Deuel's Rail Jump

[Solartje]

Here's another: put the eight ball on the spot. Place the cue ball for a straight-in shot to a corner pocket. Freeze a ball on each side of the eight. Now move the eight towards the cue ball so that if you hit it perfectly it would go through the one-ball gap straight into the corner pocket. Elevate slightly and shoot hard, and the eight will leave the table slightly and clear the gap. You have to be a little careful as the cue ball will also leave the table and may not land where you want.

I believe making an object ball jump over another object ball is legal at snooker.

If you're interested in such shots at pool, you may want to get some books on trick shots. Massey, Byrne, Varner, Caras, Herrmann. There are also books of special shots that aren't necessarily trick shots, such as the new book by Byrne and the classic by Martin.

mmm interesting idea's Bob. These are exactly the kind of shot i need to start learning at a certain stage. Im mastering slowly small things like cheating the pockets, jumpshots, etc but the example u gave is a perfect example of something i would never learn in snooker. Thx for the names on 'trick'shots. Ill try to find some video's or books and see what i can learn.

i must say, since i stopped snooker and started pool, im having to learn so many new things. thx for the greath advice.

 

[Bob Jewett]

I may have heard wrong, but I was always told that in snooker if the cue ball leaves the bed of the table in any way, that it was a foul.

Nope. In fact the cue ball is permitted in snooker to jump over object balls. The rules are on-line at http://www.ibsf.org/rules There are special conditions attached to the cue ball jumping over object balls. Not all jump shots are permitted. There seems to be no rule at all fobidding object balls to jump over each other.

 

[whoaaaa]

That is a sick shot. It would be nice to see those shots during matches, but like someone already said, pros play percentages.

 

[Guru]

Nope. In fact the cue ball is permitted in snooker to jump over object balls. The rules are on-line at http://www.ibsf.org/rules There are special conditions attached to the cue ball jumping over object balls. Not all jump shots are permitted. There seems to be no rule at all fobidding object balls to jump over each other.

What did I miss?

from ibsf.org:

Definitions
19. Jump Shot
A jump shot is made when the cue-ball passes over any part of an object ball, whether touching it in the process or not, except:
(a) when the cue-ball first strikes one object ball and then jumps over another ball,
(b) when the cue-ball jumps and strikes an object ball, but does not land on the far side of that ball,
(c) when, after striking an object ball lawfully, the cue-ball jumps over that ball after hitting a cushion or another ball.

then under Penalties
12. Penalties
All fouls will incur a penalty of four points unless a higher one is indicated in paragraph (a) to (d) below. Penalties are:
(a) value of the ball on by
(i) striking the cue-ball more than once,
(ii) striking when both feet are off the floor,
(iii) playing out of turn,
(iv) playing improperly from In-hand, including at the opening stroke,
(v) causing the cue-ball to miss all object balls,
(vi) causing the cue-ball to enter a pocket,
(vii) playing a snooker behind a free ball,
(viii) playing a jump shot,
(ix) playing with a non-standard cue, or
(x) conferring with a partner contrary to Section 3 Rule 17(e).

 

[Bob Jewett]

What did I miss?
...

It's a foul to play a "jump shot", but if you have already struck the ball on, it is allowed by the exceptions for the cue ball to jump over other balls. The rules do not consider such jump shots to be jump shots. It is not permitted for the cue ball to jump over a ball to get to the ball you have to hit. It is permitted, evidently, for the cue ball to jump over the cushion to get to a ball on, in case you're corner hooked.

Actually, a careful reading of 19(b) shows that the wording is broken. If you jump over a ball and hit a ball on and stay on this side of the ball you hit, 19(b) seems to say the shot is legal. I know it's not played that way.

