Gene, next time you are in St. Louis, I would be interested in meeting.
Thanks, Jay
Thanks, Jay
Eye Dominance
- Thread starter GaryB
- Start date
A quote from CJ;
This move "clears the hips" so you can look at the line of the shot squarely.
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The "trick" is in how the head comes down on the ball. It's done by making the LOWER BODY go back to make the head to down. For a visual example, it's like putting your fist out in front of you pointing up.....then move the fist down by moving your elbow up.
This move "clears the hips" so you can look at the line of the shot squarely and still get the right hip out of the way as you go down to the ball. If you don't do it this way you will have trouble getting the hip to "clear".
...then you will have to start with the cue to the right of your vision center, and this makes it difficult to go straight down on the true "line of the shot".
This may be difficult to follow, although it's the one technique that makes a HUGE difference in how you play the game.....it makes it SO much easier. I would say I would put it on video, but the "natives" would get upset thinking I might be trying to make $10. 'The Game is the Teacher'
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A real gem that's actually more than clearing the hips. It will add a lot to your game if you figure it out.
Best,
Mike
This move "clears the hips" so you can look at the line of the shot squarely.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The "trick" is in how the head comes down on the ball. It's done by making the LOWER BODY go back to make the head to down. For a visual example, it's like putting your fist out in front of you pointing up.....then move the fist down by moving your elbow up.
This move "clears the hips" so you can look at the line of the shot squarely and still get the right hip out of the way as you go down to the ball. If you don't do it this way you will have trouble getting the hip to "clear".
...then you will have to start with the cue to the right of your vision center, and this makes it difficult to go straight down on the true "line of the shot".
This may be difficult to follow, although it's the one technique that makes a HUGE difference in how you play the game.....it makes it SO much easier. I would say I would put it on video, but the "natives" would get upset thinking I might be trying to make $10. 'The Game is the Teacher'
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A real gem that's actually more than clearing the hips. It will add a lot to your game if you figure it out.
Best,
Mike
First let me say the Geno is in the know. Anytime one can take a lesson from him do it.
Stan Shuffet confirmed a post I made a while back on how as I was watching other players it seemed like they are using a form of CTE in their preshot. But I know these players and I know they don't know CTE. Stan confirmed to me that they are indeed probably using CTE. In Stan's last video he finally talks about dominant eye and some of the things Geno has been teaching for a long time now.
In Joe's explanation of his alignment I would guess he is using CTE on at least some shots as his description in his first post is almost right from the book.
Joe's recommendation of centering the cue directly under the nose for everyone, I don't feel is correct. All you have to do is watch the pro's on the streams and you will see everyone has different cue positions. IMHO those that have the cue favoring one side of the nose and their dominant eye are the better players. And their cues will maintain that position in almost all shots.
I suggest you look at Earl, Shane, Ralph Souquet and Neil Feigen Sp? eye alignments for you own opinions.
Mikjary has it correct and is in the know. The preshot eye alignment needs to be done on even the simplest of shots. It is easy for one to align a shot with their dominant eye in the preshot and then end up in going in the down position aligning with the non dominant eye. Geno and I have discussed this years ago as I used to do this. Geno knew the fix.
Stan Shuffet confirmed a post I made a while back on how as I was watching other players it seemed like they are using a form of CTE in their preshot. But I know these players and I know they don't know CTE. Stan confirmed to me that they are indeed probably using CTE. In Stan's last video he finally talks about dominant eye and some of the things Geno has been teaching for a long time now.
In Joe's explanation of his alignment I would guess he is using CTE on at least some shots as his description in his first post is almost right from the book.
Joe's recommendation of centering the cue directly under the nose for everyone, I don't feel is correct. All you have to do is watch the pro's on the streams and you will see everyone has different cue positions. IMHO those that have the cue favoring one side of the nose and their dominant eye are the better players. And their cues will maintain that position in almost all shots.
I suggest you look at Earl, Shane, Ralph Souquet and Neil Feigen Sp? eye alignments for you own opinions.
