For those of you that remember the 80's...

[ridewiththewind]

Those comments are exactly why the women dont wipe the floor with the men.....they would rather play safe than go for a shot.....that gets you beat too you know.....

not to mention its boring to watch.....if its boring to watch then no ones watching

LoL...that should read why 'many' women don't wipe the floor with the men.

Okay, I don't claim to be a great player by any stretch...but I do okay, for a girl. Seriously tho'...when I was younger, I played with the 'boys'. There was no handicapping or the like. I played them even, and I did surprisingly well. Then I did the whole family thing for about 20yrs. I came back to the game, and it was different. All technical and sh*t. The more I tried to 're-learn' the game, the more frustrated I got, and got no where fast...figured I had lost my 'mojo' and age and all. Tried the whole safety thing, because I was told it would make me a better player.

About 2 yrs ago now, I decided, screw it...it wasn't being fun like I had remembered. So, I decided to go back to the way I used to play...which was try to pocket every frickin' ball possible, and strive for the table run. I never play in a handicapped league or tournament...as it is infinitely more satisfying to win the game straight-up against my male opponent....which most of them still are, unfortunately.

Guess what...I started playing better. I already knew the skill set was there...except my break...so I spent a lot of time with that, and now it's in a good place...which has now allowed me to be a real contender locally. Still don't play the safeties, and I hate a slow game. I am a so much happier and better player these days. The only problem now is that if I am out for a casual night of pool, I am having a hard time catching a game...that kinda sucks...LoL!

I agree...a lot of the 'joy' of the game has been sucked out compared to the ol' days.

Lisa

 

[hdgis1]

So your saying that by me letting the game be more equal in the gambling matches I'm aiding and abetting the "pussification of america"

I didn't see it that way and didn't mean it that way......

In a word - yes. That's what I am saying. How is your desire to create an equal playing field (whether in fact or perception) any different from the underlying premise of a league that claims to create an environment where anyone can win?

There's nothing wrong with getting a game even, but whats prevalent today is the opponent wants weight.....which is fine, but he wants 2 balls more than he deserves

And who determines what is deserved? You or the guy whose bank roll you are trying to dip into?

kids today are just soft period so what do you expect.....

I expect you are overgeneralizing. I think kids today have tougher skins than what they did 20-30 years ago. Imagine living in a world, as a child, where hyper-connectivity is the norm. Every flaw, every mistake and every shortcoming can be instantaneously communicated to thousands of friends and strangers. While it is true that suicide rates have increased over the years - take as true that something other than reduced taboos are at play - they are disproportionate to the rapid infiltration of technology based communication into our lives.

Rigs are full of some of the last cowboys you'll find that man up! Pool used to be full of these WARRIORS.......now its full of PANSIES

Yes - it is a damn shame our world has become so sensitive to the desires and dreams of other people. I shudder to think that my daughter should ever have the chance to succeed because she chose to use her brain instead of her muscles. Long live Sparta!

Chris

 

[greyghost]

I I think kids today have tougher skins than what they did 20-30 years ago.

Chris

Do you even live in america? They have thicker skins than 20/30 years ago?

thats the biggest crock of sh*t i've ever heard.


All our youngsters are coddled by the media, adults, educators etc........thicker skin my butt.

As for the muscles over brains thing......brother some of the smartest most ingenuitive men i know work out there. It it were just stupid rednecks with muscle out there you wouldn't be diving that car of yours.

Sensitivity only goes so far.....such as the comment i heard once about school uniforms.

they should be used b/c it will cut down on bullying?

Really? I doubt it first of all, second kids must go through these things to be a well rounded person/adult. Everyone knows the weirdo that was home schooled that never got friends, never got picked on was just brought up with no confrontation in their lives.......many are sad excuses and fearful of everything.....to scared to be normal. (this is of course a broad generalization, as there are many wonderful kids today)

And dam right long live sparta. The greeks had much respect for knowledge too ya know.....much more than you see in america today.

People love to not know......they keepin it REAL! REAL DUMB! (thanks chris rock for letting me steal that line)

 

[Foolio]

Greyghost what would be the generation you are talking about? I'm just curious, the kids of right now to a certain age or say kids that grew up in the ninties and are older now?

And to the original poster of this thread, i could not say, I wasn't even born yet till 89. The closest thing I've seen are videos.

