Best Spot to Open Up Pack

[lfigueroa]

This sounds like the shot Bruin likes. I've watched Hohmann do this as well, except his cue ball draws to the head of the table, 2 rails, and all the way back down to the foot end of the table where the balls are.

dwhite

I imagine he only does this when he has a shallow angle into the rack...

Lou Figueroa
just guessing

 

[lfigueroa]

I left that out because it seemed there was enough on the plate already. I know you like hitting one ball instead of two, but do you not find that you can get a better spread by hitting two balls instead of one, all things being equal?



That's very interesting! I hadn't considered the idea of changing contact point by changing cue ball angle. I don't understand why the angle would change, since the contact point on the object ball (and the tangent line) is the same for any angle, except for a minor difference due to throw. I think throw is the most for 1/2 ball hits, and least for full or thin cuts. Is this the reason your contact point changes? I'm surprised it changes that much.

On this shot you can do a lot of different things just by controlling your stroke speed. Heck, with the right power follow stroke you could easily hit the three, have the cue ball back up and squat mid-table (or, if hit less than ideally, go one rail or straight into the side pocket

I think using the right stroke speed and hit on the cue ball is part of becoming a better straight pool player. The same applies to going into clusters or secondary break shots. How you hit the shot and what stroke speed you use changes everything, often by a lot.

Lou Figueroa

 

[3andstop]

I think its worth a quick experiment. Its all good if it works for you. As I mentioned, I like in certain angle situations very similar to what is being discussed, to use a touch of inside draw. It helps me control the amount the cue comes back.

Also, on a complete unrelated side note to the draw, the inside english helps IMO prevent the break shot over tensing syndrome that can result in the over application of outside english which over spins the shot to the side rail.

 

[Dan White]

I imagine he only does this when he has a shallow angle into the rack...

Lou Figueroa
just guessing

I couldn't say as I don't remember the orientation of the balls. I do remember that the rack splattered open pretty well, though.

dwhite

 

[Dan White]

On this shot you can do a lot of different things just by controlling your stroke speed. Heck, with the right power follow stroke you could easily hit the three, have the cue ball back up and squat mid-table (or, if hit less than ideally, go one rail or straight into the side pocket

I think using the right stroke speed and hit on the cue ball is part of becoming a better straight pool player. The same applies to going into clusters or secondary break shots. How you hit the shot and what stroke speed you use changes everything, often by a lot.

Lou Figueroa

I don't see how I could make the cue ball contact the 3 with follow, Lou. Here is the diagram again,

http://CueTable.com/P/?@4ADvO4BCYB4...KCxA3LBjP3MEMO4NKwm3OBal4PLLe4kLLe4kJJX4kFBy@

Let's say as a ground rule that the 1/2 crotch is the tangent line. Now I could cheat the corner pocket a little and get the cue ball to come higher on the 2, but how can I get the cue ball to come back away from the tangent line with follow? Unless you are jumping the cueball, or something weird, I don't understand.

If you asked me how to contact the 3, my only hope would be a very soft hit with tons of draw.

dwhite

 

[lfigueroa]

I don't see how I could make the cue ball contact the 3 with follow, Lou. Here is the diagram again,

http://CueTable.com/P/?@4ADvO4BCYB4...KCxA3LBjP3MEMO4NKwm3OBal4PLLe4kLLe4kJJX4kFBy@

Let's say as a ground rule that the 1/2 crotch is the tangent line. Now I could cheat the corner pocket a little and get the cue ball to come higher on the 2, but how can I get the cue ball to come back away from the tangent line with follow? Unless you are jumping the cueball, or something weird, I don't understand.

If you asked me how to contact the 3, my only hope would be a very soft hit with tons of draw.

dwhite

OK, you're right, Dan. The 14 is a little lower than I first thought. I guess I was thinking it was something more like this:

http://CueTable.com/P/?@4ANia4BCYB3...HAMB3IAUe3JFbd4KDnP3LBjP3MEMO4NBJl3OBal4PNHg@

Lou Figueroa
Wei Table impaired

 

[Williebetmore]

...playing to draw it back to the headrail and back down was one of the games biggest no no's. I believe Williebetmore asked Danny Diliberto about this very thing one time, and if I remember his response was "Yea it's ok to do that when you stop liking money." Also, I've never seen a pro do it on any accu-stats tapes. .

SP,
I will admit that I always thought that there might be a situation where this could be a viable option - but I no longer believe it. A true old-schooler will examine the rack and object ball; and will be able to come up with a stroke that will keep whitey on the foot half of the table. If the player doesn't know how to do this, then he should hit away as best he can.

Remember that the difference between a semi-stun hit (that will leave whitey center table) and a hard draw (that brings whitey back into the kitchen) may be a difference of a single millimeter in contact point on whitey. With a forceful hit these mistakes may be amplified, and many of these forceful draws may be MISTAKES (you would have to ask the player shooting).

Having said that, I watched Niels performance; and can honestly say that I thought those draws back into the kitchen were not good shots (did any make it back out of the kitchen???....if they did, it was not by much) - leaving him much tougher shots than most players would like. He was very lucky to have easy recovery shots from his position downtable...such shots are often NOT available when whitey is sitting in the kitchen. Surely there are NO straight poolers who prefer a 8 or 9 foot shot out of the kitchen to a 3 or 4 foot shot from center table. Side pocket hangers are easy from either place; and corner pocket shots are often available from center table; but obstructed if you are in the kitchen. Even the monster pro's will have trouble coming off the stack, drawing all the way back to the head rail, and then getting whitey to come back out of the kitchen (remember that even though it looks dramatic, a LOT of the force of the breakshot is absorbed by the pack, and I have rarely seen the cueball escape it's usual fate "in the kitchen").

I fail to see any advantage in this type of break shot (count me "convinced by Danny D."). I also will refuse to critcize a player who likes it (Niels is a LOT better than me), but I will not attempt to emulate that particular style. I like the style of using as close to center ball as possible, with as little force as possible, with as little cueball movement as possible - these principles are sound, not just for regular play, but for the break shot as well. All of these things will help minimize risk, and maximize chances of success..........oh yes, also I will keep practicing my stroke until I can pocket balls like Niels - he's a freaking machine.