Do we miss because we jump up, or do we jump up because we miss??

A

AimWithYourMind

Banned
There are certain involuntary actions that our body does, where we have very little control.

If there is incentive, sometimes we can control these automatic reactions. However, when we are distracted, these automatic responses become nearly impossible to supress.

1. If I rapidly wave my hand in front of your face, you will likely blink your eyes.

2. If I tell you that I will pay you $100 if you do not blink your eyes, you will likely be able to supress your automatic reaction and win the $100.

3. If I tell you that I will pay you $100 if you do not blink, but you are being distracted by your young child, you will likely not be able to supress your automatic reaction.

The key here is that the mind has great trouble in doing two difficult things at once.

So in pool, perhaps it is a natural reaction to jump up when our body senses that we have failed. We do not jump up when we are consciously telling ourselves "don't jump up." But when we are distracted by the game, concentrating on position, or pocketing the ball, we lose our ability to control our automatic reaction.

The only way around this is to retrain our bodies to not jump up. You could tell a beginner to not jump up, but it will not work. For the reasons already stated, he will not be capable of controlling his automatic reactions, because he will be concentrating on other things when he is shooting.

So next time you jump up, perhaps you should not be so upset with yourself. Perhaps you just need more repititions until your body is retrained to not jump up.

I hope I have made some sense. I am raising this question not because I think I am right. I am raising this question because I do not believe in conventional wisdom. We have been told for many years that we missed because we jumped up. But we DO NOT research the technicalities. I believe that there is just as good a chance that we jump up because we miss. I do not know the full truth because it is complicated.
 
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AimWithYourMind said:
There are certain involuntary actions that our body does, where we have very little control.

If there is incentive, sometimes we can control these automatic reactions. However, when we are distracted, these automatic responses become nearly impossible to supress.

1. If I rapidly wave my hand in front of your face, you will likely blink your eyes.

2. If I tell you that I will pay you $100 if you do not blink your eyes, you will likely be able to supress your automatic reaction and win the $100.

3. If I tell you that I will pay you $100 if you do not blink, but you are being distracted by your young child, you will likely not be able to supress your automatic reaction.

The key here is that the mind has great trouble in doing two difficult things at once.

So in pool, perhaps it is a natural reaction to jump up when our body senses that we have failed. We do not jump up when we are consciously telling ourselves "don't jump up." But when we are distracted by the game, concentrating on position, or pocketing the ball, we lose our ability to control our automatic reaction.

The only way around this is to retrain our bodies to not jump up. You could tell a beginner to not jump up, but it will not work. For the reasons already stated, he will not be capable of controlling his automatic reactions, because he will be concentrating on other things when he is shooting.

So next time you jump up, perhaps you should not be so upset with yourself. Perhaps you just need more repititions until your body is retrained to not jump up.

I hope I have made some sense.
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I use the following method :rolleyes::

P ossibly getting someone to hold something above you,
O r hang something heavy above the pool table,
C hances are, you would remember to keep from jumping up,
K nowing that you may bump your head,
E ven after playing the shot,
T hat will teach you to keep your head down.
P lus, it will keep you in the habit of staying down,
O ften, the benefits are immediate, but remember,
I f you do decide to use this method,
N ever forget that the bricks are above your head,
T hat would be painful to bump your head on one of them

Anyone else ever heard of this method ??
 
I think it's usually the former, i.e. you miss as a result of jumping up. That said, I've seen some world class players jump up because they missed a shot...I'll try and find it, but I recently saw a video of Efren jumping up and it was clear he knew he was off as he pulled the trigger, and he jumped as a result, even trying to steer the shot in with body motion...

I used to jump up something terrible, spent years getting that worked out. There's a natural tendency to jump up, because of the various muscle groups you're using to execute a shot; there are some back and neck muscles that want into the action, so if you start off with a jump up in your stroke, it's very hard to stop it. Notice how easy it is to jump up on a break shot? No one needs to be taught that, it's a natural tendency. It's unnatural to stay perfectly motionless, holding your follow through and staying down until the shot drops. If you're rising up in the middle of a stroke, it's hard to imagine that's not causing you problems in striking the cue ball with the precision required...

I think most people miss from jumping up than jump up because they missed...
 
This is why I hate it when people tell me I am missing shots because I jump up. I am jumping up because I see the shot not going in before I even shoot it (and yet I still pull the trigger:/-I need to get out of that habit).
 
