Cuemakers vs. Nitpick Customers

SUPERSTAR

SUPERSTAR

I am Keyser Söze
Silver Member
I have been wondering about whether to start this thread for quite some time.
I am interested in peoples opinions.

Is there ever a time when a cuemaker has the right to say, enough is enough, and bail on a person who is seemingly never going to be satisfied with the cue he gets, and say, "this is my product, if you don't like it, i can't do anything else for you" or should they offer a full refund , even if they put twice as many man hours into the cue?

I for one, believe that when buying a custom cue, that you want to get your moneys worth and want to be satisfied with what you are paying for.
Having said that, cuemakers have their standards, and not everyone is going to be satisfied with their order. Like for instance, if a custom cuemaker doesn't use weight bolts but instead uses naturally weighted cues, and someone orders a 20oz. cue but at the same time wants it to have a thin butt of a certain diameter, and when it is done, all the dimensional specs are right, but it weighs out at 19.75oz. Is that something that the cuemaker is at fault for, or is it too much to ask considering that the best they can do without weight bolts is weigh the materials before hand, and hope it falls within a certain range.

So, i wonder what people think of what is expected of a cuemaker.
AND
When does a customers nitpicking become to much.

Should a cuemaker cater the the nitpicks needs, or should they adopt the attitude that "this is my product, this is what i make, and not everyone can play with it, i am sorry"
Is it within the customers rights, to have the cuemaker build him a whole new cue when not satisfied, or is that a little over the top.

I have seen instances like this about 4 times over the past few years, and always thought that in those particular instances, the customer was just too damn picky for their own good.

I mean, it's nice to order a cue and have it show up and blend perfectly with your game, but when it doesn't, what are appropriate customer actions in peoples eyes.

The "i want this fixed, and i need that taken off, and i want this taken down, and i want this put on, and i don't like the way that is, etc etc." with the cue constantly getting sent back a bunch of times for tweaking is just ridiculous to me.
Once, maybe, twice, MAAAAYBE, but anything other then that, kind of makes me wonder.

When is the customer asking for too much, and when are they not?

I have never had this problem, but i have seen other people go through this process, and while i sympathize with them, there were times where i thought that they were asking for too much.

Obviously it's not black and white.
 
SUPERSTAR said:
I have been wondering about whether to start this thread for quite some time.
I am interested in peoples opinions.

Is there ever a time when a cuemaker has the right to say, enough is enough, and bail on a person who is seemingly never going to be satisfied with the cue he gets, and say, "this is my product, if you don't like it, i can't do anything else for you" or should they offer a full refund , even if they put twice as many man hours into the cue?

I for one, believe that when buying a custom cue, that you want to get your moneys worth and want to be satisfied with what you are paying for.
Having said that, cuemakers have their standards, and not everyone is going to be satisfied with their order. Like for instance, if a custom cuemaker doesn't use weight bolts but instead uses naturally weighted cues, and someone orders a 20oz. cue but at the same time wants it to have a thin butt of a certain diameter, and when it is done, all the dimensional specs are right, but it weighs out at 19.75oz. Is that something that the cuemaker is at fault for, or is it too much to ask considering that the best they can do without weight bolts is weigh the materials before hand, and hope it falls within a certain range.

So, i wonder what people think of what is expected of a cuemaker.
AND
When does a customers nitpicking become to much.

Should a cuemaker cater the the nitpicks needs, or should they adopt the attitude that "this is my product, this is what i make, and not everyone can play with it, i am sorry"
Is it within the customers rights, to have the cuemaker build him a whole new cue when not satisfied, or is that a little over the top.

I have seen instances like this about 4 times over the past few years, and always thought that in those particular instances, the customer was just too damn picky for their own good.

I mean, it's nice to order a cue and have it show up and blend perfectly with your game, but when it doesn't, what are appropriate customer actions in peoples eyes.

