Biggest Money Game You've Seen

[bud green]

Originally Posted by yobagua
"Bud go back to that tape and listen again. Freddie was not saying 15K but 50K a game. This was Detroit then. Read Cornbread's book. Enjoy!"

I listened to the Varner/Mathews match again and they definately say 15K, not 50K a game as yobagua says. It basically went like this:

Freddie the Beard: " The highlight for me was one day Terry Howard was playing Al Sherman for fifteen grand a game on one table, and Cornbread Red was playing Paul Bruslov (sp) for fifteen grand a game on the next table..."

He goes on to say that Al Sherman used to have a one pocket coach to suggest shots for him during matches but he fired him because the coach kept telling him to play shots that Al didn't like!

I'll re-read Cornbreads book anyway; I love pool biographies. Danny Diliberto is supposed to be coming out with a new one, I just ordered Grady's, and I keep posting for Keith McCready to start his- Keith's might be the best out of all of them if someone can capture his personality in print.

 

[Rickw]

Didn't see it but thought this story would be worth sharing. A pro player, Jimmy, went into Bucktooth's place looking for a little action. Bucktooth told Jimmy, I'm not sure I have enough money to play. Then, he reached in one pocket and pulled out a wad, threw it on the table and counted it, $15,000. Then he reached in another pocket and pulled out another wad and it was $15,000 too. Bucktooth looked up at Jimmy and said that he guessed he had enough money to play after all. Then he locked Jimmy up with an incredible spot and sent him back on the road with considerably less money than he had when he got there.

The one thing that I really admire about Bucktooth's game is that he plays the same whether he's playing for $2.00 a game or $5,000 a game. He don't play too bad either! Of course no one is ever going to like the spot. I've never seen anyone get a lock on the game as good as him. I asked Parica if he ever played him and he just laughed and said that Bucktooth is too good at getting a lock on the game. He said that he was even better at it than him!

 

[piglit]

Anybody remember all the action at Jack and Jills in Arlington, VA back in the 70's? Everybody who was anybody played there for big bucks. We had roadies sleeping under the stairwell back then. Place never closed. I don't think there was a key to the place.
Don P.

Having grown up in the area...I'm pissed I missed it!

I have often heard the tales of the badasses passing thru Jack 'n' Jills- Lassiter, Crane, and the one who put something on 'em all, Tom Golley.

-pigu

 

[blud]

red's, in Houston..

RED'S, in HOUSTON, 83 thru 86 plus some,,,

Action big time. I was holding the cash when Mike Segil and Efren played in the back room at Red's. Mike got no where.
Flyer, and grady, played for 2 or 3 days, with grady coming out on top. Louie Roberts, played anyone who had cash. Of course, he went broke before the week was out. Hocked his cue [16] times, for a C-note, couldn't pay off so he just broke it in to as many pieces as he could, and walked out.[ god bless louie]...
Danny DiLiberto played all comers, Jersey Red, was in action full time, Wade Crane, [aka billy johnson], Wade came in second at the tournament, Efren won. The purse was $30,000.00 gurantted, by RED.....

Sammy Jones and James Christofer, were just in town [ after a 9 month road trip], with a trunk full of cash. [trunk, meaning the cars trunk] no bull...and bet high all week.Those were the days.

There was the famous, "LeCue" down town houston on Fannin St., Stephens, Grady, Red, Ronnie, Flyer, Richie Florance, Larry Hubdard, and many more. Lots of action for 5 or 6 years, non stop.
Action days, you bet, and you could bet what you could come with.

blud

 

[Purdman]

Having grown up in the area...I'm pissed I missed it!

I have often heard the tales of the badasses passing thru Jack 'n' Jills- Lassiter, Crane, and the one who put something on 'em all, Tom Golley.

-pigu

piglit, at the time, I was running a hall called the "Golden Cue" on Mount Vernon Ave. in Alexandria. There also was a little joint at the corner of Hume Ave. and Jeff Davis highway owned by a guy named Ted. Use to rack ball for .10 /rack when I was fourteen there. Now days, everything is geared towards the drinking set. Tables too close to the drink rail. Assholes abundant. Champions really knows how to put a place together. Can't find a bet to save my arse.
Don P.

 

[drivermaker]

Anybody remember all the action at Jack and Jills in Arlington, VA back in the 70's? Everybody who was anybody played there for big bucks. We had roadies sleeping under the stairwell back then. Place never closed. I don't think there was a key to the place.
Don P.

