How many Pro's would pay that much for a cue, thats the real question? Cue collectors are like ART collectors, they. NEVER intend on playing with those cues!!!
Diamond arrived update
- Thread starter Nyquil
- Start date
So, I will be honest and acknowledge I can't say that I would exactly know for a custom cue having never owned one or plan to own one. I am 100% content with my McDermott and Mezz cues, cues that I am sure I will one day give to my future kid or nephew. I do however own a $4000ish custom koi pond sculptor resin coffee end table set and an $8000 Amish dining table chair set that may one day become my family heirloom. There are a few imperfections or blemishes here and there and I am absolutely OK with that. There are probably countless more I haven't noticed. Yet those 2 areas probably make the happiest of all my material goods and definitely receive the greatest appreciation from guests.
I guess for me, I tend to view these things as adding character to the product, like this is truly unique and not a mass produced copy where someone else can buy the exact same thing. Like someone invested a good amount of personal time working on this thing. Sure there might be some areas where it's imperfect, but there are also areas that are just absolutely amazing. People aren't machines and inherently have more visible inconsistencies. I understand this when I buy custom work that I know people invested a bit of their soul in. Maybe that's different for high end cues? Price range of custom pieces seemed appropriate for a comparison at least.
Panel lottery?
You have spent too much time on the AVS forum
I am guilty of the same thing, btw. If panel lottery is a big deal for some, I always tell them to spend a bit more and buy from Value Electronics, and get the calibration. They will reject any bad panels, and calibrate out most of the other panel issues.
Panel lottery?
You have spent too much time on the AVS forum
I am guilty of the same thing, btw. If panel lottery is a big deal for some, I always tell them to spend a bit more and buy from Value Electronics, and get the calibration. They will reject any bad panels, and calibrate out most of the other panel issues.
I definitely do, but it is still true though. That is why I buy from Best Buy, they always let me return or exchange. At the same time, a $10K TV is likely a very large flagship OLED or Samsung and if panel is dang near perfect, you bet I’m going to ignore a blemish on the bezel than going through the hassle of returning it and getting a new one!
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For a 10K TV, I'd have them install a new bezel. But hey, I'd probably shoot myself before spending 10K on a tele.
My next purchase, when the home remodel gets finished (besides a 9'Pro/AM) will be a 77" A80J Sony OLED. Just can not justify the premium on the A90J for a bit brighter specular highlights on a few scenes.
I know the feeling. I am still using my 77” LG C9 for my living room/home theater.
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Trust me everyone knows about the problem. It’s been repeated again and again. Unfortunately there are so many diamonds out there that people believe that is a way a table should play. This is incorrect. For a hundred years tables played a certain way. Relatively close in speed and banking. Then diamond comes into the picture and completely changes the way pool has been played for a century. Look at when viewership died off and when diamond entered the picture. Pretty obvious that the table play lends itself to a boring less aggressive play style. Put all these in your homes as much as you like. In time you will find out you bought an inferior product from a players standpoint. Plain and simple.
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You're really trying to link Diamond tables, 'boring less aggressive play' and reduced viewership???? Please.
Come on Glen, you danced right around my question. Not once in the whole thread was there a "pro" mentioned....at least not that I recall. And pros ,for the most part, dont pay anything for a cue. Sponsors do.
Listening to many here on AZ, they play with those $2000- $3000 customs. If you play with them, one can expect a ding here and there. But would you pay that much, and have it arrive with defects or damage as new?
I'm my hypothetical situation, would you or would you not be a little peeved about it?
Knowing what the sites look like in real life, not a chance, but showing up dirty, you bet!
I'm struggling with excepting this as a honest response, if I was to be honest myself. I find it hard to believe that someone who spent an exorbitant amount of money or whatever on an 'brand new' product would be more than happy to accept obvious QA flaws. That now said, I will of course accept you response as the truth, because I have never seen anything on the forum from you that would lead me to believe you'd be dishonest in the slightest.Personally yeah I'm ok with it.I used to worry a lot about stuff like that, to an almost obsessive amount, but I decided if it doesn't effect function I don't care.
I wish I could add that I think you're better man than I for being so nonchalant about such matters. Unfortunately I really do think those who set their own standards should adhere to them. The TV in my example should have been caught by QA, just like the blem on the table. To let that stuff slide, allows manufacturers to sell at a preminum but produce haphazard.
If I were to spin another example. Lets pretend you bought yourself a custom cue from whoever is the top dog these days. Waited a year to receive it. On the day you open up the package you find that the maker grossly oversized a pocket for 1 of 6 of the matching inlays and made up the difference with epoxy. Still content...? Obviously the horrible inlay work would not effect function of the cue, but anyone simply rolling cue from a distance will see the bad work.
I'm not meaning to test you here. Just get a sense of your stance on the general matter. I think maybe I'm simply not using an example that rings home for you.
If we review the original post, we can see that the OP simply inquired about other people's experiences with Diamond product. At no point, did Nyquil seem emotional to me at least. If companies are truly worried about their supposed 'good' image then they need to step up prior to releasing evidence to contrary. A good company should not rely on or presume that their cilents should handle PR for them. If you want to be considered the top of the heap, then you should and expect your customers to hold you to the highest standard.Do I fault anyone for posting on a forum? Not really, but I can see both sides. It's not up to the customer's expectations yet mass produced products can and will have issues at times. The difference between a good product and a bad one is how well the company or dealer will take care of you.