The "i want this fixed, and i need that taken off, and i want this taken down, and i want this put on, and i don't like the way that is, etc etc." with the cue constantly getting sent back a bunch of times for tweaking is just ridiculous to me.
Once, maybe, twice, MAAAAYBE, but anything other then that, kind of makes me wonder.

When is the customer asking for too much, and when are they not?

I have never had this problem, but i have seen other people go through this process, and while i sympathize with them, there were times where i thought that they were asking for too much.

Obviously it's not black and white.
Click to expand...

I have said it before, and I'll say it again....the customer must assume responsibility to not only do their research, but to ask all the 'right' questions. Some cue makers will only work with certain joint-types, some have a very specific taper, some do not do inlay work, etc...

It is equally important that the cue maker communicate clearly to the customer what they will or will not do, and to also double check to make sure that the customers specs are clear, and what their expectations may be.

Now, cue makers are human too, and depending on several factors, may or may not get the specs right on the mark...this also needs to be disclosed to the customer. With that said, the customer needs to understand that wood can be a tricky thing to command, and not always cooperative.

If the maker gets it way off, then I feel that a customer has a reasonable expectation to have what they initially requested and both maker and customer agreed upon. However, there are some customers who will never be happy, it seems, and the nit-picking will ensue....however, I think the warning signs are often already apparent prior to ordering of a cue that a particular customer may be a bit of a 'problem child'.

When a maker has gone above and beyond to attempt to please a nit-picky customer, at some point they have to throw in the towel and walk away knowing they did their absolute best they could do. There is no pleasing some people.

Lisa
 
SUPERSTAR said:
I have been wondering about whether to start this thread for quite some time.
I am interested in peoples opinions.

Is there ever a time when a cuemaker has the right to say, enough is enough, and bail on a person who is seemingly never going to be satisfied with the cue he gets, and say, "this is my product, if you don't like it, i can't do anything else for you" or should they offer a full refund , even if they put twice as many man hours into the cue?

I for one, believe that when buying a custom cue, that you want to get your moneys worth and want to be satisfied with what you are paying for.
Having said that, cuemakers have their standards, and not everyone is going to be satisfied with their order. Like for instance, if a custom cuemaker doesn't use weight bolts but instead uses naturally weighted cues, and someone orders a 20oz. cue but at the same time wants it to have a thin butt of a certain diameter, and when it is done, all the dimensional specs are right, but it weighs out at 19.75oz. Is that something that the cuemaker is at fault for, or is it too much to ask considering that the best they can do without weight bolts is weigh the materials before hand, and hope it falls within a certain range.

So, i wonder what people think of what is expected of a cuemaker.
AND
When does a customers nitpicking become to much.

Should a cuemaker cater the the nitpicks needs, or should they adopt the attitude that "this is my product, this is what i make, and not everyone can play with it, i am sorry"
Is it within the customers rights, to have the cuemaker build him a whole new cue when not satisfied, or is that a little over the top.

I have seen instances like this about 4 times over the past few years, and always thought that in those particular instances, the customer was just too damn picky for their own good.

I mean, it's nice to order a cue and have it show up and blend perfectly with your game, but when it doesn't, what are appropriate customer actions in peoples eyes.

The "i want this fixed, and i need that taken off, and i want this taken down, and i want this put on, and i don't like the way that is, etc etc." with the cue constantly getting sent back a bunch of times for tweaking is just ridiculous to me.
Once, maybe, twice, MAAAAYBE, but anything other then that, kind of makes me wonder.

When is the customer asking for too much, and when are they not?

I have never had this problem, but i have seen other people go through this process, and while i sympathize with them, there were times where i thought that they were asking for too much.

Obviously it's not black and white.
Click to expand...

I install custom kitchens for a living, and have had some very undecided cutomers. Most of them stop wanting to change everything when I start talking about how much extra it's going to cost. I will change some reasonable things for free, but I can only go so far.

I think custom cues should be handled the same way.

Things like being .25oz. off on weight should be discussed before hand, if the cuemaker can't make it exact. I personally won't worry about it.