Mikjary has it correct and is in the know. The preshot eye alignment needs to be done on even the simplest of shots. It is easy for one to align a shot with their dominant eye in the preshot and then end up in going in the down position aligning with the non dominant eye. Geno and I have discussed this years ago as I used to do this. Geno knew the fix.
I am the research............
Hi there Mike,
There is nobody else to do it. First you need to be a pool players and understand the different problems.
From the time we met at your house until now I have been doing research. That was about 3 to 4 years ago. I would travel from City to City having a whole new batch of students every week. This is the only way I could work with so many players and do this on the job research.
If you do the math. 100 players per week X 4 years. That's allot of research. Many of these were what I called mini lessons but I still had to find their dominant eyes to show them how well this works.
Everyone was the same. Some were right eye dominant and some were left but the fix was always the same and the problem was always the same. With the exception of players with ocular vision which only effects about 2% of the players. But I've even learned how to help them. How? By understanding and working with so many. The ocular vision players all have the same problem also just a little different twist to it.
And from doing lessons over and over and seeing the same results it's pretty easy to come to a conclusive conclusion.
At some point when the same thing is obvious for a thousand times with different players
you know this is the real deal and is the way it is.
Like the law of gravity. How many times do you have to drop the rock to know that gravity did it? Newton didn't invent gravity. Just identified what it was and why the results.
I never invented anything. I didn't create this problem. I just finally identified it. But better yet, I show players how to fix it.
I'm just showing players how the eyes really work and they need to listen to players like yourself that have learned and know the same thing.
It is just the way it is.
And yes Mike, Every player on the planet has the same problem as you.
Sometimes I have to show them they have the problem with the shots I set up and then I show them how to fix it.
I have never seen a player that didn't have this problem.
The better the player the less they would be able to tell they have it.
But then the better the player the more they realize how important it is to know how to fix the problem once they understand it.
Great job there Mr Mike on your description.
Thanks again...........
John,
I've done many tests like this one. Your results are that you're right eye dominant, but lining up your shots with your left eye as the dominant eye. When you start out with this as your first look at the shot, you're done. The brain is tenacious when it aims, no matter which eye sees the shot first. It will work with the info you've given to it and say the shot looks good, even though you aren't lined up correctly. Hello, steering the cue.
I keep my dominant right eye, dominant by starting my PSR well back of the table to get my first glance at the correct alignment. At a distance, the eyes are more binocular and don't fight for dominance. As I move into the shot and aim, I make sure my right eye is at least equally if not more forward and aiming the shot. The left is there helping, but not in charge.
Short cut shots can be the toughest of all. They are simple and you step into them not really worrying about aiming. I've ended many a run with the easiest shots because I didn't take the time to get my right eye in the correct place. :angry:
I shot for years not knowing this information and like many others, rode the roller coaster of consistency. I was able to run over a 100 balls when I was in the right eye positioning, but couldn't run a 30 the next night. I never knew who was going to show up, so I figured I didn't have the mental focus and quit for twenty years. Since I've started to play again, this new info has forced me to start all over and it can be ugly. :grin-square:
I'd like to see more research about eye dominance for the players that need it. Many don't have my problem and that's great! But, for the others that do, valid research rather than anecdotal evidence and hearsay are desperately needed.
Best,
Mike
Hi there Mike,
There is nobody else to do it. First you need to be a pool players and understand the different problems.
From the time we met at your house until now I have been doing research. That was about 3 to 4 years ago. I would travel from City to City having a whole new batch of students every week. This is the only way I could work with so many players and do this on the job research.
If you do the math. 100 players per week X 4 years. That's allot of research. Many of these were what I called mini lessons but I still had to find their dominant eyes to show them how well this works.
Everyone was the same. Some were right eye dominant and some were left but the fix was always the same and the problem was always the same. With the exception of players with ocular vision which only effects about 2% of the players. But I've even learned how to help them. How? By understanding and working with so many. The ocular vision players all have the same problem also just a little different twist to it.
And from doing lessons over and over and seeing the same results it's pretty easy to come to a conclusive conclusion.
At some point when the same thing is obvious for a thousand times with different players
you know this is the real deal and is the way it is.
Like the law of gravity. How many times do you have to drop the rock to know that gravity did it? Newton didn't invent gravity. Just identified what it was and why the results.