 

[jay helfert]

A great shot made during a match

One of the greatest shots I ever saw attempted and made during a match was by "Morro" Paez against Mike Sigel in the Southern California Open in 1988. As many of you know, Morro excels at shooting masse shots.
At a critical point in the match he was left with the cue ball next to the object ball, which was about three inches out from the side pocket. He could not shoot the object ball down the rail into the corner as there was an obstructing ball. The cue ball and object ball were approx. 2" apart.
Morro jacked straight up in the air and sent the cue ball about six to eight inches forward, where it reversed and came back and made the object ball in the side. Needless to say everyone present was floored by this shot. Sigel looked a little shell shocked too. The fact that he would even attempt such a shot in a match amazed me, and he made it!
The crowd went crazy and Sigel never recovered. Morro won the match.
I hope my description does justice to a great shot. I don't have the toold to put a picture on here.
I invite you to ask either Morro or Sigel about this shot. I'm sure they both remember it well, for different reasons. I'll never forget it.

 

[Boro Nut]

Actually, a careful reading of 19(b) shows that the wording is broken. If you jump over a ball and hit a ball on and stay on this side of the ball you hit, 19(b) seems to say the shot is legal. I know it's not played that way.

That's right Bob. It makes sense not to penalise a player for inadvertent hops and kicks, especially with the more prone modern balls. You've probably already missed the pot anyway if it happens. As long as the ball does not land on the far side of the object ball it's not a foul. But using the cushion to hop over a ball that would otherwise be hit would be a foul. Basically it's a foul to pass any part of any ball by leaving the bed of the table unless you've first struck a ball on.

Boro Nut

 

[Bob Jewett]

That's right Bob. It makes sense not to penalise a player for inadvertent hops and kicks, especially with the more prone modern balls. You've probably already missed the pot anyway if it happens. As long as the ball does not land on the far side of the object ball it's not a foul. But using the cushion to hop over a ball that would otherwise be hit would be a foul. Basically it's a foul to pass any part of any ball by leaving the bed of the table unless you've first struck a ball on.

Boro Nut

But my point of the post was that 19b permits many jump shots, such as: cue ball jumps over the edge of blue to strike a red (which is on). The cue ball lands on this side of the red. 19b makes the shot legal, so long as the cue ball lands on the near side of the ball struck. Or at least that's the way I read 19b.

 

[Boro Nut]

But my point of the post was that 19b permits many jump shots, such as: cue ball jumps over the edge of blue to strike a red (which is on). The cue ball lands on this side of the red. 19b makes the shot legal, so long as the cue ball lands on the near side of the ball struck. Or at least that's the way I read 19b.

No that's a foul - the first sentence qualifies it. The cue ball can't pass over ANY part of ANY ball unless....

In theory you could be trying an extreme skinny cut on a red and miss because you jump the edge, but then hit another red, and it would be a foul. In practice it would be impossible to call if you weren't sure you didn't just plain miss, or had indeed pass over the extreme edge of the ball. I wouldn't call it.

Boro Nut

 

[Bob Jewett]

No that's a foul - the first sentence qualifies it. The cue ball can't pass over ANY part of ANY ball unless....
...

You and I disagree on the reading of the rule (Section 2,Rule 19). When one of a, b or c occurs, the main clause does not apply. That's what "except" means to me. Thus, when (b) occurs, namely "when the cue-ball jumps and strikes an object ball, but does not land on the far side of that ball," then the shot is not a jump shot.

I know what the writers of the rule intended, but that's not what they put on paper.

 

[iacas]

You and I disagree on the reading of the rule (Section 2,Rule 19). When one of a, b or c occurs, the main clause does not apply. That's what "except" means to me. Thus, when (b) occurs, namely "when the cue-ball jumps and strikes an object ball, but does not land on the far side of that ball," then the shot is not a jump shot.

Gee, good thing Corey wasn't playing snooker. Guys, this isn't on topic, and since you seem to be discussing it amongst yourselves, might I suggest either PMing each other or starting a new thread?

 

[Guru]

Gee, good thing Corey wasn't playing snooker. Guys, this isn't on topic, and since you seem to be discussing it amongst yourselves, might I suggest either PMing each other or starting a new thread?

Gee, welcome to the internet. Discussions don't always follow lock-step what you'd like. Your thread would have died 3 days ago otherwise. Enjoy or get some Tums.