Changing balance point with weight bolt

R

ronscuba

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
My Pechauer weight bolt has a white shoulder/head. I know Pechauer makes heavier/longer bolts. Would like to move the balance point forward.

To keep the cue weight the same, I was thinking to get a bolt the same weight, but without a shoulder/head so I could screw it further into the shaft and move the balance point forward.

Will this work and if so, does anyone know the thread size of Pechauer bolt ?
 
ronscuba said:
My Pechauer weight bolt has a white shoulder/head. I know Pechauer makes heavier/longer bolts. Would like to move the balance point forward.

To keep the cue weight the same, I was thinking to get a bolt the same weight, but without a shoulder/head so I could screw it further into the shaft and move the balance point forward.

Will this work and if so, does anyone know the thread size of Pechauer bolt ?
Click to expand...

You have a weight bolt in the butt of a cue and want to remove it and put a weight bolt in the shaft?, or do you mean you want to screw it further up into the cavity of the butt that the current bolt is installed in?

If the latter, that will NOT move the actual balance point forward unless you screw the weight bolt past the current balance point...which isn't likely.

Depending on how you hold the handle, where you hold it for stretch shots, etc, it might change the feel here and there, but the actual balance point will not be changed if the bolt is the same weight and installed behind the current balance point and no other weight is removed from the cue (as in boring deeper).

Kelly
 
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I was thinking screw it further into the butt. Thinking a 3oz bolt screwed two inches further in, would shift the balance point. Maybe not a two inch shift, but something ? What if I went two inches further in with a 2 oz bolt ?
 
Kelly,I have to disagree with you saying by moving the weight bolt closer to The balance point it will not change the balance point.Im sitting here having a few beers,balancing a pen on my finger with a necklace on one side,and if I move the necklace closer to the center the balance changes.The same should apply to the internal weight of a cue.
 
An approach that will net you noticeable results is to find a heavier shaft.
Whatever the difference in wght. btwn the 2 shafts, remove that from the butt.
The cue will weigh the same and will be more fwd balanced.
 
str8shooter said:
Kelly,I have to disagree with you saying by moving the weight bolt closer to The balance point it will not change the balance point.Im sitting here having a few beers,balancing a pen on my finger with a necklace on one side,and if I move the necklace closer to the center the balance changes.The same should apply to the internal weight of a cue.
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By definition, the balance point is the point at which the weight on both sides of the location are the same. If the bolt is not moved past the current balance point and the bolt is not reduced, the balance point will not change, period.

Balancing a pen on a finger is not a good way to measure the balance point. How fat is your finger? Try balancing the pen on something of a smaller diameter than the pen that is perfectly round and offering no friction and report back.

Kelly
 
KJ Cues said:
An approach that will net you noticeable results is to find a heavier shaft.
Whatever the difference in wght. btwn the 2 shafts, remove that from the butt.
The cue will weigh the same and will be more fwd balanced.
Click to expand...

Nail on the head. That is the problem. Got a Predator shaft (which I like) which is lighter than the original Pechauer shaft.
 
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ronscuba said:
I was thinking screw it further into the butt. Thinking a 3oz bolt screwed two inches further in, would shift the balance point. Maybe not a two inch shift, but something ? What if I went two inches further in with a 2 oz bolt ?
Click to expand...

Reducing the bolt from 3 oz to 2 oz will shift the balance point forward, and of course reduce the weight. Moving the 3 oz bolt forward 2 inches will do nothing to change the actual balance point, again, unless the bolt is moved past the current balance point.

Now, I'm not saying you won't feel the difference, and I'm not saying it isn't worth it. It also depends on where you grip the cue. People grip the cue behind the typical balance point. If you shift the bolt forward to the point or beyond where you actually grip the cue, you will feel the difference. That is not moving the balance point forward though, that is just giving the cue a more naturally weighted feel due to where the bolt is located.

Kelly
 
Kelly_Guy said:
..... Moving the 3 oz bolt forward 2 inches will do nothing to change the actual balance point, again, unless the bolt is moved past the current balance point......
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I just did a quick test. I unscrewed the weight bolt so only a few threads were in. The bolt moved approx. 3 inches back. The balance point moved 1 inch.
 
Apparently, I slept through this part of physics. It appears I am all wrong, you guys are right. My definition of balance point is all wet.

