude, or are just plain a-holes in comparison to people I have met in other walks of life. For this reason I have stopped playing in leagues. I may or may not return to at least ONE league somewhere in my future, but for now, I'm so overly burnt-out on all the BS. I will say this though, the main culprits were mostly in the bars, not the poolhalls.

Don't get me wrong though, I have also met some of the friendliest, easy-going, and considerate people there too!!!

Maniac

I believe it is the general American attitude in any competitive situation. Poor sportsmanship is the norm these days. We have too many people that feel they are entitled, lack class, or just plain rude.

We have no one to blame but ourselves, as Americans. Somewhere sportsmanship elapsed around the Baby Boomer, Gen X, and Gen Y eras. Young people are most influenced by their parents and some generational breakdown occurred in the last half-century where class and dignity and humility has been thrown out the window due to how our parents or us, or our kids now, have conducted ourselves.

This is just a broad general statement and there are plenty of non-sucky people out there.
 
Brian, all our previous thread drama aside.............

Stop and think about it. Do you honestly think that the LO will take only your version of what happened over at least three people that were involved ?

The fact that the opposing team are friends with the LO really has no bearing on the issue. I'm friends with my LO, along with just about everyone else in our league.
Obviously the stories that the LO is getting from the other team are coinciding with each other. And probably in great detail (read : "Bet for $500 ?").

You stated here that the LO kicked at least one guy out of the league permanently (presumably the one that threw the punch).
And the LO's current reason for keeping you from playing in Las Vegas is that you “must have done something to cause” this.
As it stands right now, your LO is not clearing you to compete in August. The only place to go from here is up.
Sounds to me like the LO is giving you the chance to come clean about the $500 offer to gamble.

Man up, and tell him the ENTIRE story.
 
man the story keeps changing ,and really gettin old . did you or did you not say lets play for 500.00. nobody gives a rats ass about your team. must read lol.

Brian Lipes omitted that little fact. For one, it does make it look like he was throwing gas on the fire. For two, gambling is against the rules in APA. I know, I know, the rules only matter when BRIAN needs to use them.

Here's some more insight on Lil Brian's reputation and how he is viewed by ppl that know him and live around him(starting with post #7):

http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?p=2935734#post2935734


Eric
 
Brian, all our previous thread drama aside.............

Stop and think about it. Do you honestly think that the LO will take only your version of what happened over at least three people that were involved ?

The fact that the opposing team are friends with the LO really has no bearing on the issue. I'm friends with my LO, along with just about everyone else in our league.
Obviously the stories that the LO is getting from the other team are coinciding with each other. And probably in great detail (read : "Bet for $500 ?").

You stated here that the LO kicked at least one guy out of the league permanently (presumably the one that threw the punch).
And the LO's current reason for keeping you from playing in Las Vegas is that you “must have done something to cause” this.
As it stands right now, your LO is not clearing you to compete in August. The only place to go from here is up.
Sounds to me like the LO is giving you the chance to come clean about the $500 offer to gamble.

Man up, and tell him the ENTIRE story.

Bro, I've said it 25 times "Bet from here." A statement yes. Meaning what who knows. Did I actually gamble NO.

BTW my version is backed up by my team and the room owner who has no reason to lie.

If my statement was enough to allow someone to hit me then I'm done. I would think it would not be, APA policy specifically says nothing can be done that can incite an opponent to become physically violent. It's in their mandatory penalty policy. Which is why the LO banned him for life, he had to.

I know of 3 individuals who Mr Rees discussed this issue with, one who was certainly on the annonymous board. This individual told me that they all reccomended I not be sanctioned. Mr. Rees did this on his own as retribution for his friends on the other team. So now my issue is primarily with him and his heavy handed treatment of me. We will see what APA central will do with this in a matter of a few days.

My story isn't changing, it's just that a few individuals keep asking me to reclariy it, while insinuating that I am a liar. I think this is where we have our misunderstanding. If these few posters want to keep questioing me that's fine, I only hope you may never undergo a similiar experience. It's not been fair to my team and was grossly mishandled. I am hopeful that APA will set this right.

After that my APA card will be going in the trash can, I'm getting too old for these headaches.

