BCA 8 Ball Rules Question

B

Bumpa

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Hi -

BCA 8 Ball Rules say:

"10. OPEN TABLE...When the table is open it is legal to hit any solid or stripe or the 8-ball first in the process of pocketing the called stripe or solid. However, when the table is open and the 8 ball is the first ball contacted, no stripe or solid may be scored in favor of the shooter. The shooter loses his turn and any balls pocketed remain pocketed, and the incoming player addresses the balls with the table still open. On an open table, all illegally pocketed balls remain pocketed."

I am confused. If it is legal to hit the 8 ball first to sink a ball, why is no stripe or solid scored in favor of the shooter, and why does the shooter lose his turn?

Thank you.

Rick
 
Bumpa said:
BCA 8 Ball Rules say:

"10. OPEN TABLE...When the table is open it is legal to hit any solid or stripe or the 8-ball first in the process of pocketing the called stripe or solid. However, when the table is open and the 8 ball is the first ball contacted, no stripe or solid may be scored in favor of the shooter. The shooter loses his turn and any balls pocketed remain pocketed, and the incoming player addresses the balls with the table still open. On an open table, all illegally pocketed balls remain pocketed."
Click to expand...
Not sure where you're getting that rule from. Quoting from the 2010-2011 BCAPL rule book (This is current rules in effect)....

2.5 Table Open After the Break

The table is always open after the break and remains open until groups are established. When the table is open, all object balls except the 8-ball are legal object balls. For combination shots, a ball of one group may be contacted first to pocket a ball of the other group. The 8-ball may be part of such a combination if it is not the first ball contacted by the cue ball.
 
Maybe the shooter can leave the cueball in an undesirable position. Also, maybe the solids are tied up and more difficult to run out, so the shooter decides to claim stripes, and the only way to claim stripes is to pocket a stripe by hitting the 8 ball first. The shooter loses his turn kind of like calling a safety while intentionally, legally pocketing one of his object balls.
 
Bumpa said:
Hi -

BCA 8 Ball Rules say:

"10. OPEN TABLE...When the table is open it is legal to hit any solid or stripe or the 8-ball first in the process of pocketing the called stripe or solid. However, when the table is open and the 8 ball is the first ball contacted, no stripe or solid may be scored in favor of the shooter. The shooter loses his turn and any balls pocketed remain pocketed, and the incoming player addresses the balls with the table still open. On an open table, all illegally pocketed balls remain pocketed."

I am confused. If it is legal to hit the 8 ball first to sink a ball, why is no stripe or solid scored in favor of the shooter, and why does the shooter lose his turn?

Thank you.

Rick
Click to expand...

If by BCA rules you are talking about the Billiard Congress of America rules, they follow the WPA World Standardized rules:

3.4 Open Table / Choosing Groups
Before groups are determined, the table is said to be “open,” and before each shot, the shooter must call his intended ball. If the shooter legally pockets his called ball, the corresponding group becomes his, and his opponent is assigned the other group. If he fails to legally pocket his called ball, the table remains open and play passes to the other player. When the table is “open”, any object ball may be struck first except the eight ball.

If you are referring BCAPL rules (the the pool league), this was already referenced in post #2.

In either case, you can't use the 8 ball first to play a combination.

Do you have a link online to this rule #10 you are referencing?
 
Last edited:
Bumpa said:
Hi -

BCA 8 Ball Rules say:

"10. OPEN TABLE...When the table is open it is legal to hit any solid or stripe or the 8-ball first in the process of pocketing the called stripe or solid. However, when the table is open and the 8 ball is the first ball contacted, no stripe or solid may be scored in favor of the shooter. The shooter loses his turn and any balls pocketed remain pocketed, and the incoming player addresses the balls with the table still open. On an open table, all illegally pocketed balls remain pocketed."

I am confused. If it is legal to hit the 8 ball first to sink a ball, why is no stripe or solid scored in favor of the shooter, and why does the shooter lose his turn?

Thank you.

Rick
Click to expand...

You are quoting an old rule...it was changed somewhere around 2003. You either have an old book or are linking to outdated information.

The current information for both World Standardized Rules (which you are referring to as "BCA") and for BCAPL has been posted earlier by others. See my disclaimers for more info on the rule sets.