Just like a good stroke is muscle memory, so is follow through as well as staying down on a shot. If you worked those fundamentals enough at the beginning, you probably are much better at staying down.

That being said, there is a split second difference, and I would never criticize Efren's fundamentals. So if he jumped up, I tend to believe it did not alter his shot, he just is good enough to know that he missed the shot as, or right after, he shot.
 
I think of staying down like I think of following through with your stroke. It doesn't add anything directly to the shot - it's just a discipline that keeps your shooting routine "pure" and prevents "quirks" from creeping into it. Whatever justification/excuse you have for jumping up, even occasionally, it's probably a bad idea because it breaks your successful routine.

pj
chgo
 
Mickey Qualls said:
I use the following method :rolleyes::

P ossibly getting someone to hold something above you,
O r hang something heavy above the pool table,
C hances are, you would remember to keep from jumping up,
K nowing that you may bump your head,
E ven after playing the shot,
T hat will teach you to keep your head down.
P lus, it will keep you in the habit of staying down,
O ften, the benefits are immediate, but remember,
I f you do decide to use this method,
N ever forget that the bricks are above your head,
T hat would be painful to bump your head on one of them

Anyone else ever heard of this method ??
Click to expand...
This is an excellent method.
If you combine it with the 'sc5' method of handling your finances...

..the odd win you take will be 100% profit...
 
Jumping up is one of the worst habits to aquire. If you are moving your eyes/head during the delivery of the stroke, your chances of pocketing the ball are slim, no matter how easy the shot. How are you going to be accurate with your eyes moving? When I see players that jump up, I see a lot easy shots that are missed. Watch the more advanced players and you very seldom see them jump up at any time, before, or after the shot.
 
In a similar vein; I played a guy last night that every time he took a 1 second+ pause in his backswing he would miss, and every time he did not, he made the ball. It was like his mind was not ready to commit to the shot or could see that the shot was not worth committing towards.
 
This is like that saying I heard somewhere saying most senior citizens' fall are a result of broken hip rather than broken hip being a result of a fall. :cool:
 
MitchAlsup said:
In a similar vein; I played a guy last night that every time he took a 1 second+ pause in his backswing he would miss, and every time he did not, he made the ball. It was like his mind was not ready to commit to the shot or could see that the shot was not worth committing towards.
Click to expand...

The pause in the backswing is not for everybody...that transition from pulling back to stroking forward is individualistic...a very deliberate pause works for some, a almost seemless back to forward works for others. He was probably trying to institute a pause that he hasn't been using for many years and it's screwing with his stroke. Tell him he needs to pause more and double down the bet! :thumbup:
 
I think we jump up because we miss. Why would you randomly jump up for no reason? :P
 
I do both

I can honestly remember nights where I was jumping up because I knew I was not aimed correctly, causing a miss, and I've had nights where I move my head/jumped up causing me to miss. For me, either scenario is possible if I'm out of stroke/alignment, but the issues have different causes. I like the recommendations by Scott and Randy (and Jerry Brieseth). They say to have a consistent routine from start (aligning shot away from the table) to finish (waiting in finished stroke form for the ball to stop rolling). The action of "jumping up" is lead by the head. If you need to, concentrate on keep your head still (which has many benefits) all of the way through the shot.

People don't think that you can jump up as a result of knowing your going to miss, but I know people that swing their arm into position on their last warmup stroke or the backswing, where before they subconcienciously adjusted they wouldn't have made the correct contact, and they hit it perfectly. It is amazing how your body can try to compensate for the smallest alignment issues after subconsciously recognizing that alignment is off.

EDIT: I believe that jumping up during and after contact with the cue ball is lead by the head (your head rises so your torso rises, whereas jumping up during the final stroke through contact is caused by the upper torso/shoulders movement trying to move the cue with the whole body
 
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Keep it simple. Its not about jumping up or staying down, its about keeping your head still. Just don't move your head.
 
Mickey Qualls said:
I use the following method :rolleyes::

P ossibly getting someone to hold something above you,
O r hang something heavy above the pool table,
C hances are, you would remember to keep from jumping up,
K nowing that you may bump your head,
E ven after playing the shot,
T hat will teach you to keep your head down.
P lus, it will keep you in the habit of staying down,
O ften, the benefits are immediate, but remember,
I f you do decide to use this method,
N ever forget that the bricks are above your head,
T hat would be painful to bump your head on one of them

Anyone else ever heard of this method ??
Click to expand...

LOL. Great inside joke... some will think this is the Pocket Point Method. The legend lives on!
 
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