Comments on Willie Moscont

Bavafongoul said:
The only thing that doesn't get discussed on Az, which amazes me, is that Willie played for years on 10 ft.tables in US Open Championship Competition. ...
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Mosconi's championships were split about evenly between the 1940's (10 footers) and 1950's,

Per his autobiography, his last formal competition, after a 10-year absence, was in April, 1966. It was an 18-player invitational in California. Willie finished second to Joe Balsis, decided he had had enough of championship-level competition, and retired. But he did continue with exhibitions and things like the shenanigans with Fats.

The first US Open Straight Pool Championship was in 1966. Mosconi never played in those events.
 
pdcue said:
There was an article about the record run printed in the Springfield newspaper a few days later.
It describes the shot he missed.

Dale
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Another on the 50th anniversary of the run.

Lou Figueroa
 

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mvp said:
Lou, could you post the article? That's really cool!
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OK, sure, though it's a little early in the morning for this kind of work :-)

I do want to thank Tom Driscoll who came up to me at the 2013 DCC told me how much he’s enjoyed my writing over the years and offered me a copy of the special supplement to the “Springfield Times.”

So here it is, picking up below the fold and the jump to the Page 2.

Lou Figueroa
 

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lfigueroa said:
Yes, Mosconi played a half table game -- he was totally unafraid of shooting shots to the sides and far corner pockets. He'd get the CB just below the spot and run off 14 balls, barely moving the CB around.

As to gambling, if you read R.A Dryer's most excellent, "The Hustler & The Champ" about the rivalry between Mosconi and Fats, he documents numerous times Mosconi would clean out road players passing through town, to include Minnesota Fats. He didn't travel and hustle but he was unafraid to play for the cash. However, when he signed on with Brunswick, they wanted a squeaky clean image for the game and Mosconi tried to put his gambling days into the background.

I believe the terms for World Championships were different way back, and some years they would be decided by challenge matches stretched out over several weeks and cities. Consider that this was in the day when 14.1 was *the* game, front page NYTimes stuff, and there were wall-to-wall straight pool mechanics in every city like Philly and NYC. Mosconi dominated them all.

For his exhibitions, Mosconi brought his own set of balls. Due to his contract with Brunswick he was compelled to play on their tables and as long as it was a Brunswick he'd play on it. I don't believe he cared about the pocket size.

Did he sometimes throw a piece of chalk? Bad mouth an opponent? Be a dick? Sitting in the chair, chew his tongue until it bled? Yes. But he was a genius, a savant, and saw what the game could be and suffered anything but perfection poorly.

Lou Figueroa
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Love that book. Great post.

BmoreMoney said:
Who knows? But one thing is FOR SURE - every pool player alive would like to have the " record " yet none yet has done it. That's says plenty to me.
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Exactly!
Rimfirejunkie said:
The first 20 odd years were played on 10 footers!
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Yup. He called the 9'ers "puddle jumpers" once. Lol
PhilosopherKing said:
i think mosconi's record would have been doubled by now if the game and lifestyle hadn't gone the way of the dodo.

a guy like chang jun-lin would eat that record for breakfast if he played straight pool for a living and traveled around running balls in exhibitions.
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But. He has not. Must not be that "hungry" 😆
 
Another good piece from a previous post:

Mosconi_march_3_1946.PNG


Willie being Willie - someone who could spit out 100+ runs like he was falling out of bed.

Here's a few samples....


November 13, 1940
Mosconi Beats Lauri Twice
Willie won two blocks of his pocket billiard match with Onofrio Lauri...
..he triumphed, 125 to 13 in four innings, with an unfinished high run of 99.

January 11, 1941
MOSCONI DEFEATS CARAS
Willie Mosconi, who holds a commanding lead on the field, beat Jimmy Caras ... In his second game had a high run of 101, the fourth time since the beginning of the tournament..

February 12, 1941
MOSCONI DOWNS PROCITA
Willie Mosconi, leader in the race for the world pocket billiard championship...
....with a high run of 113, won in the afternoon, 125 to 21

February 24, 1941
MOSCONI INCREASES LEAD
Defeats Kelly Twice in World Pocket ... had high runs of 59 and 112

May 2, 1941
Mosconi Triumphs Twice
... high runs were 115 and 51 for the winner and 21 and 71 for Lauri .


February 24, 1945
MOSCONI TAKES 2 BLOCKS
Wins, 125-0, and 125-27, in Title Cue Match With Greenleaf


February 16, 1946
MOSCONI HAS RUN OF 102
Sets Record for Cue Match With Caras as He Divides 2 Blocks

March 18, 1946
MOSCONI INCREASES LEAD
( P)- Champion Willie Mosconi increased his lead over Caras..
The champion, who had a high run of 111 against Caras' best effort of 37, now leads ...

December 10, 1946
MOSCONI TIES CUE MARK
Tops Cranfield, 125 to 1, in Two Innings
the champion ran 125 and out for the longest run

May 15, 1947
Has High Run of 139 in Defeating Crane in Title Cue Series
CHICAGO, May 14 (IIP)-A high run of 139 helped Willie Mosconi, the challenger, win the ninth and tenth blocks of his world championship ...