Once again, I think if you could filter out the inflammatory posts and subsequent responses spawned by RKC, this thread would be countless pages shorter, and nothing but reassurance in the believe that Diamond would look after their customer.
I thought Diamonds were made to order...? Hense the 50% to build, 50% before delivery. Made to order products don't generally get 'assembly line quality QA'. I know that the company I work for keeps binders of QA checks on every machine we build, and I spend a week trying to break it before it ships. Image is everything, and we know it.
No drama posting by anyone other than the self appointed head cheerleader imo.Should Diamond have touched it up? Probably. Was it inspected on a Friday by someone who just got hired and had 2 weeks training? Maybe. Was the inspector doing 3 other people's jobs that day, or dicking around on their phone? Maybe. It's a customer's right to demand perfection, but there's no such thing. Give the company or dealer a chance to do right, delay the drama posting until they become a bad company/dealer.
Thanks for the well thought out response.
lol... I guess I should have keep reading the posts after boogie's before directly citing this same example.
apologies for riding your coat tails.
Don't sweat it. Riding coat-tails is a long honored tradition here on AZ.
Custom cues tend to lean toward artwork more than functionality, but I understand you point.
I do want to add that you raised a great point in my mind. If the milling blem (assumption) was somewhere else. Lets say the skirt of the table. Then I personally wouldn't have any issue with accepting it. For me at least, having the blem at a visual reference and point of focus, (a sight) makes it less acceptable.
Did this thread get bumped into the aiming forum...? Whole bunch of other variables that have nothing to do with the point.
The point was a visual cosmetic flaw on a very expensive item, and accepting the personal use of a sharpie rather than holding the manufacturer responsible.
Cheerleader??..LOL just curious, have you talked with the OP? because I personally have, a few times. You know what else, 100's of people call me all the time, message me all the time, asking for advice about one thing or another, and guess what, they're not all Diamond owners, why do you think that is? Because I'm a cheerleader?I'm struggling with excepting this as a honest response, if I was to be honest myself. I find it hard to believe that someone who spent an exorbitant amount of money or whatever on an 'brand new' product would be more than happy to accept obvious QA flaws. That now said, I will of course accept you response as the truth, because I have never seen anything on the forum from you that would lead me to believe you'd be dishonest in the slightest.
I wish I could add that I think you're better man than I for being so nonchalant about such matters. Unfortunately I really do think those who set their own standards should adhere to them. The TV in my example should have been caught by QA, just like the blem on the table. To let that stuff slide, allows manufacturers to sell at a preminum but produce haphazard.
If I were to spin another example. Lets pretend you bought yourself a custom cue from whoever is the top dog these days. Waited a year to receive it. On the day you open up the package you find that the maker grossly oversized a pocket for 1 of 6 of the matching inlays and made up the difference with epoxy. Still content...? Obviously the horrible inlay work would not effect function of the cue, but anyone simply rolling cue from a distance will see the bad work.
I'm not meaning to test you here. Just get a sense of your stance on the general matter. I think maybe I'm simply not using an example that rings home for you.
If we review the original post, we can see that the OP simply inquired about other people's experiences with Diamond product. At no point, did Nyquil seem emotional to me at least. If companies are truly worried about their supposed 'good' image then they need to step up prior to releasing evidence to contrary. A good company should not rely on or presume that their cilents should handle PR for them. If you want to be considered the top of the heap, then you should and expect your customers to hold you to the highest standard.
Once again, I think if you could filter out the inflammatory posts and subsequent responses spawned by RKC, this thread would be countless pages shorter, and nothing but reassurance in the believe that Diamond would look after their customer.
I thought Diamonds were made to order...? Hense the 50% to build, 50% before delivery. Made to order products don't generally get 'assembly line quality QA'. I know that the company I work for keeps binders of QA checks on every machine we build, and I spend a week trying to break it before it ships. Image is everything, and we know it.
No drama posting by anyone other than the self appointed head cheerleader imo.
Thanks for the well thought out response.
Of course not, but don't put any faith in that opinion because I haven't worked with PRC or enjoyed the Diamond factory tour.
That just proves that somebody was thinking the same thing. It's a good example. Everyone has their limits on what they will accept. I have to admit, if it was on the skirt or somewhere else more out of line of sight, I think I could accept that.
Look at the sites on any Diamond table, anywhere, then tell me how much you notice in your line of sight. You've played on them before, but never noticed the sites, being so flawed, why haven't you noticed that before now?
You didn't post this to me, but I can give you my thoughts.
I think I've mentioned it earlier, but I've only played on 3 possibly 4 Diamond tables. All of them were that rosewood colour. All of them had heavily worn cloth, and those famous super bouncy rails. Those two items were my focus, and of course if they rolled straight. I didn't think to inspect the sights for fit/finish. Honestly, I don't consider inspecting any table for fit finish. That said, when I set up my own POS table, I used a $2k theodolite and a couple of days to get the slate to 1/32" across it's length. Honestly it was a waste of time, but I gained some experience so why not...lol
The point... There is a massive difference in expectation from just using a piece of equipment, and being the person who owns/purchased the piece of equipment.
If as comsumers we go into the purchase of a high end (if not highest end) pool table knowing we should be prepared for the possibility of lack luster fit/finish, then we have nothing to complain about when we get less than perfection. Diamond's incredible reputation for extreme quality has set them up for failure based on harsh judgement. Whether this is a fair set of circumstances, I can't say.