 

[Klopek]

0000000000

 

[BelleBelle]

Greyghost, the tables play much tighter than the tables in the 80's. Every generation says the kids are soft today. I don't play APA but without the league's many poolrooms would be closed. Making the wing ball 82 times is a skilled shot, just like a tennis player with a 130 mph serve! If it was a trick shot everyone would do it. Like you i also like a offensive game! No jump cues. The game has changed and i believe it's because of the tighter tables. I don't know about other people on this forum but my game plan changes according to how tight the equipment is playing

 

[9ball]

I can see you're a cerebral man who doesn't let his emotions get in the way of thinking things through. I am not interested in the chest thumping and posturing, I am simply trying to point out that while you are quick to blame the state of the game on the "pussification of america" you willingly put yourself in a position in which you perpetuate said problem.

As I understand it, the point of giving and taking weight is to create an equal playing field in which both players think they have the opportunity to win/succeed. Correct me if I am wrong, but isn't this what you meant to imply was the very problem with, as you so eloquently put it, the "pussification of america"?

Chris

Originally Posted by greyghost
If your asking if I'm a pussy that I am not sir.

Got any more questions to ask me brother? Your more than welcome to try and call me out again.....sorry it didn't work out for you....

-Grey Ghost




You know you two my son reads these forums! Why don`t you clean up your post and speak like gentlemen?

H.P.

 

[Pushout]

'80s? Try the '70s when pushout 9 Ball was the gambling game along with One Pocket. Strategic, no-nonsense pool. It made people play better without the option of the so-called two-way-shot. The ball-in-hand-anywhere-any time ruined the game of 9 Ball. And it's still broke.

 

[greyghost]

Greyghost what would be the generation you are talking about? I'm just curious, the kids of right now to a certain age or say kids that grew up in the ninties and are older now?

And to the original poster of this thread, i could not say, I wasn't even born yet till 89. The closest thing I've seen are videos.

All of the above I'm talking about.....I know my generation was starting to get full of them with the advent of PC bull corn and the computer and stuff begining the phases of unsociability.

As the PC stuff has gotten worse and the general public desyntsized (spelling sorry) the younger kids are getting worse and worse.

Its not their/our fault.....its really the PC (PC meaning politically correct not computers if I was misunderstood)

Taking the pledge out of school. Can't whip your kids. They all got to wear the same things.......

All men were created equal.....but we strive to better ourselves, some do the work and get there but others don't and never budge.

They are made to believe that they are owed equality through out life.

Like with the matching up in pool....theres nothing wrong with getting the game "right" and I don't mean just so your barely robbing the fella, I mean getting the line RIGHT! BUT (big but) it only goes so far untill a person uses this to their advantage so they don't have to work as hard as the other person to get ahead.

Its kind of like a person that doesn't need welfare or food stamps but can somehow get it so they do.......thats BS and WEAK!

When I lost my job from the oil spill, I filed for unemployment......

it took a long time to get through and I already had a job when it did.....

I got 617 dollars and I gave it back..........

just aint me brother to take more than I need.....alot of times I ask for help and it comes too late and I end up taking care of ol' keeb' by my lonesome.....its tough sometimes but it makes me proud of ME....

If asked " Do you believe in GOD?"

I reply......' I believe in myself"

but yes i believe in GOD......but i also believe that there are too many people out there that are struggling way worse than little keebie for him to take the time out of his busy day when I can do it my dam self.

Just like why i teach others the intricacies of the game openly to a certain degree. Man I would love to be paid like I should for the knowledge that I've attained by way of myself/others/time/money/study/loss/wins etc.....but pool is struggling way worse than I am as a whole.

Now if your just talk and look at me blank when I give instruction or professional advice then I only give snippets b/c its disrespectful, OR that person can have my full attention and PAY me. Then I (like my grandfather) am a TEACHER and have a job to do. Ill do my best to get it through your thick skull b/c I now have a contractual job to do. What you do with it is up to you.....but I feel obligated to do my JOB.

Now every so often I run into those that are highly intrigued with the pasttime "we" all love (I use the term "we" very loosely b/c there are those that just suck it up and never give back...thats not love thats BITING THE HAND THAT FEEDS AND SUSTAINS US)

Those people: men/women/children that are all ears and OPEN STUDENTS EAGER TO LEARN AND BETTER THEMSELVES

These people deserve my undying attention regardless if they can pay whatever I charge or not. These rare people often get my playbook PRO BONO

I have a good example to share (scott I'm sorry if you are upset with me sharing this on tv....but I hope it shows you in the light and makes you smile) I was looking to further my knowledge in instruction so had Scott Lee pay me a visit. I paid I believe 300+ for around 4 hrs or so.....we hit it off so well I cooked dinner and we conversed and learned for 8 HOURS! I was soaking it up and scott saw that so it was both our pleasures to be there.