November 13, 1947
MOSCONI KEEPS CUE TITLE; Beats Caras in Pocket Billiards
UP)...Caras registered the highest run of the series-121, while Mosconi'a high was 107


1950 - 10 FOOT TABLE NO LONGER STANDARD FOR PROFESSIONAL COMPETITION


January 13, 1951
Mosconi, Crane
PHILADELPHIA, Jan. 12 (UP)
-An unfinished high run of 107 tonight enabled the world pocket billiard champion, Willie Mosconi, to defeat Irving Crane, 150-38, ...

January 16, 1951
Mosconi Leads in Title Play
(UPI- Willie Mosconi held an 1800 to-1341 lead over Irving Crane of Binghamton, ny, tonight..... ... The champion had a high run of 104 in the afternoon.


January 22, 1952
Mosconi and Crane Divide
Willie Mosconi, world champion, and Irving Crane divided the first two blocks of their 1800-point exhibition ... In the first block, Mosconi had a high run of 114.

January 23, 1952
Mosconi Leads In Billiards
Willie Mosconi, world champion, beat Irving Crane twice yesterday....
.....won the afternoon match, 150--33, in six innings, with a high run of 101 .


May 1, 1952
Mosconi Sweeps Cue Match
Willie Mosconi, world champion, triumphed twice yesterday to complete a sweep...
.....high runs were 105 and 124 unfinished


November 11, 1952
Mosconi Beats Lauri Twice
Willie Mosconi, world champion, won the first two blocks of 1000-point exhibition
The titleholder's run of 123 at night was high for both blocks.

April 5, 1956
MOSCONI VICTOR, 150 - 0
Beats Eufemia in World Cue Tourney


December 21, 1960
MOSCONI BEATS LAURI
Willie Mosconi of Philadelphia clinched his 900-point match with Onofrio ...
... high runs of 39 and 122, with Lauri having clusters of 30 and 16.
 
Yes that's 308(9) on a 10 FOOT table.

" When he first won the championship in 1941 he ran 125 and out on 9 occasions. In 58 other instances ( in only 5 years time) he had runs of more than 100." ( on 10ft tables)

58 times.
 
I know I'm late to the party, but what I'm surprised about is the idea that a lot of people have that just because he played the majority of his exhibitions on 5 inch pockets, that he would not be able to compete on tables with smaller pockets.

I was watching an Irving Crane match from the 1986 championship and even at his age at the time, it wasn't as if the balls rattled in because the pockets were so big, they were going straight in. even in those challenge of champions espn matches, those older players(being around 70+) were shooting straight in. So where did the notion of them needing bigger pockets to compete come from?

Also, the one thing I've always found interesting(forgot where I read it) was that Mosconi at first was a world class 3 cushion player but he moved onto pocket billiards because Hoppe was pretty much above everyone else.
 
Thanks to all for all the great info.

A few things:
The journalist from Springfield could have at least got George Rood's name right.
How in the world do you run 526 balls in 2 hrs and 10 mins? That's crazy fast.
309 in a 10 footer, and 58 other 100 ball runs on a 10 footer- that's a gear that I don't know if anybody playing today (or since the 50s) could match.
 
Positively Ralf said:
Also, the one thing I've always found interesting(forgot where I read it) was that Mosconi at first was a world class 3 cushion player but he moved onto pocket billiards because Hoppe was pretty much above everyone else.
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The world’s championship three-cushion tournament in 1947 featured 10 players in a round-robin format. Three of those players were world champs in pool: Crane, Ponzi and Willie Mosconi. A fourth pool player was Joe Procita, no slouch in either style. Hoppe won. Mosconi finished 4th with a .760 grand average, followed by Andrew Ponzi (.819) in 5th and Joe Procita in 6th (.806).
 
JohnnyOzone said:
Thanks to all for all the great info.

A few things:
The journalist from Springfield could have at least got George Rood's name right.
How in the world do you run 526 balls in 2 hrs and 10 mins? That's crazy fast.
309 in a 10 footer, and 58 other 100 ball runs on a 10 footer- that's a gear that I don't know if anybody playing today (or since the 50s) could match.
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Going back to the OP's original line of questioning as to how "legit" Mosconi's titles were:

His tournament record undeniably speaks for itself. Not the 526 record, but his actual scores during tournament play against other top professionals.

One could argue (weakly) that perhaps his/the competition wasn't as tough as it might have been in another time period, like today for example.

However; his actual match scores do not reflect a weak player, barely beating other weak players. His scores ( on 10ft tables no less), reflect a man POUNDING his professional opponents again and again, frequently by a LARGE margin, for 20+ years.

If you were playing Willie and missed once, you were done.

What's more is he didn't win for a few years and burn out. He won consistently, and for longer than many player's entire careers last.

Someone please beat the 526, because that's about the only dent you can put in Willies record. :)
 
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