European Open 2025, Sarajevo, March 11-16

Baby Huey said:
With SVB playing ten ball race to 120 over say 3/4 days, you'd expect him to put a 6 pac or more together at least 3 times. I believe he did so against Gorst in their match. ...
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Nope. From my stats thread on the SVB/Gorst match (https://forums.azbilliards.com/thre...gorst-10-ball-race-to-120-august-2024.567611/):

Break-and-run packages:​
Van Boening's 44 B&R games consisted of one 5-pack (on Day 2), one 4-pack (on Day 3), three 3-packs, six 2-packs, and 14 singles.​
Gorst's 44 B&R games consisted of five 3-packs, five 2-packs, and 19 singles.​
 
The_JV said:
I'll try this again....

Can you big brain the following please. My uneducated guess is that if we run the scenario below a handful of times. The Alt break results will favour the weaker player. In comparison to winner break format. ....
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Sorry, no. Both the theory of probability and the calculation of specific cases says you're wrong. Winner vs. alternate has been discussed before and someone (@iusedtoberich ?) calculated out a specific simple case and found the odds to be equal. I wrote a program to calculate the odds of races up to about 13 and the odds were equal for all cases tested, and a fair range was tested.

In this case, intuition is usually wrong, and my intuition was wrong just like yours. It took both understanding the theory and seeing the examples to convince me.
 
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But back to Sarajevo....

Karl Boyes is doing a vlog, and in this edition you can see the evening buffet at the Hills Hotel which is the host for both the Open and the PLP.

Go to 11 minutes in.

 
Bob Jewett said:
But back to Sarajevo....

Karl Boyes is doing a vlog, and in this edition you can see the evening buffet at the Hills Hotel which is the host for both the Open and the PLP.

Go to 11 minutes in.

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comms has been great in PLP from what little i've watched. scott, karl and JJ in various pair rotations.

what the fargh is tyler doing to his tip in that video?
 
Bob Jewett said:
In this case, intuition is usually wrong, and my intuition was wrong just like yours. It took both understanding the theory and seeing the examples to convince me.
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Well without the numbers being ran. I'm afraid simply telling me I wrong won't suffice. Guess I'll be stuck reposting this scenario indefinitely and preaching from the other side of the fence.

Truth is, I've never seen the comparison spelled put in the manner I have. Which I believe is the most accurate depiction of a match up.
 
the numbers also i suspect reflect the general population of the tournament players. and there for sure, winner or alternate should not matter.

however if taken of specific individuals then it and should make a difference. simply because the best tuned in breakers will break more often and win more games because of it.
this is assuming the break is an advantage to those that have mastered it.
 
maha said:
[...]

[...] simply because the best tuned in breakers will break more often and win more games because of it.
this is assuming the break is an advantage to those that have mastered it.
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The issue is not this part. All agree a better breaker will win more of the games if he is allowed to break more of them.

The issue--the thing people get wrong--is thinking this means the better player will win more race-to-whatever SETS because of it. With winner breaks, the better player wins more games but not more sets.
 
I’m not surprised that winner or alternate breaks doesn’t greatly affect the outcome.
But I don’t want to give up the potential of running out the set when you’re a way behind.
 
pt109 said:
I’m not surprised that winner or alternate breaks doesn’t greatly affect the outcome.
But I don’t want to give up the potential of running out the set when you’re a way behind.
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I agree that the psychologies of the two formats are different. I think most viewers also prefer winner breaks.
 
Bob Jewett said:
I agree that the psychologies of the two formats are different. I think most viewers also prefer winner breaks.
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This is why my utopian version of the pro game has multiple short 'winner break' sets. The opening break of each set alternates. I'm sure I'll be told that it won't change the likely outcome of the match, but at least we'll see both players get an opportunity to showcase their talents.
 
The_JV said:
This is why my utopian version of the pro game has multiple short 'winner break' sets. The opening break of each set alternates. I'm sure I'll be told that it won't change the likely outcome of the match, but at least we'll see both players get an opportunity to showcase their talents.
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I’m not looking for utopian solutions…..at the top end of the game it should be elitist….if you miss, you lose.
…….and every great player elevates the game, like Tiger did at golf.
 
pt109 said:
I’m not looking for utopian solutions…..at the top end of the game it should be elitist….if you miss, you lose.
…….and every great player elevates the game, like Tiger did at golf.
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Now take a deep breath and tell us why pool isn't a globally popular game and how we should fix it.
 
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