I never invented anything. I didn't create this problem. I just finally identified it. But better yet, I show players how to fix it.
I'm just showing players how the eyes really work and they need to listen to players like yourself that have learned and know the same thing.
It is just the way it is.
And yes Mike, Every player on the planet has the same problem as you.
Sometimes I have to show them they have the problem with the shots I set up and then I show them how to fix it.
I have never seen a player that didn't have this problem.
The better the player the less they would be able to tell they have it.
But then the better the player the more they realize how important it is to know how to fix the problem once they understand it.
Great job there Mr Mike on your description.
Thanks again...........
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My simple story....I'm strongly left eye dominant and right handed. Until I figured it out recently with an instructor I couldn't find the center of the cueball because it was close to me and i used BINOCULOR vision. Both eyes on the cue and aiming line and the object ball. I KNEW exactly where to aim but without center hits on the longer straighter shots they didn't go in. I've learned with practise to change my stance so that my left eye sights the shot down the cue to the object ball when I got down during the pre shot routine. My shot making improved dramatically using the new routine. (One still needs a straight stroke though).
I find the shot line standing up with both eyes as do most of us...no problem.
Here's another deal....I wear glasses and the right lens has far more correction than the left. With the left eye closed the image from the right eye is smaller but as clear the left one. The brain compensates for this in normal life but apperently not at the pool table. Eyeglass frames get in the way when down on the shot too. I got around that by having glasses made by "Decot". Big frogeye lenses!!! They're made mostly for skeet shooters.
Gene, if you read this please change your description from "oculor" vision. to "monoculor"....one eye.
Good luck everyone. Mitch
I find the shot line standing up with both eyes as do most of us...no problem.
Here's another deal....I wear glasses and the right lens has far more correction than the left. With the left eye closed the image from the right eye is smaller but as clear the left one. The brain compensates for this in normal life but apperently not at the pool table. Eyeglass frames get in the way when down on the shot too. I got around that by having glasses made by "Decot". Big frogeye lenses!!! They're made mostly for skeet shooters.
Gene, if you read this please change your description from "oculor" vision. to "monoculor"....one eye.
Good luck everyone. Mitch
I have been out of pool playing for quite some time. Just started back up regularly a month and a half ago. I have always had a decently consistent game but was having trouble "getting my game back".
I started reading about eye dominance and just for fun decided to do the hand test. I figured out I am left eye dominant. I am mostly right handed but am ambidextrous so I can use both hands at almost the same abilities, even writing and such. I shoot pool right handed.
After figuring out I am left eye dominant (which I already had a suspicion of due to other things), I conducted a few sight tests. I set an extra shaft on my dining table. I used it as the shot line and I got into my normal stance. Sure enough my cue was at a slight angle to the extra shaft, the tip going off to the right as the follow through progressed. My normal PSR is to sight the shot on the left side of the shot line (using my right eye mostly) and getting down into the stance.
I decided to sight the shot line from the right side using my left eye mostly to sight the line. I stepped into the shot from the right side and low and behold I was dead accurate on the shot line all the way to full follow through. I did this 10 times in a row.
I also put some tape about 4 inches apart and shot a cue ball through it from about a foot and a half. I noticed that with my normal stance (sighting the line with my right eye and stepping into the shot from the left of the shot line) the cue ball veered over towards the right because I was actually putting slight right spin on the ball. The reason is because my stroke is veering to the right ever so slightly.
I did the same shot but sighting it with my left eye and steeping into the shot stance from the right side of the line and the ball hit dead center of the tape every time.
Not seeing the truth makes perfect sense. Welcome to the club. Probably 99% of players have this problem to one degree or another and the other 1% overcame it.
Stroking to one side or another is definitely frustrating. Are you hitting off center on the cue ball or just plain old shooting crooked? I used to put right spin on the cue ball all the time until I changed my head positioning. Horrible stroke! I don't know how long I had it until I finally realized there was a problem. It just appeared and got worse.
Shooting to one side can also be a stance or stroke issue. If you feel like you're stroking straight, it could be your eye position. Need more info.
Best,
Mike