I remember it, what a great place. It was in that little shopping center in Shirlington where you walked straight down the steps from the street level. I saw Irving Crane win a 14.1 tournament there in the early 70's against a good field. I haven't been in DC area in almost 2 decades, is it still there? How about Weenie Beenie's hot dog stands?

 

[BackPocket9Ball]

I remember it, what a great place. It was in that little shopping center in Shirlington where you walked straight down the steps from the street level. I saw Irving Crane win a 14.1 tournament there in the early 70's against a good field. I haven't been in DC area in almost 2 decades, is it still there? How about Weenie Beenie's hot dog stands?

All there is in Shirlington now is a chain poolroom called Champions with loud music and bucket tables. Although there is action there, I'm sure it is a far cry from the room that Beanie owned.

 

[drivermaker]

piglit, at the time, I was running a hall called the "Golden Cue" on Mount Vernon Ave. in Alexandria. There also was a little joint at the corner of Hume Ave. and Jeff Davis highway owned by a guy named Ted. Use to rack ball for .10 /rack when I was fourteen there.
Don P.

I spent many a day and night at Jack & Jills, (never under the stairwell) but damn if I remember the "Golden Cue" on Mt. Vernon Ave, although I more than likely would have been there. What's bugging the hell out of me is even trying to remember Mt. Vernon Ave. Didn't it start off of Glebe Rd. a little ways up from Jeff Davis Hwy., then wind around back for a couple of miles to the left eventually crossing Jeff Davis and then continuing through town? So, was it between Glebe Rd. somewhere past the Waffle Shop that used to be open all night and Jeff Davis? That was a stoned period of life, and I hope that's all it was and not onset Alzheimers. Maybe if you can tell me exactly where it was it'll bring back some memories.

 

[Rude Dog]

Although I didn't actually SEE the money, I witnessed a $20,000 a game 9-ball in Vegas back in the early 90's between Bobby Baldwin and Archie "The Greek". Neither one of them can play at all but they sure were bettin' it up. This was at The Rum Runner bar on Tropicana. I was told that Bobby was a big shot in the Mirage Casino and had plenty of cash. And Archie was just a gambler, made some real good scores in his time. The winner of this 9-ball match? No idea. They shoulda just flipped a coin for it!

 

[Keith McCready]

I lived in Baton Rouge for 5 years in the 70's and saw a lot of high dollar action at Greenway billiards.

I watched a ring game with players like Keith McCready, Buddy Hall, Grady Mathews, Larry Hubbart and Flyboy. Didn't get any sleep for days. EVERYONE was gambling either on the table or on the side. Haven't seen anything like it since. Hemicuda was there from time to time and could add plenty I'm sure.

Lunchmoney, I was supposed to come back there when the action started up again at the Greenway, when Mark Betor was over there with Jack Cooney. I wasn't able to make it, but I heard there was a lot of action.

I remember that ring game you're talking about. It was a hell of a game, a lot of cabbage.

I wish those days would crank back up again, but they're sort of far few and in between. I live for those games, and I wish we could have them every day. Gambling is sort of what you make it in certain situations. When all those money people are around, I try to make things happen, whether it is a partner game, a one-on-one game, a player with a backer, or a backer playing the other backer. That's what makes it all good.

I saw Dot after that, and me and Dot had a lot of fun together. We went to the racetrack, the casino, and whatever there was to gamble on. Her and Bob staked me when I was there at the Greenway, and they have always been real good to me. It's a shame Bob died, but Dot is still kicking around over there in New Orleans.

Pool is trying to pick up. It hasn't got there yet, but in the near future, it will. And hopefully, I'll be a part of it.

 

[camargored]

big action?

DCC couple of years back Jack C and James W playin some one hole for days With the bet and the rail rumor is around 160k anyone got anymore solid info on this ive heard a lot of romurs?