:)
Buddy Eick
BCAPL National Head Referee
BCAPL Director of Referee Training
Technical Editor, BCAPL Rule Book
bcapl_referee@cox.net

Find the Official Rules of the BCA Pool League here:

http://www.playbca.com/Downloads/Rulebook/CompleteRulebook/tabid/372/Default.aspx

* Unless specifically stated, the contents of this post refer to BCA Pool League (BCAPL) Rules only. The BCAPL National Office has authorized me to act in an official capacity regarding questions about BCAPL Rules matters in public forums.
* Unless specifically stated, no reference to, inference concerning, or comment on any other set of rules (WPA, APA, VNEA, TAP, or any other set of rules, public or private) is intended or should be derived from this post.
* Neither I, nor any BCAPL referee, make any policy decisions regarding BCAPL Rules. Any and all decisions, interpretations, or Applied Rulings are made by the BCAPL National Office and are solely their responsibility. BCAPL referees are enforcers of rules, not legislators. BCAPL Rules 9.5.3 and 9.5.4 and the BCAPL Rules "Statement of Principles" apply.
* For General Rules, 8-Ball, 9-Ball, 10-Ball, and 14.1 Continuous: there is no such thing as "BCA Rules" other than in the sense that the Billiard Congress of America (BCA) publishes various rules, including the World Pool-Billiard Association's "World Standardized Rules" for those games. The BCA has no rules committee. The BCA does not edit, nor is responsible for the content of, the World Standardized Rules. The Official Rules of the BCAPL is a separate and independent set of rules and, to avoid confusion, should not be referred to as "BCA Rules".
* Since 2004, there is no such thing as a "BCA Referee". The BCA no longer has any program to train, certify or sanction billiards referees or officials. The BCAPL maintains what we consider to be the most structured, complete and intensive referee training program available.
* The BCAPL has no association with the Billiard Congress of America other than in their capacity as a member of the BCA. The letters "BCA" in BCAPL do not stand for "Billiard Congress of America, nor for anything at all.
* The BCAPL has not addressed every imaginable rules issue, nor will it ever likely be able to, as evidenced by the seemingly endless situations that people dream up or that (more frequently) actually happen. If I do not have the answer to a question I will tell you so, then I will get a ruling from the BCAPL National Office and get back to you as soon as I can. If deemed necessary, the BCAPL will then add the ruling to the "Applied Rulings" section of The Official Rules of the BCA Pool League.
* All BCAPL members are, as always, encouraged to e-mail Bill Stock at the BCAPL National Office, bill@playcsi.com, with any comments, concerns or suggestions about the BCAPL rules.
 
Now I'm confused......

tatcat2000 said:
You are quoting an old rule...it was changed somewhere around 2003. You either have an old book or are linking to outdated information.

The current information for both World Standardized Rules (which you are referring to as "BCA") and for BCAPL has been posted earlier by others. See my disclaimers for more info on the rule sets.

:)
Buddy Eick
BCAPL National Head Referee
BCAPL Director of Referee Training
Technical Editor, BCAPL Rule Book
bcapl_referee@cox.net
Click to expand...

I thought I knew the rules perfectly and suddenly I'm not sure. If you hit the eight ball first with an open table is it just the end of your inning or is it a foul?

This could make a big difference in strategy at certain times.
 
metmot said:
I thought I knew the rules perfectly and suddenly I'm not sure. If you hit the eight ball first with an open table is it just the end of your inning or is it a foul?

This could make a big difference in strategy at certain times.
Click to expand...

It would have to be a foul because the 8 ball is not a legal object ball (rule 2.5 of the BCAPL rules already cited). So by rule 1.19 #1 it would be an illegal shot:

1.19 Legal Shot (AR p. 75)
1. For a shot to be legal, the first ball contacted by the cue ball must be a legal object ball. After that contact:
a. any object ball must be pocketed, or;
b. any object ball or the cue ball must contact a cushion.

I'm referring to BCAPL rules but I'm pretty sure it is the same for World rules.
 
Buddy -

> You are quoting an old rule...it was changed somewhere around 2003.
> You either have an old book or are linking to outdated information.

Bingo.

I was quoting from my Billiard Congress of America "Billiards-The Official Rules and Records Book" dated 2000.

Thank you all for answering my question.

Rick
 
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