cue ball slide/stun

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evergruven

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I'm just curious about this phenomenon (or lack of one?)..
I can picture a ball having back spin and forward spin, I guess watching a ball slide isn't as visually stimulating
but in my pool journey, shooting a cb in its dead middle/with stun is ironically the last place I've thought to hit it
I'm sure it depends on cloth and stuff but how long can a cb slide for? distance-wise
anything else on the subject, I'm curious to learn about, physics, your experience, etc.
 
Why do you want to know and how will you use the information?
 
Dr Dave addressed this (more or less) in this link:
starting at about t he 10 minute mark.
Different cloth will have a major impact on how far you can 'skid' the ball before it starts to roll forward. For most stun shots of over 2 feet or so, you'll probably want to start with a below center hit. The backspin will be essentially no spin at the point of contact.
 
NevadaP said:
Dr Dave addressed this (more or less) in this link:
starting at about t he 10 minute mark.
Different cloth will have a major impact on how far you can 'skid' the ball before it starts to roll forward. For most stun shots of over 2 feet or so, you'll probably want to start with a below center hit. The backspin will be essentially no spin at the point of contact.
Click to expand...

good stuff- thank you!
 
evergruven said:
but in my pool journey, shooting a cb in its dead middle/with stun is ironically the last place I've thought to hit it
Click to expand...
I think it helps to clarify some terms, because it looks like you’re conflating hitting the CB ‘dead middle’ and ‘stun’, which aren’t necessarily the same things.

A ‘stun shot’ most commonly refers to the reaction of the CB after contact with the OB in which the CB follows the tangent line (the CB departs 90 degrees from the OB path), or the CB doesn’t move at all in the case of a straight-in stop shot. Stun occurs when the CB has no backward or forward roll at impact with the OB.

‘Hitting the CB with stun’ is hitting the CB such that it creates a stun shot, and exactly how the CB is hit can be different depending on distance, cloth, and shot speed. Hitting the CB ‘dead middle’ will result in a stun shot only if the CB is very close to the OB, or if the CB is hit with enough velocity, such that cloth friction doesn’t get a chance to cause significant forward roll on the CB at impact with the OB. But because of cloth friction, hitting the CB in the dead center will result in some forward roll at impact.

A pure stun shot is usually executed by hitting the CB some degree below center ball, depending cloth, distance, and speed.
 
evergruven said:
I'm just curious about this phenomenon (or lack of one?)..
I can picture a ball having back spin and forward spin, I guess watching a ball slide isn't as visually stimulating
but in my pool journey, shooting a cb in its dead middle/with stun is ironically the last place I've thought to hit it
I'm sure it depends on cloth and stuff but how long can a cb slide for? distance-wise
anything else on the subject, I'm curious to learn about, physics, your experience, etc.
Click to expand...
On slick cloth, if you blast it, you can probably get four feet where the cue ball is sliding well enough to be stun. I'll often hit just below center to move the sliding region of the trajectory a little further out.
 
evergruven said:
...anything else on the subject, I'm curious to learn about, physics, your experience, etc.
Click to expand...
Here's a visual of vertical spin basics - stun shot (stop shot if straight) represented by the red 3 ball.

pj
chgo

dragdraw.jpg
 
Stun shot is pretty much a stop shot at an angle. How long the cueball will slide without going into the natural roll is fully dependent on the speed of the shot, cloth design and condition how clean the cueball is. Too many variables to have a single answer. I would guess a human trying to do this would need a lot of attempts to get a good shot in with being able to hit it hard enough to travel far but accurate enough that it's not rolling forward or back at contact. Probably a shot within two feet of the object ball would be ideal, enough for the cueball to gain momentum but close enough for an accurate hit.

I can't say I have ever timed how long a ball slides vs how long it rolls, just the cueball travel distance is what I look at and angle it takes to get there. I do note the power differences in tables and conditions though and adjust for that.
 
a cue ball will slide for roughly a diamond of distance... the lower you hit it the farther away that distance will start and end...

Ray Martin's stop shot line is the key to owning that...

a four diamond stop shot with an OB 2 diamonds away draws back 2 diamonds...

the stop shot line is the key to the lock..
 
I shot a carom. About 24" to the object balls, they were just past the side pocket, nine foot Diamond. A chance to steal a ball playing one pocket, the other player never considered an across the table carom. However the balls were close together and the shot was one I have made similar many times. One catch, I needed the cue ball to not be spinning when it hit the first ball and still not be spinning when it hit the second or the second ball's path might be off enough to fail. No doubt other ways to make the shot but my way works for me. My eyes happened to track well and I saw the final ball skid to about the table foot spot.

In the neighborhood of four and a half feet of skid, genuine stripes on balls not moving. I have far from a monster stroke now and would bet some of the guys with a big stroke could hit table length stun shots. Collisions take away a lot of stun force I believe, particularly any contact with a cushion.

I think the limitation would be how far somebody could hit a ball in a straight line.

Hu
 
evergruven said:
I'm just curious about this phenomenon (or lack of one?)..
I can picture a ball having back spin and forward spin, I guess watching a ball slide isn't as visually stimulating
but in my pool journey, shooting a cb in its dead middle/with stun is ironically the last place I've thought to hit it
I'm sure it depends on cloth and stuff but how long can a cb slide for? distance-wise
anything else on the subject, I'm curious to learn about, physics, your experience, etc.
Click to expand...
Just go shoot a bunch at different speeds/angles. you'll learn far more than asking a question here.
 
ShootingArts said:
I shot a carom. About 24" to the object balls, they were just past the side pocket, nine foot Diamond. A chance to steal a ball playing one pocket, the other player never considered an across the table carom. However the balls were close together and the shot was one I have made similar many times. One catch, I needed the cue ball to not be spinning when it hit the first ball and still not be spinning when it hit the second or the second ball's path might be off enough to fail. No doubt other ways to make the shot but my way works for me. My eyes happened to track well and I saw the final ball skid to about the table foot spot.

In the neighborhood of four and a half feet of skid, genuine stripes on balls not moving. I have far from a monster stroke now and would bet some of the guys with a big stroke could hit table length stun shots. Collisions take away a lot of stun force I believe, particularly any contact with a cushion.

I think the limitation would be how far somebody could hit a ball in a straight line.

Hu
Click to expand...
There's also the jump effect where the cue ball never picks up any roll. You'd see this more on "vintage" cloth where they were smacking everything anyway. I prefer drag shots; far less precision required.
 
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