Yes, somebody on an Internet forum has found what is wrong with a country's pool scene. Do you see the problem with this statement? Not trying to be rude, but think about this.
Are talented filipinos "Under-Acheving" ??
- Thread starter Cezar Morales
- Start date
Yes, somebody on an Internet forum has found what is wrong with a country's pool scene. Do you see the problem with this statement? Not trying to be rude, but think about this.
My motive in this thread is as recreational pool players , pool is something we do for fun n not for a living , however with that said , im sure if we r passionate in the sport we should seek to constantly improve ourself.
Currently , the two strongest country producing good players are taiwan n philipines in which we can emulate.
I learn a great deal by observing n learning their different style of play n strategy.
Taiwanese focus on a fundemental , disciplined n rather intelligent style focused on solely winning by playing ther percentages, thus reducing their mistakes
The filipinos focus on free and easy , run n gun precision cue ball countrol focused more on exciting the crowd, but makes too many mistakes.
Thus , i feel we should pick the pros in each style in order to develope an effective way which we can improve our game.
The fact that nobody has provided a reasonable answer clearly shows that i have a valid point im this discussion
Maybe most of them are also just overrated, coupled with the expectation of being great players but in reality they're mostly just a level short of Efren, Dennis, Ronnie & Busty's caliber...
Niels feijen just spent some time over in PI playing against a lot of the young guns. I think they played him about even.
Skyler just did too.
I'm sure someone will come in and say Shane cleaned up in the PI. That was many moons ago.
Btw, the US has not won a WPA 9b championship since Earl in 2002.
So many tout Shane and Shaw being the best in the world, still no 9b titles between the 2.
I would still takem them against Albin, current 9b champ.
Skyler just did too.
I'm sure someone will come in and say Shane cleaned up in the PI. That was many moons ago.
Btw, the US has not won a WPA 9b championship since Earl in 2002.
So many tout Shane and Shaw being the best in the world, still no 9b titles between the 2.
I would still takem them against Albin, current 9b champ.
My motive in this thread is as recreational pool players , pool is something we do for fun n not for a living , however with that said , im sure if we r passionate in the sport we should seek to constantly improve ourself.
Currently , the two strongest country producing good players are taiwan n philipines in which we can emulate.
I learn a great deal by observing n learning their different style of play n strategy.
Taiwanese focus on a fundemental , disciplined n rather intelligent style focused on solely winning by playing ther percentages, thus reducing their mistakes
The filipinos focus on free and easy , run n gun precision cue ball countrol focused more on exciting the crowd, but makes too many mistakes.
Thus , i feel we should pick the pros in each style in order to develope an effective way which we can improve our game.
The fact that nobody has provided a reasonable answer clearly shows that i have a valid point im this discussion
One word, discipline.
I saw few videos of Anto Raga playing, the kid got talents but his attitude will take him nowhere. Unless he changes, he would never be anything.
Filipino players have always been top dogs in every tournament they play in, whether it is 1P, 14.1, Rotation or 8-Ball. Just look at Alex Pagulayan, the guy has a godlike stroke, he can transition that stroke from game to game regardless whether it is a Barbox or a Snooker table.
In my honest opinion, I don't think the Filipinos are under achieving, I honestly think the competition is just getting tougher and tougher every since year. It's anybody's game in this era. Obviously, you will always have your crowd favourites, like Shane, Dennis, Alex, Shaw and etc. However, at any given moment, any pro can win, any pro can go on a hot streak. Look at Shaw, he is playing some of his best pool right now and rightfully so, he is winning a lot more than last year.
Pool isn't going to be the same as it once was, it won't revert back to one race dominating the sport.
For example: 1980s, you got Nick Varner, Earl, Johnny Archer, Mike Sigel (Americans)
1990s: You got your Filipinos, Reyes and Bustamante and a few uprising European stars.
in 2000s however, the game changed.. Neither Filipinos nor Americans were dominating the game, but Europeans, the Taiwanese, the Canadians, list goes on..
Simply, game has changed. Pockets are tighter, equipment is better, cloth is nicer, lighting is better. Competition is forced to play better to succeed. IMO.
In my honest opinion, I don't think the Filipinos are under achieving, I honestly think the competition is just getting tougher and tougher every since year. It's anybody's game in this era. Obviously, you will always have your crowd favourites, like Shane, Dennis, Alex, Shaw and etc. However, at any given moment, any pro can win, any pro can go on a hot streak. Look at Shaw, he is playing some of his best pool right now and rightfully so, he is winning a lot more than last year.
Pool isn't going to be the same as it once was, it won't revert back to one race dominating the sport.