Mickey my offer to you still stands, lets you and I play a few $200 sets. I want to see what you got, just a freindly wager. We can flip for location, Syracuse or Binghampton. Bar box, big table, 8 ball or 9 ball you choose, I am ready anytime.

Eric is a hater who lives in the mystical land of walk and don't walk, wherever that is. Great example in the link. The guy "that knows me" is the one who robbed his own tournament of thusands of dollars. You are a great judge of character arent you. Or are you personal friends with Mike Andrews? Mikey is alot like you though I'll give you that, all bark and no bite.
 
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Don't get too worked up about what the APA cheerleaders say, I'm sure the majority of them are either LOs themselves or are probably best friends of an LO. Those who have played in the APA and have had to deal with the constant BS know where you're coming from.
 
Poor Loosers

Sounds like that you and your teem are up against poor loosers.There is no need fore that tupe of violence in pool and i dont blame you at all, fore having to put up with violent pukes.
 
Apa ruling is in

Our appeal was denied without explaination. 90 day suspension, which is a lifetime by my choice. I'll never waste another penny on an APA league.

They gentleman who has been running interference for the APA, Alex the customer service rep, had no explaination for the ruling. No doubt the combination of not wanting to overturn their LO's initial ruling and the "he must have do something to deserve it" theory.

I'll still be traveling to Vegas with my team, looking for any and all action that is to be found.

Pretty sad that the LO and opposing team can lie and slander me all they want and get away with it. The APA is like any other organization out there and alot of people. No morals whatsoever, win at all costs and lie cheat and steal to get it.

As many people had written here and predicted the APA only went through the motions of giving us fair consideration. They were never going to be able to do the right thing, nor did I ever expect them to. I would caution anyone for involving themselves in the APA, just not a great environment. Certainly won't advance your game much.

I can rest assured that I did nothing to warrant the abuse and physical violence that was perpetrated against me. As far as my detractors, wherever they may be found, they can all kiss my a$$. Karma will find a way to repay Mr. Rees, he's a POS and I won't give him the satisfaction of telling him off. I will focus on revenge by living better, and robbing anyone I can find in Vegas that wants to play. See you all there.
 
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Do you seriously think the APA cares about anything but your money? I could have told you the verdict before you went through the hassle. It's all about the money buddy. The APA is a joke.
 
Karma will find a way to repay Mr. Rees, he's a POS and I won't give him the satisfaction of telling him off. I will focus on revenge by living better, and robbing anyone I can find in Vegas that wants to play. See you all there.

Sounds like karma found YOU.

Then again, this is prolly a recurring theme in your life.


Eric >some ppl nvr learn
 
Do you seriously think the APA cares about anything but your money? I could have told you the verdict before you went through the hassle. It's all about the money buddy. The APA is a joke.

I think you were the first to say that here. Well I for one wouldn't trade morals for money. The LO didn't betray the opposing team member who helps him run Oswego county operations and the APA didn't contradict the LO, one of 250 they have. He's a good earner no doubt. I hope they choke on it, whatever they make I wouldn't sell my soul to get it.

I'm considering starting a BCA league in the area, we have a new room with 8 Diamond bar boxes nearby and lots of good barbox players around who wouldn't play APA. Only need 30 players to get a franchise. If I do it, I would work with a few others to run it and just put earnings back into prize monies. Basically try to get people to play and win to the BCA nationals.
 
I think you were the first to say that here. Well I for one wouldn't trade morals for money. The LO didn't betray the opposing team member who helps him run Oswego county operations and the APA didn't contradict the LO, one of 250 they have. He's a good earner no doubt. I hope they choke on it, whatever they make I wouldn't sell my soul to get it.

I'm considering starting a BCA league in the area, we have a new room with 8 Diamond bar boxes nearby and lots of good barbox players around who wouldn't play APA. Only need 30 players to get a franchise. If I do it, I would work with a few others to run it and just put earnings back into prize monies. Basically try to get people to play and win to the BCA nationals.

Now THAT'S EXACTLY how to pay them back.
I wish we had BCA where I live because the APA is slowly wearing on me.
 
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