Kelly
 
Kelly_Guy said:
Apparently, I slept through this part of physics. It appears I am all wrong, you guys are right. My definition of balance point is all wet.

Kelly
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Apparently you've never played on a teeter totter as a kid.
 
ronscuba said:
I just did a quick test. I unscrewed the weight bolt so only a few threads were in. The bolt moved approx. 3 inches back. The balance point moved 1 inch.
Click to expand...

At least you answered your own question, no thanks to me.

Maybe I will write a computer program to predict things like how far the balance point will move based on where a bolt is located...now that I know what "balance point" really means...

Kelly
 
Kelly_Guy said:
At least you answered your own question, no thanks to me.

Maybe I will write a computer program to predict things like how far the balance point will move based on where a bolt is located...now that I know what "balance point" really means...

Kelly
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Well, I tested the theory.

Still remains to be seen if I can move the balance point enough for my needs.

I don't know how deep Pechauer made the hole. Still have to find a headless bolt with the same thread size. Headed to Home Depot tomorrow.

Discussions like this are always good. Sharing information and talking things out is what I like best about forum boards.
 
Just a thought

I would consider simply changing to a lighter weight bolt. In my personal experience, the balance point affects the "feel" of a cue more than the weight. The balance will move forward (with a lighter bolt) and you may not really notice the reduction in weight.
 
Bill the Cat said:
I would consider simply changing to a lighter weight bolt. In my personal experience, the balance point affects the "feel" of a cue more than the weight. The balance will move forward (with a lighter bolt) and you may not really notice the reduction in weight.
Click to expand...

I'm going to try both options.

Hardware store did not have head less bolts, so I bought a one foot piece of 1/2" threaded rod. Will cut a bolt 1" shorter than my current bolt which should give me a .75 oz lighter bolt and notch the top for a flat blade screwdriver. Then play around with screw in depth.
 
Balance is not only affected by the weight on each side of the fulcrum, but also the distance of the weight from the fulcrum. I don't remember the exact equation but it's kinda like, a fulcrum with one inch of length to either side and one ounce attached to the ends will balance. Move one of those weights in by 1/2" & it's still the same weight on each side of the fulcrum by due to the distance of the weight from the fulcrum, the farthest away will have most leverage & will overcome the other side. Hopefully that made sense. It's a leverage thing as much as it is a weight thing.
 
qbilder said:
Balance is not only affected by the weight on each side of the fulcrum, but also the distance of the weight from the fulcrum. I don't remember the exact equation but it's kinda like, a fulcrum with one inch of length to either side and one ounce attached to the ends will balance. Move one of those weights in by 1/2" & it's still the same weight on each side of the fulcrum by due to the distance of the weight from the fulcrum, the farthest away will have most leverage & will overcome the other side. Hopefully that made sense. It's a leverage thing as much as it is a weight thing.
Click to expand...

Yep. Hopefully my plan will get me the balance I want. The theory is sound, but it may not change the balance point enough.

Curious as to how cue makers adjust balance point for their customers. Is this a legitimate method or is balance point established early in the design phase and changes are limited once the cue is built ?
 
qbilder said:
Balance is not only affected by the weight on each side of the fulcrum, but also the distance of the weight from the fulcrum. I don't remember the exact equation but it's kinda like, a fulcrum with one inch of length to either side and one ounce attached to the ends will balance. Move one of those weights in by 1/2" & it's still the same weight on each side of the fulcrum by due to the distance of the weight from the fulcrum, the farthest away will have most leverage & will overcome the other side. Hopefully that made sense. It's a leverage thing as much as it is a weight thing.
Click to expand...




http://www.grc.nasa.gov/WWW/k-12/WindTunnel/Activities/balance_of_forces.html
http://www.educatorsoutlet.com/pdf/12562 Fulcrum Balance.pdf
 
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qbilder said:
Balance is not only affected by the weight on each side of the fulcrum, but also the distance of the weight from the fulcrum. I don't remember the exact equation but it's kinda like, a fulcrum with one inch of length to either side and one ounce attached to the ends will balance. Move one of those weights in by 1/2" & it's still the same weight on each side of the fulcrum by due to the distance of the weight from the fulcrum, the farthest away will have most leverage & will overcome the other side. Hopefully that made sense. It's a leverage thing as much as it is a weight thing.
Click to expand...

Meaning take some weight from the bottom then put it under the pin or use a heavier pin.:D
Me no like weight bolts.
 
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