For example: 1980s, you got Nick Varner, Earl, Johnny Archer, Mike Sigel (Americans)
1990s: You got your Filipinos, Reyes and Bustamante and a few uprising European stars.
in 2000s however, the game changed.. Neither Filipinos nor Americans were dominating the game, but Europeans, the Taiwanese, the Canadians, list goes on..
Simply, game has changed. Pockets are tighter, equipment is better, cloth is nicer, lighting is better. Competition is forced to play better to succeed. IMO.
Reason #1: China has 1,000,000,000 people...simple numbers game here.
Reason #2: China takes training (not gambling) seriously, and start their players at a young age receiving high quality instruction, and demanding high production from their students.
Reason #3: China PAYS it's professional pool players.
Need I go on?
Scott Lee
http://poolknowledge.com
Reason #2: China takes training (not gambling) seriously, and start their players at a young age receiving high quality instruction, and demanding high production from their students.
Reason #3: China PAYS it's professional pool players.
Need I go on?
Scott Lee
http://poolknowledge.com
China? What China?
What China? China White is the best I heard.
I do believe PI players have been underachieving in pool.
They are very talented, but their casual approach to pool, and their rhythm, is an impasse.
take Jeff Ignacio, Anton Raga, they are both immensely talented, but they play so fast and I dont think they give key shots thorough assessment and thoughts. My mentor said they are a bit all over the place.
Those key shots are vital in tournaments.
In money matches, they can lose today, win tomorrow, but in tournaments, you have to wait for a year to come back, and 1-2 key shots are what make you rue the day.
Look at Biado and Dennis, those players have been playing in US for years, and their rhythm is different from younger PI players.
Then, look at TW players, the way Ko, Chang, Cheng moves around table, assessing their shots, sets them apart in tourney for sure.
Wu is my favorite player from TW (originally), and he plays much faster than the current taiwanese.
Back to the day when Yang defeated Dennis, I believe then Yang was the best money player in the world, not Dennis. and Yang would have beaten far worse if he had not used a new shaft on the first day. He switched back to his old shaft on the second day.
I learned of story about Jeff De Luna playing money matches vs Chang and Ko in recent years, at a regional tournament named Golden Break in Indonesia. Jeff beat Ko 15-3 in 3 innings and Chang 21-14 having lead more than 10racks at one time.
so YES, I think PI players are underachieving in tournaments.
I got news that Johann Chua, my fav player from PI, got his visa to US yesterday. wait for him. He is a rare player in PI who went through serious training before exposed to money matches, and he can go very far.
They are very talented, but their casual approach to pool, and their rhythm, is an impasse.
take Jeff Ignacio, Anton Raga, they are both immensely talented, but they play so fast and I dont think they give key shots thorough assessment and thoughts. My mentor said they are a bit all over the place.
Those key shots are vital in tournaments.
In money matches, they can lose today, win tomorrow, but in tournaments, you have to wait for a year to come back, and 1-2 key shots are what make you rue the day.
Look at Biado and Dennis, those players have been playing in US for years, and their rhythm is different from younger PI players.
Then, look at TW players, the way Ko, Chang, Cheng moves around table, assessing their shots, sets them apart in tourney for sure.
Wu is my favorite player from TW (originally), and he plays much faster than the current taiwanese.
Back to the day when Yang defeated Dennis, I believe then Yang was the best money player in the world, not Dennis. and Yang would have beaten far worse if he had not used a new shaft on the first day. He switched back to his old shaft on the second day.
I learned of story about Jeff De Luna playing money matches vs Chang and Ko in recent years, at a regional tournament named Golden Break in Indonesia. Jeff beat Ko 15-3 in 3 innings and Chang 21-14 having lead more than 10racks at one time.
so YES, I think PI players are underachieving in tournaments.
I got news that Johann Chua, my fav player from PI, got his visa to US yesterday. wait for him
. He is a rare player in PI who went through serious training before exposed to money matches, and he can go very far.Lol.
Im not talking bout China, im talking bout taiwan.
Taiwanese player ARE NOT PAID by China !
China pros are getting paid and they are hiring the best taiwanede coaches whom many are getting paid.
Nonetheless , China has not produced a world pro yet.
In the other hand , taiwan population pales in comparison to philipines !
U shld make a trip to taiwan so u can understand the pool culture better
I do believe PI players have been underachieving in pool.
They are very talented, but their casual approach to pool, and their rhythm, is an impasse.
take Jeff Ignacio, Anton Raga, they are both immensely talented, but they play so fast and I dont think they give key shots thorough assessment and thoughts. My mentor said they are a bit all over the place.
Those key shots are vital in tournaments.
In money matches, they can lose today, win tomorrow, but in tournaments, you have to wait for a year to come back, and 1-2 key shots are what make you rue the day.