A cuemaker should do everything possible to make his customer happy, but that may mean charging for extras.

jmo

Rodney
 
Rodney said:
I install custom kitchens for a living, and have had some very undecided cutomers. Most of them stop wanting to change everything when I start talking about how much extra it's going to cost. I will change some reasonable things for free, but I can only go so far.

I think custom cues should be handled the same way.

Things like being .25oz. off on weight should be discussed before hand, if the cuemaker can't make it exact. I personally won't worry about it.

A cuemaker should do everything possible to make his customer happy, but that may mean charging for extras.

jmo

Rodney
Click to expand...

With some makers, being off .25oz would not be noticeable at all...with others, it might be quite noticeable. I believe this is where the true art of cue making lies. I have played with some cues that felt butt heavy to me, until I got down into my stance...then they felt great!

This is why I feel it is important that once someone settles on a maker, they should try to play with cues from that maker, to see if it is their cup o' tea.

Not all cues are created equal. ;)

Lisa
 
all the dimensional specs are right, but it weighs out at 19.75oz. Is that something that the cuemaker is at fault for, or is it too much to ask considering that the best they can do without weight bolts is weigh the materials before hand, and hope it falls within a certain range.
Click to expand...
Easy fix.
Have a long drill and drop some powdered tungsten down there.
Replug the hole with a maple dowel.
Done.
Won't affect the balance and will not rattle and the player won't even know it's there.
 
I respectfully turn down customers when they get overly specific. Just the other day, one asks for a custom shaft to be made and it had to be exactly .XXX", 2 inches from the ferrule and then .YYY" 10 inches back. Shaft had to weigh exactly 3.Zoz......etc

I am all for making what you want but as a customer, understand it is wood. It moves, swells, crawls, bites, so there is no "exact." I will get it as close as humanly possible but in the end "wood will do what wood will do."
 
JoeyInCali said:
Easy fix.
Have a long drill and drop some powdered tungsten down there.
Replug the hole with a maple dowel.
Done.
Won't affect the balance and will not rattle and the player won't even know it's there.
Click to expand...

But what if this goes against their "cuemaking integrity" and they don't do that.

What would you expect from the cuemaker?

What if that hole that is plugged up for whatever reason, changes the way the cue plays? Would a complaint be in order if it's what you WANTED them to do?
 
SUPERSTAR said:
But what if this goes against their "cuemaking integrity" and they don't do that.

What would you expect from the cuemaker?

What if that hole that is plugged up for whatever reason, changes the way the cue plays? Would a complaint be in order if it's what you WANTED them to do?
Click to expand...
If he won't do it then he won't.
Then you'd have to take it somewhere who'd do it.
Done right, it doesn't even exist ( that weight add-on ).
 
The buyer has to understand YOU build cues the way YOU build cues, if he wants a cue that plays like x-makers cue he should go to x-maker. I believe all the well respected makers build their Cues the way they do for a reason & alot of research has gone into building a cue to play & look like it does because they believe their way is the best. Who are you[the buyer] to tell a Builder how to build a cue other than looks & then only to a point as some designs could affect the playability.
 
SUPERSTAR said:
But what if this goes against their "cuemaking integrity" and they don't do that.

What would you expect from the cuemaker?

What if that hole that is plugged up for whatever reason, changes the way the cue plays? Would a complaint be in order if it's what you WANTED them to do?
Click to expand...

I believe the only one that has a right to complain in this situation is the cuemaker, as the cue is no longer representative of their cues, thereby possibly changing or giving false representation of their work.
 
ridewiththewind said:
I have said it before, and I'll say it again....the customer must assume responsibility to not only do their research, but to ask all the 'right' questions. Some cue makers will only work with certain joint-types, some have a very specific taper, some do not do inlay work, etc...

It is equally important that the cue maker communicate clearly to the customer what they will or will not do, and to also double check to make sure that the customers specs are clear, and what their expectations may be.

