Cut-throat question

[bsmutz]

I was playing cutthroat with the grandkids the other day and had a rules question. I was playing with the grown-ups a while back and looked at the rules to get them fresh in my mind. I had remembered that the official BCA rules require that first contact must be with an opponent's ball. However, when racking, the 1 ball goes on the apex with the 6 and 11 in the rear corners. It also states that shooter one has the 1-5 group (or 1-3). The question is if you are the first shooter and you hit the one ball first on the break and pocket one of your balls (only one down), is this loss of turn? It does state that all balls pocketed on the break stay down but doesn't specifically cover hitting the 1-ball on the break and making one of the breaker's group being a legal shot allowing them to continue at the table. What say ye? I've always played it as good but want an official opinion if one is available.

 

[8-Ball Player]

I was playing cutthroat with the grandkids the other day and had a rules question. I was playing with the grown-ups a while back and looked at the rules to get them fresh in my mind. I had remembered that the official BCA rules require that first contact must be with an opponent's ball. However, when racking, the 1 ball goes on the apex with the 6 and 11 in the rear corners. It also states that shooter one has the 1-5 group (or 1-3). The question is if you are the first shooter and you hit the one ball first on the break and pocket one of your balls (only one down), is this loss of turn? It does state that all balls pocketed on the break stay down but doesn't specifically cover hitting the 1-ball on the break and making one of the breaker's group being a legal shot allowing them to continue at the table. What say ye? I've always played it as good but want an official opinion if one is available.

I think if you get anything of the break your still good. If I'm not mistaken you may hit your own ball in to keep it on your turn, but thats how my pool instructor showed me.

Look it up on google..

 

[Ky Boy]

I am not 100% positive BUT I would think if you break and make any ball including yours that you would be allowed to keep shooting with any balls made staying down. I also generally play that I can shoot my balls to play shape on others.

Again, I am not sure about the rules but this is how I have always played.

 

[Drew]

Shoot til you miss! That's how I was taught, and that's how I've always played. Last ball standing wins. If only one of your balls is on the table and you shoot it in, you must run out the rest of the rack to win.

 

[bsmutz]

Well, thanks for the input so far, but like I said, the rules specifically state that you must hit an opponent's ball first. We've always played that you could shoot at your own ball, so I was surprised when I read this in the rules.

RULES OF PLAY

1. Players must decide prior to the game whether they are playing call shot or not.

2. A legal shot requires that the cue ball’s first contact be with an opponents’ object ball. On all shots, player must cause the cue ball to contact an object ball and then either

(a) pocket a numbered ball, or

(b) cause any numbered ball or the cue ball to contact a cushion. Failure to meet these requirements is a foul. Any legally pocketed ball entitles shooter to continue at the table until failing to pocket an object ball on a shot. (Also see exception: Rule of Play 4.)

The rules do say that any legally pocketed ball allows the player to continue at the table, so that means if you combo one of your balls, it's still your turn. I guess to be perfectly within the rules, I'd have to use the 2nd or 3rd ball break (or 4th ball, just in case someone racks all of the low numbered balls up front).

 

[rgeary]

Opposite Cut Throat

We play opposite. Make your own balls. There are less of them, but mixed among more balls that you cannot touch. Also, we don't play that you can make an opponents ball and keep going.

 

[Neil]

.............

 

[matcase]

I've always played that if you make any ball you keep your inning going. After all, a player has as much a right to cut their own throat as an opponents. As the name of the game implies, you should be able to sacrifice a little tissue to save the main body.

 

[Maniac]

We play opposite. Make your own balls. There are less of them, but mixed among more balls that you cannot touch.

This also helps two players from "ganging up" on the other.

Also, the way I've always played Cutthroat (varying from the rules) is that you do not designate a group of balls prior to breaking. The table is open. If the breaker makes a ball on the break, he must then pocket a ball to choose what group of balls he wants. When it is the next shooters turn, he must pocket a ball before he can decide which of the two remaining groups of balls he can be. This method makes a shooter "earn" what group he will shoot at.

Maniac

 

[dabarbr]

This also helps two players from "ganging up" on the other.

Also, the way I've always played Cutthroat (varying from the rules) is that you do not designate a group of balls prior to breaking. The table is open. If the breaker makes a ball on the break, he must then pocket a ball to choose what group of balls he wants. When it is the next shooters turn, he must pocket a ball before he can decide which of the two remaining groups of balls he can be. This method makes a shooter "earn" what group he will shoot at.