 

[!Smorgass Bored]

There always has been lots of action in the New Orleans area. The amazing thing (at least to me) is that incredible amounts of money have (and still do) change hands from 'B' and even 'C' players. There used to be a bar on Veterans Blvd. in the first block across the Kenner lines that was owned by Billy Songy and Billy Raney. I was their first customer (before they had actually opened) and I came up with the name the SONRA LOUNGE (combining letters of both their names) and using an 8-ball as the letter O.
Both Billys worked at the race tracks as tellers and loved to gamble. The Sonra became the hotspot for pool, poker, craps, gin rummy and ANY other hustle (or con game) that you might imagine (even Harry Anderson from Night Court stopped in to win a few bar bets). All the local players and all the road players stopped there for easy action/money. You might see Buddy Hall, N.Y. Blackie, Benny "The Goose" Conway, Dan Louie (Cowboy/Whoppie and Painter) and a lot more that snuck in and out under fake names, there at any given time. There was always 'something' going on for the cash from 1974 until the late 80s.. Every hustle was paraded through there at one time or another including, three card Monty, throwing a playing card the farthest, knocking down a bowling pin with a playing card, find the pea under the bottle cap, running the fastest or farthest, jumping the highest or naming the Seven Dwarfs for cash and every possible pool proposition bet.
The most money that I've ever seen at one time was at Kenny Vincent's Southside in Fat City (New Orleans/Metairie). Danny Wong was playing Al Werlin
and as the bet kept getting raised, so did the rail action. Danny was stuck and wanted to raise the bet, yet again. Werlin questioned whether Danny had the BR (bankroll) to back up these constant raises. Danny called his brother and his brother showed up only minutes later with a briefcase filled with hundred dollar bills. OY-VEY ! I couldn't believe my eyes.
I suspect that the money at Breakers in Mobile would make Danny's BR pale by comparison, but much of it is kept in pants pockets until it's posted. I really like Breaker's for all the top dollar action that is generated there (it's like dying and going to heaven)
I went to New Orleans a couple of years ago and after a twelve hour drive, I popped into the Corner Pocket. Flyboy (Jimmy Spears) was playing Lil Sal for a fair (considerable) amount of jellybeans. I believe that they were playing 'seven ahead' one-pocket and had been playing since the previous night. I sweated the game the rest of the day and then went to meet some family for dinner. After dinner, they were still playing. I was tired from the long drive and went to my hotel room. The next day, they were STILL playing. I went over and sweated the game all day and when I left, they were still playing. I went to my room for the second night and at some point in the early a.m., they were 'even' and they surrendered. Flyboy looked as if he couldn't walk and that he might simply just fall over at any moment, but he was tenacious.
Someone asked if he were dead or alive now and I'm pretty certain that he is still alive (as of a few days ago).....
I haven't seen the 'most money' that I've ever seen gambling at pool, yet. But, I'm sure enjoying sweating the big money matches until I do see it... imo

 

[1 Pocket Ghost]

$$$$$ @ Derby City

DCC couple of years back Jack C and James W playin some one hole for days With the bet and the rail rumor is around 160k anyone got anymore solid info on this ive heard a lot of romurs?

As a matter of fact, i was just about to post re. this session - i watched many hours of it....It was either 4 or five years ago. The bet between the players (backers) was for 50k, i don't know how much more was bet on the rail. If my bad memory serves, the race was ten ahead. They played agreed upon 12 hour sessions (if necessary) from approx. 3:00 p.m. to 3:00 a.m. and then they stopped for dinner and sleep. Jack eventually won and if i remember correctly it took until the third day, although it might have been at the end of the second day. It was all time one pocket sweating - they were both playing real good.

 

[hemicudas]