Now, cue makers are human too, and depending on several factors, may or may not get the specs right on the mark...this also needs to be disclosed to the customer. With that said, the customer needs to understand that wood can be a tricky thing to command, and not always cooperative.

If the maker gets it way off, then I feel that a customer has a reasonable expectation to have what they initially requested and both maker and customer agreed upon. However, there are some customers who will never be happy, it seems, and the nit-picking will ensue....however, I think the warning signs are often already apparent prior to ordering of a cue that a particular customer may be a bit of a 'problem child'.

When a maker has gone above and beyond to attempt to please a nit-picky customer, at some point they have to throw in the towel and walk away knowing they did their absolute best they could do. There is no pleasing some people.

Lisa
Click to expand...

I agree with you Lisa.

When a customer contacts me about a custom cue I do my best to communicate well with the customer.

We try to come to an agreement as to what I can do and what the customer needs. Sometimes I have a "gut" feeling that I cannot satisfy the customer. In that case I thank the customer for having an interest in my cues and decline to do the work.

I have had customers insist that I make a shaft too thin. In that case I would rather lose the sale than have a shaft warp because my name is on the cue for all to see.

Every cuemaker should work as hard as he can to do right by the customer and I think most of us do that.

Lisa is correct - You can't please everybody so only promise to do the things you can do properly.

Good Cuemaking,
 
Good or bad, don't lie to me. I love nit-pickers. They intend to keep the cue & play with it, depend on it in battle. They want it just right, and rightly so. What gets me are the liars & time pressers who have intentions of profiting from me by flipping their cue. So they either want it cheap or they want it fast or both. And they always have a sob story to make their pitch. And they always get pissed when I don't make it happen for them. So yeah, nit-pick away with me & do it openly. Be honest & square so I can do my best to fit your needs. If somebody is going to actually keep my cue & use it regularly, i'll bend over backwards to tweak it perfectly for them. If they are gonna give me BS & lies so they can flip, then piss on them. I have learned to know who's who by the tell tale tactics. I don't even mind honest flippers who tell me their plans. What I can't stand is the lies.
 
qbilder said:
Good or bad, don't lie to me. I love nit-pickers. They intend to keep the cue & play with it, depend on it in battle. They want it just right, and rightly so. What gets me are the liars & time pressers who have intentions of profiting from me by flipping their cue. So they either want it cheap or they want it fast or both. And they always have a sob story to make their pitch. And they always get pissed when I don't make it happen for them. So yeah, nit-pick away with me & do it openly. Be honest & square so I can do my best to fit your needs. If somebody is going to actually keep my cue & use it regularly, i'll bend over backwards to tweak it perfectly for them. If they are gonna give me BS & lies so they can flip, then piss on them. I have learned to know who's who by the tell tale tactics. I don't even mind honest flippers who tell me their plans. What I can't stand is the lies.
Click to expand...

Sorry. I couldn't resist.
 

Attachments

Last edited:
Oh, you again? Have we been through this stuff enough, and no settlement??? Why keep wasting your time? You have let your taco bleed long enough, huh? What's your phone number? I'll call & you can give me a piece of your mind, on my dime. Or you can call me, no matter. Otherwise, STFU. If you got a bone to pick with me, do it. You can talk to me or even if you wish, meet me in person. Come meet the source head on & get it done, or else move along your way.
 
qbilder said:
Oh, you again? Have we been through this stuff enough, and no settlement??? Why keep wasting your time? You have let your taco bleed long enough, huh? What's your phone number? I'll call & you can give me a piece of your mind, on my dime. Or you can call me, no matter. Otherwise, STFU. If you got a bone to pick with me, do it. You can talk to me or even if you wish, meet me in person. Come meet the source head on & get it done, or else move along your way.
Click to expand...

No thanks E. I've had enough of your lies to last me a lifetime. I just thought it funny that a guy who lied to a customer for 2-3 years and even admitted giving him the run-around was so strongly opposed to liars.

-B. <-------- done with this
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top