Look at Biado and Dennis, those players have been playing in US for years, and their rhythm is different from younger PI players.
Then, look at TW players, the way Ko, Chang, Cheng moves around table, assessing their shots, sets them apart in tourney for sure.
Wu is my favorite player from TW (originally), and he plays much faster than the current taiwanese.
Back to the day when Yang defeated Dennis, I believe then Yang was the best money player in the world, not Dennis. and Yang would have beaten far worse if he had not used a new shaft on the first day. He switched back to his old shaft on the second day.
I learned of story about Jeff De Luna playing money matches vs Chang and Ko in recent years, at a regional tournament named Golden Break in Indonesia. Jeff beat Ko 15-3 in 3 innings and Chang 21-14 having lead more than 10racks at one time.
so YES, I think PI players are underachieving in tournaments.
I got news that Johann Chua, my fav player from PI, got his visa to US yesterday. wait for him
Hey buddy , we shld meet up sometimes.. thinking of heading to hcm soon.
How've u been ?
Those are good points.
Btw, i was there at the golden break tournament , jeff won ko by a big margin becoz he broke n ran 7 on 9 ball and ran 8 playing chang 10 ball.
However he declined when asked to play a next on alternate break becoz he knew he couldnt match them for consistency.
He was trying to win by the break which was a dammn smart move.
Take care buddy !
haha I am good, you found a lady in HCM? lol. Let me know your schedule, I may have something to ask of you
. PM or whatsapp pls.Money game should play winner breaks, did he get the 7ball vs Ko and the 8ball vs Chang?
Chinese male players are more interested in snooker and Chinese 8 ball.
Their females, though, are now strongest in the world.
haha I am good, you found a lady in HCM? lol. Let me know your schedule, I may have something to ask of you
Money game should play winner breaks, did he get the 7ball vs Ko and the 8ball vs Chang?
Nah they were playing even.
Jeffrey de luna had a great n monster break , pretty obvious he was trying to sneak attack by winning from the break so he declined playing alternate
His break decided the set from the beginning.
Roland garcia masaccred then world no.1 kevin cheng in 9 ball too.
Howevwr the reason why jeffrey or other pinoys not winning major tournament is their consistency , most filipinos are sprinters wining the 100 m race but a tournament like a marathon where you gotta do everything so consistently , running out , breaking , kicking , safety and jumping of course which is why i think most filipino usually are out by the semi or quarters in thise major competitiom which only exception is carlo biado making the 10 ball finals and 9 ball quarters whereas u will always see at least 2 taiwanese in the semis.
In wpc9 ball 2015 , 3 taiwanese made the semis , big and lil ko and wu chia ching although hes representing china now.
Wow, didnt know yang actually use a new southwest shaft on day 1 when he masaccred dennis lol.
Heard from then on , he never challenged yang anymore n yang became the undisputed money game king.
But i do know from some insider taiwanese info on why yang wld always make quarter n semis in the wpc 9 ball but never winning it , figure it out Ctran, you're a smart guy loll !
PoolChump
Banned
Pool Playing Difficulty: (Easier to play well faster than ever before)
The reason for this is because it is way more competitive. There are way more talented players now than ever before. This is due to the numerous free and accurate resources today on YouTube or live stream matches. Because of this it is far more easier to play very well in a shorter amount of time. Anybody with decent hand and eye coordination and drive can become a short-stop in a year. Becoming a professional and or top professional will take longer, because the difference between a short-stop and top professional is vast. Hope this answers your question.:smile:
The reason for this is because it is way more competitive. There are way more talented players now than ever before. This is due to the numerous free and accurate resources today on YouTube or live stream matches. Because of this it is far more easier to play very well in a shorter amount of time. Anybody with decent hand and eye coordination and drive can become a short-stop in a year. Becoming a professional and or top professional will take longer, because the difference between a short-stop and top professional is vast. Hope this answers your question.:smile:
Last edited:
That was a classic match . What was very impressive about Yang was not just his break and run game but his ability to consistently get out of tough outs , winning safety exchanges , fearless potting, excellent CB and mental game - in short a complete player
Too bad the rematch in 10b is not available on YouTube . Don't mind paying for a vid of that match :grin:
Pagulayan (credit to PI and CAN) was 28 when he won the World 9-Ball in 2004.
Amit was 27 when she won the World 10-Ball in 2009.
Centeno was 16 when she won the World 9-Ball for juniors in 2015.
[P.S. Wu was 16 (not 15) when he won the World 9-Ball in 2005.]
I'm still waiting for Jeffrey Ignacio to really hit his stride internationally. He's got to be one of the most naturally talented players to ever wield a cue.