There always has been lots of action in the New Orleans area. The amazing thing (at least to me) is that incredible amounts of money have (and still do) change hands from 'B' and even 'C' players. There used to be a bar on Veterans Blvd. in the first block across the Kenner lines that was owned by Billy Songy and Billy Raney. I was their first customer (before they had actually opened) and I came up with the name the SONRA LOUNGE (combining letters of both their names) and using an 8-ball as the letter O.
Both Billys worked at the race tracks as tellers and loved to gamble. The Sonra became the hotspot for pool, poker, craps, gin rummy and ANY other hustle (or con game) that you might imagine (even Harry Anderson from Night Court stopped in to win a few bar bets). All the local players and all the road players stopped there for easy action/money. You might see Buddy Hall, N.Y. Blackie, Benny "The Goose" Conway, Dan Louie (Cowboy/Whoppie and Painter) and a lot more that snuck in and out under fake names, there at any given time. There was always 'something' going on for the cash from 1974 until the late 80s.. Every hustle was paraded through there at one time or another including, three card Monty, throwing a playing card the farthest, knocking down a bowling pin with a playing card, find the pea under the bottle cap, running the fastest or farthest, jumping the highest or naming the Seven Dwarfs for cash and every possible pool proposition bet.
The most money that I've ever seen at one time was at Kenny Vincent's Southside in Fat City (New Orleans/Metairie). Danny Wong was playing Al Werlin
and as the bet kept getting raised, so did the rail action. Danny was stuck and wanted to raise the bet, yet again. Werlin questioned whether Danny had the BR (bankroll) to back up these constant raises. Danny called his brother and his brother showed up only minutes later with a briefcase filled with hundred dollar bills. OY-VEY ! I couldn't believe my eyes.
I suspect that the money at Breakers in Mobile would make Danny's BR pale by comparison, but much of it is kept in pants pockets until it's posted. I really like Breaker's for all the top dollar action that is generated there (it's like dying and going to heaven)
I went to New Orleans a couple of years ago and after a twelve hour drive, I popped into the Corner Pocket. Flyboy (Jimmy Spears) was playing Lil Sal for a fair (considerable) amount of jellybeans. I believe that they were playing 'seven ahead' one-pocket and had been playing since the previous night. I sweated the game the rest of the day and then went to meet some family for dinner. After dinner, they were still playing. I was tired from the long drive and went to my hotel room. The next day, they were STILL playing. I went over and sweated the game all day and when I left, they were still playing. I went to my room for the second night and at some point in the early a.m., they were 'even' and they surrendered. Flyboy looked as if he couldn't walk and that he might simply just fall over at any moment, but he was tenacious.
Someone asked if he were dead or alive now and I'm pretty certain that he is still alive (as of a few days ago).....
I haven't seen the 'most money' that I've ever seen gambling at pool, yet. But, I'm sure enjoying sweating the big money matches until I do see it... imo

Smorgass Bored,,,,my friend...... I thought I was the only person on this board that remembered the SONRA LOUNGE.

Two, seven foot Valley tables in the front, the bar on the right and the DOSCO floor in the back.... I know, what the hell does DISCO and pool have in common? Answer? GROUPIES!!!!!! The most beautiful women in New Orleans would come to the SONRA LOUNGE after midnight to dance and/or watch the pool action. The male dancers use to support the pool players.

All it took was one of the girls to tell the guy that was hitting on her, at that point in time, that she liked pool players too. Then, like a speeding bullit, off he went to challenge the cheap $10-$20 table. Frequently she would tell him, "Look, they are playing for $100 a game on the other table." Depending on how good she looked and how much money he had, he just might jump on the $100 table. A few of the regular players would toss the girls a Jelly Roll for steering the guy to them.

Had to mention my old buddy, Bennie Conway, didn't ya Smorgass Bored. He was a jewel. Bob Dancer and I walk in one night and bust the house. We were just about to leave and Bennie walks in. Dancer busted 3 of Bennie's stake horses at the SONRA so he says he will play some more at the Corner Pocket. We bust another stake horse there. Then Bennie takes us to the Sport Palace. He goes over and talks to Earl Heisler and gets some more cash. Dancer gets that money too. Then a drug dealing pimp comes in with enough cash to buy the Palace and that was all it took. Bennie falls in stroke and gets all the money back. 5 of Bennie's stake horses are broke. We are even and Bennie and the pimp get all the cash.

We never should have left the bar boxes at the SONRA. Dancer played the 9ft table ok but his long suite was bar boxes. The stake horse we busted at the Corner Pocket was, you will love this, Tenneco, lol.

 

[piglit]

Senior moment alert!!

-piga

I spent many a day and night at Jack & Jills, (never under the stairwell) but damn if I remember the "Golden Cue" on Mt. Vernon Ave, although I more than likely would have been there. What's bugging the hell out of me is even trying to remember Mt. Vernon Ave. Didn't it start off of Glebe Rd. a little ways up from Jeff Davis Hwy., then wind around back for a couple of miles to the left eventually crossing Jeff Davis and then continuing through town? So, was it between Glebe Rd. somewhere past the Waffle Shop that used to be open all night and Jeff Davis? That was a stoned period of life, and I hope that's all it was and not onset Alzheimers. Maybe if you can tell me exactly where it was it'll bring back some memories.

 

[lunchmoney]

Lunchmoney, I was supposed to come back there when the action started up again at the Greenway, when Mark Betor was over there with Jack Cooney. I wasn't able to make it, but I heard there was a lot of action.

I remember that ring game you're talking about. It was a hell of a game, a lot of cabbage.