Maniac

Actually after the break the ball you pocket is a group that you will not be.

Example= if you pocket the six ball you will not be the middle group, meaning you will be either the 1 thru 5 group or the 11 thru 15 group. If you then pocket the twelve ball then you are the 1 thru 5 group.

The incoming player now has a choice of which group he will not be. If he pockets the nine ball then he becomes the 11 thru 15 group. The 3rd player automatically becomes the 6 thru 10 group. Are you confused now?

 

[mailman]

Make Yer Own Rules -- Who Cares?

We play opposite. Make your own balls. There are less of them, but mixed among more balls that you cannot touch.

This also helps two players from "ganging up" on the other. ...

Although Cutthroat CAN be played seriously , it is NOT a serious game. You've got the basic idea of how the game is played, so play around a few times until you can all settle on what you think is a fair set of rules.

This is what we did one night for fun (I have only done this once). Two of us are fairly strong players and one of us was somwewhat weak. We wanted to do something that would at least keep the weaker player in the game (keep us from ganging up on him), so this is what we decided on:


1. First out/first loser is 11-15 and last in rotation in the next game and the winner/last standing is 1-5 and first in rotation (also gets the break)the next rack.

2. Any ball, 1-5, racked in front; any ball, 6-10, on one of the back corners; and, any ball, 11-15, on the other back corner.

3. Breaker may hit any ball on the break and, if he makes ANY ball on the break, he continues to shoot unless, of course, he scratches on the break. In this case, 2nd in rotation has ball in hand in the kitchen.

4. Afterwards and during the course of normal play, in the case of all cueballs SCRATCHED or jumped off the table, the incoming shooter has BIH in the kitchen.

5. Legal shots were defined as in the BCA rules: after contact, ANY ball must go to a rail or into a pocket. Failure results in a foul. This is NOT BIH! See Rule 7.

6. Balls other than the cueball jumped off the table are pocketed and not respotted. This is considered a foul. This is NOT BIH. See Rule 7.

7. On ALL fouls, the incoming shooter can decide whether to play the cueball AS IT LIES, or to have the previous shooter shoot again from where the cueball lies.

8. While shooting, object ball groups MUST BE ALTERNATED. That is to say, a player with the 1st group, if he pockets a 2nd group ball first, must next shoot at a 3rd group ball, then again at a 2nd group ball, then a w3rd, and so on. This is, naturally reversed if he shoots first at a 3rd group ball.

9. When taking his first shot, the incoming player may shoot at ANY group, regardless of his previous alternation.

10. A player may "sacrifice" any of his balls to gain position on an opponent's ball. He may also elect to "sacrifice" several of his own balls IN A ROW! However, if a player has ONLY ONE BALL LEFT, he may NOT "sacrifice" this ball. We did this because it gave the two stronger players too great an advantage on the weaker player to allow a sacrifice on the last ball.

11. When a player completes his "sacrifices," his next shot MUST be at a ball in the group that would fall in jis already established alternation, as described in Rule 8, above. This means that, if I last shot at, e.g., the 13, then did a couple of sacrifices, I would next have to shoot at the 6-10 group, in order to remain in the proper alternation.

12. If a player sacrifices on his INCOMING (first shot), alternation has not yet been established and Rule 9 applies.

Oh yeah, I forgot:

13. Call pocket on all shots, including "sacrifices" -- not pure slop.


That's about the gist of it. Would you believe it took us less than 3 minutes to come up with this c**p? Anyway, here's the outcome:

Played 20 games.

I had two 10-and-outs, also additionally sacrificing a couple of balls in between, and wound up winning 8 of the games.

The other stronger player also had two 10-and-outs, also sacrificing a couple balls in between, and he won 10 of the games.

The weaker player won the other two games.

So, we STILL pounded the heck out of the weaker player -- BUT, he WAS kept in every game until near the end and had MANY fairly easy opportunities to get out! The REAL upshot of the whole thing is that we had an ABSOLUTE BLAST "keeping each other honest" about where we were in the ALTERNATION aspect, especially after multiple "sacrifices" (at our ages, this was easy to forget )!

As I said, I only did this ONCE! I'm NOT suggesting anyone else do this, although we DID have a ton of fun. I'm just using this as an example of how a simple game like Cutthroat can be quickly modified for fun and enjoyment -- who cares about the "REAL" rules?