Custom vs. production cues

I actually own a falcon cue... use it as my "bar cue"... I picked it up about 18 months ago and I have nothing but good things to say... its got a real good feel to it...I havent seen one that has come out of China yet so I dont know if there is any difference there...

Back to the point of the thread.....
My question is this ..... what is the difference if I have a machine that makes 15 cues at the same time or if I have a machine that makes 1 at a time? ... its a machine either way ..right?

I was actually surprised by that vid... i didnt think that mass produced cues had that much "hands on" time... i figured there was some type of machine that put the inlays in ...
 
Sheesh!

Would you rather lose to a 10 yr old kid with a $4000 McDaniel ( Landon Shuffet) or some Filipino nobody with a $14.95 Budweiser cue. :p

I think some of these comments are really bizarre to be honest. Its the same as being embarrassed you lost to a woman ( Jeanette? ) or a guy in a wheelchair. C'mon people. Who here is on a pedestal? Its a game that 99.99% of us cannot play well enough to make a living on...let just have some fun shall we?

I like nice cues..doesnt mean I play well. I DON'T . I never get embarrassed by losing to someone with a cheaper cue. That is just extreme insecurity in my opinion. I only get embarrassed by my own play..:rolleyes: ....losing by my own hand or winning with slop shots. I am a jewelry mechanic and do custom work a lot. Maybe I am attracted to the design and workmanship in the cues...I dont play well enough to be obsessed with a specific "hit".
My brother plays with a Balabushka AND he plays with a broom stick (in bar bets) . So what does that mean to all the philosophers out there?:confused: I have played with the Balabushka and think that it is nice...but I'd rather have a nice rifle to be honest. I have no interest in it besides the fact it was my fathers cue. I just think cues are a personal preference that you should not let other players decide what you "deserve". Your income level, taste, and preferences determine that. After all...many of us have a more expensive cue than Earl "the Pearl ($159.00 Cue Tec) Strickland. I don't think many of us are beating him. :rolleyes:
 
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smokeandapancak said:
I actually own a falcon cue... use it as my "bar cue"... I picked it up about 18 months ago and I have nothing but good things to say... its got a real good feel to it...I havent seen one that has come out of China yet so I dont know if there is any difference there...

Back to the point of the thread.....
My question is this ..... what is the difference if I have a machine that makes 15 cues at the same time or if I have a machine that makes 1 at a time? ... its a machine either way ..right?

I was actually surprised by that vid... i didnt think that mass produced cues had that much "hands on" time... i figured there was some type of machine that put the inlays in ...
Click to expand...

And here is how McDermott makes their cues. Found on their site.

http://www.mcdermottcue.com/McDermottFactoryTour.mpg
 
cueandcushion said:
Would you rather lose to a 10 yr old kid with a $4000 McDaniel ( Landon Shuffet) or some Filipino nobody with a $14.95 Budweiser cue. :p

I think some of these comments are really bizarre to be honest. Its the same as being embarrassed you lost to a woman ( Jeanette? ) or a guy in a wheelchair. C'mon people. Who here is on a pedestal? Its a game that 99.99% of us cannot play well enough to make a living on...let just have some fun shall we?

I like nice cues..doesnt mean I play well. I DON'T . I never get embarrassed by losing to someone with a cheaper cue. That is just extreme insecurity in my opinion. I only get embarrassed by my own play..:rolleyes: ....losing by my own hand or winning with slop shots. I am a jewelry mechanic and do custom work a lot. Maybe I am attracted to the design and workmanship in the cues...I dont play well enough to be obsessed with a specific "hit".
My brother plays with a Balabushka AND he plays with a broom stick (in bar bets) . So what does that mean to all the philosophers out there?:confused: I have played with the Balabushka and think that it is nice...but I'd rather have a nice rifle to be honest. I have no interest in it besides the fact it was my fathers cue. I just think cues are a personal preference that you should not let other players decide what you "deserve". Your income level, taste, and preferences determine that. After all...many of us have a more expensive cue than Earl "the Pearl ($159.00 Cue Tec) Strickland. I don't think many of us are beating him. :rolleyes:
Click to expand...

I've got a nice Browning pump 12 ga. with two barrels if you are interested.
 
smokeandapancak said:
Back to the point of the thread.....
My question is this ..... what is the difference if I have a machine that makes 15 cues at the same time or if I have a machine that makes 1 at a time? ... its a machine either way ..right?

I was actually surprised by that vid... i didnt think that mass produced cues had that much "hands on" time... i figured there was some type of machine that put the inlays in ...
Click to expand...