I wish those days would crank back up again, but they're sort of far few and in between. I live for those games, and I wish we could have them every day. Gambling is sort of what you make it in certain situations. When all those money people are around, I try to make things happen, whether it is a partner game, a one-on-one game, a player with a backer, or a backer playing the other backer. That's what makes it all good.

I saw Dot after that, and me and Dot had a lot of fun together. We went to the racetrack, the casino, and whatever there was to gamble on. Her and Bob staked me when I was there at the Greenway, and they have always been real good to me. It's a shame Bob died, but Dot is still kicking around over there in New Orleans.

Pool is trying to pick up. It hasn't got there yet, but in the near future, it will. And hopefully, I'll be a part of it.

You are right about there being a lot of cabbage in the ring game. I seemed to recall when you had to leave the game to play a tournament match the wad of bills in your pocket resembled an entire head of cabbage.

One question though, who is Bob that passed away? The only Bob I remember from Greenway was Bobby Dancer. Are you thinking about Lambert Louvier perhaps? I believe he and Dot were married. Hemicudas is interested to know also. Please let us know, thanks.

Lunchmoney

 

[lunchmoney]

I sure do. The funniest thing was watching about 500 hustlers trying to get the scoop on the other players. I walked in after Weenie Beenie just played a match for $5,000. The people were just breaking up.

I also saw the greatest 9 ball player ever at Jack and Jills, Cole 'The Kid' Dixon IMHO. I never got to watch Dixon play for the big bucks, so I am still waiting for someone to clue me in about my opinion on Cole. Maybe he was just a flash in the pan or I was just dreaming, but he sure could shoot the lights out. I saw him more times than once push out the lenght of the table, leaving the cue ball on the rail and the other ball at the other end with a 89 degree cut. His opponent said go ahead and shoot and he just cut the eyes out of the ball time after time after time. One opponent said he must have made a pact with the Devil.

P.S. Playboy magazine did an article back then on the hottest pool spot on the East Coast, Jack and Jills. Oh how I long for the good ole days.

Cole Dickson can still play and I agree on your opinion of him. I have been watching him for years. He lived for a long time in my home state of Washington in a town called Davenport. I heard that he has since moved to Montana. A friend of mine living in Spokane told me that Cole was in town recently visiting his daughter and was at the pool hall taking on anyone who wanted to play. My friend told me that Cole was hitting the ball real good and didn't book may losers.

 

[Keith McCready]

You are right about there being a lot of cabbage in the ring game. I seemed to recall when you had to leave the game to play a tournament match the wad of bills in your pocket resembled an entire head of cabbage.

One question though, who is Bob that passed away? The only Bob I remember from Greenway was Bobby Dancer. Are you thinking about Lambert Louvier perhaps? I believe he and Dot were married. Hemicudas is interested to know also. Please let us know, thanks.

Lunchmoney, I think you're right about the first name of Lambert. I was thinking about another guy named Lambert whose first name was Bob.

I know Lambert just like I can see him right in front of my face. He staked me high, him and Dot, for whatever I wanted to play for. He was found dead in the room, which is still a mystery today.

 

[Rick]

Texas player

Hi guys, Blud posted a forum naming guys I guess from Texas. I shoot in a local tourney and got talking with an older gent from Texas. To make a long story shorter he said the best nine ball player he ever saw was a guy named Stephans. He said no one would play him without weight, aand Blud mentioned his name in his thread. Does anyone know anything about him.
Take care guys and God bless our troops.

 

[hemicudas]

Hi guys, Blud posted a forum naming guys I guess from Texas. I shoot in a local tourney and got talking with an older gent from Texas. To make a long story shorter he said the best nine ball player he ever saw was a guy named Stephans. He said no one would play him without weight, aand Blud mentioned his name in his thread. Does anyone know anything about him.
Take care guys and God bless our troops.

Yea Rick. The guy Blud is talking about is Greg Stevens. Many thought his name was Craig Stevens but that was the name of the guy who played Peter Gunn on TV so Greg got to be Craig in some places. The elderly gentleman and Blud speak the truth. Greg Stevens, when in stroke, was capable of beating Buddy, Mike, Keith or any other name you can come up with of that era.

The Jamborees Blud talks about at Red's in Houston most often included Greg Stevens. I think Greg use to stay with Blud when he was in town too.


P.S. Had to ad this. None of the names mentiioned would play Keth McCready even on the bar table though.