That is exactly my point. There is a lot of hand work that goes into any cue. It is common knowledge that the inlays in a cue do not make it play better, or technically a better cue ( though it makes it more expensive). So if two cues are made sisde by side and then the first is inlaid by hand, and the second is inlaid by a CNC, would the first cue be "better"? So inlays don't make a cue better, but how the inlays are put in does? I am mostly referring to high end cuemakers who happen to use CNC. These guys are incredible, and just because they want to provide their customer with the most options and the best product they can , some people will fault them for it and say " that isn't real cuemaking".
Like someone else has said on here, there is no machine that you walk up to and press a button, and it spits out a cue at the other end. My real point is that cuemaking is an art that should be respected as such. And thinking that using certain machines make it " not that hard" is ridiculous and insulting. I have personally been to Joe Gold ( cognescenti) and Dennis Searings shops ( who both use CNC) and I would be proud to own a cue by eithr one. They are masters, among many others. Untill you can tell me that you have built a cue from start to finish ( even using a CNC that makes it sooooo easy) can you tell me theres nothing to it.

Just my two cents
 
ChrisOnline said:
i do understand how it works.. i should have been alittle more clear about saying that when i said about the cues not being worth as much.. i should have said right then i was talking about production cues.. honestly, imagine if schon went back to making every cue with hand spliced or recut and milled points.. it would probably set back production by alot.. but i feel it would raise their value up.. and they would sell alot more.. (price would go way up)




chris
Click to expand...


Hey chris, you are somewhat correct. Let me just say I love shon cues and have owned several. They are considered "production" cues, but are one of the best ones available. You are correct, that if they set back their production, the prices would go up. The overhead of the shop would still have to be paid, and the cost would be divided by a smaller number of cues. That is the precise reason why mass production lowers the cost of the product. If I can double my production, I can afford to lower my pricec and stay in business. This does not necessarily due to any issue of quality. It is implied that the fewer cues a cuemaker makes, the more time is spent on any given cue and thus results in better overall quality. This is not always the case. I could spend a year making my first cue and it would not be better that one made by a top cuemaker in half that time. But, if a cue brand has a very good reputaion ( and therefore a high demand) And limited production, it makes for a higher value in the price. That is why a custom cue that sold new for $1200 will be worth the same or possibly more than that in five years. While a production cue that sold for $1200 new is worth around $600 a year after you buy it. They could both be of similar quality, the only difference is the amount produced. If I am a potential buyer of a used cue, and I want a certain prodution model, I may be able to find 10 people selling the same one or very similar. Now competition ( of the sellers) will dictate what I will pay. If, however, I am looking for a cue from a maker who only produces 60 cues a year, I will encounter less of these to pick from. and be in competion with other buyers for the ones I do find. I will pay more if I want to own this cue.
So production numbers will be a MAJOR factor in the value of a cue.
I love Jacoby cues. I own three of them including a fancy one of a kind. My fancy cue is ebony, has 10 points, and many inlays, 2 shafts , etc. It gets a lot of attention as being a very nice looking cue (it would be a level5). It also plays exceptionally well. If this cue was made by a top cuemaker with limited production it would be worth twice as much. Jacoby has a production catalog, and makes custom one of a kinds. The very fact that Jacoby has a high annual production, reduces the value of my cue. This has nothing to do with quality. This is why I think that Jacoby cues are an incredible value. I got a great quality custom cue for a good price. This is kinda the same for Schon, they make a great cue, but thy do not resell for nearly as much, just because there are more of them.
 
If anything, using CNC signs the cuemaker up to a far greater level of complexity than purely hand methods. Sure, the machine cuts the parts, after an artist (sometimes the cuemaker himself) creates the pattern that the customer wants, (in some cases, utterly impossible without CNC), and a highly skilled programmer (usually the cuemaker himself) codes it up for production. Thereafter, the cuemaker is obligated to perfectly install, BY HAND, possibly hundreds of tiny pieces -- possibly more numerous or intricate than any hand inlayer would ever attempt. See those magnifiers on his head? They ain't for decoration.

CNC setup and maintenance is no trivial affair. It takes tremendous skill and experience to avoid the "garbage in garbage" out phenomenon. Then, after the machine finishes cutting the parts and the dust settles, the REALLY hard work begins. Getting all inlays set properly (without breaking them and causing re-work), then finishing, constructing a fine shaft, etc. is real craftsmanship. Anyone who believes otherwise is simply ignorant of the functional realities of the cue shop.

If you had a machine cut two identical sets of parts, and sent them to two different cuemakers for final assembly and finishing, you could see a huge difference the finished product. It is the human touch of the maker, masterfully using the tools of his day that makes the difference.
 
alstl said:
I've got a nice Browning pump 12 ga. with two barrels if you are interested.
Click to expand...
LOL..thanks AL...

I actually just sold a Browning over/under as part of parting with 8 guns. I dont hunt like I used to and sold most of the guns except for a couple gifts my father and grandfather gave me. I am more into high tech rifles for target practice now. If you have a nice ported Glock longslide I would be interested? 9mm or .40 cal
 
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