When I lived in Tulsa I had many, many people that I instructed. I was one of the better players in the area, tho I was no where near guys like Shane McMinn or Gabe. Many saw me work hard on my game, and many respected people up there saw this and took me under their wing. I listened....I learned....I grew as a player, AND AS A TEACHER

I grabbed everyones attention not only as a up and coming player but b/c I was a new age Johnny Appleseed of the game.....a mutual friend of myself and Gabe told me once "keeb' I'm sure one day you'll break out and win when your ready....your smart and you learn well, and you respect the game....but your a great addition because you PROMOTE the game....and you do it with passion!

I went out there and EARNED that. I lurked on this very site (azbilliards) for a very long time and was also on the old RSB (a long long time ago in a galaxy far far away lol), and actually had another user here back at the begining but never posted. When I moved to Oklahoma I didn't use a computer for a good minute and it wasn't untill I'd say 04/05 when I made my keebie2@yahoo.com email account (my full name is Keebie Anthony Fleniken II) so keebie2@yahoo is the NUTZZZZZZZ b/c I am Keebie version 2.0 lol

I made the email b/c its easy for people to remember.....that and its a pretty rare (lol...its egyptian...not the same is Kibbi the cerean (euro/mideastern country, spelling?) food lol

Anyways after changing the email back when I made new accounts in many places so they would be unique and THE SAME so I wouldn't have to use up all my memory in my brain trying to keep track of stupid users and password BS.

I had met Steve Booth just b/f moving at Gradys event in gulfport and we talked and told me about his new ONEPOCKET.ORG......I never played one hole before this tourney nor heard of it......Ray Martin was there and was shocked that I didn't know the game, so he gave me a little run down and quick instruction and bang I paid entry....played Joe Mcnamara first round came out and 3/2 loser.....lost by ONE BALL!

I was so INTRUGUED and IN LOVE LOVE LOVE with ONE POCKET (still am its my soulmate....helps keep the devil and darkside in me in check lol)

ANYWAYS (IM FReaKING RAMBLING)

I made both users here and onepocket.org the GREYGHOST......for two reasons.....my gramps (grandpa thats what we called him) liked the real Grey Ghost's jazz piano playing.....AND my best friend and running partner in T&F/XC liked the old tv show liked the Grey Ghost cartoon

Its a pretty famous and cool name so I snapped it up with a little letter tweak

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gray_Ghost


I love this site b/c there is always someone wanting and looking to learn, and even if I can't help someone at all times where I live, all I got to do is sign on to here and BANG there are many who care and want to learn, have respect etc......

I joke alot and make everyone laugh.....even get on that butt when I have too....I inform and instruct, I learn also....many many things have I learned RIGHT HERE.

But the time I spend here is important to me and I take it like a job.....I very much respect the RESPECT so many of our members direct my way....I feel often this is a job I was called to do and I'm expected to do it, I hope I've never let anyone down in that regard. I may be outspoken but its just b/c I'm passionate. Sometimes its tough to watch the things that go down, go down.

But all in all guys/gals the pleasure is all mine being here....its a wonderful place about a wonderful game and it brings me peace.

best wishes to everyone,
Keebie


The whole point was about Hard Work and RESPECT......thats the problem today of most our issues in my opinon

 

[greyghost]

Tap, tap, tap

Originally Posted by greyghost
If your asking if I'm a worm that I am not sir.

Got any more questions to ask me brother? Your more than welcome to try and call me out again.....sorry it didn't work out for you....

-Grey Ghost




You know you two my son reads these forums! Why don`t you clean up your post and speak like gentlemen?

H.P.

I agree and am very sorry for that, I have edited my comments accordingly.
Please never hesisitate to jump me at any time if I ever cross over that line, I owe you one for that.

thanks and very sorry,
-Grey Ghost-

 

[hdgis1]

As for the muscles over brains thing......brother some of the smartest most ingenuitive men i know work out there. It it were just stupid rednecks with muscle out there you wouldn't be diving that car of yours.

Nobody said anything about rednecks Keeb.

...such as the comment i heard once about school uniforms.

they should be used b/c it will cut down on bullying?

The idea of children wearing school uniforms is only marginally related to the reduction of bullying. Proponents of school uniforms point out that school uniforms are one tool by which students energy can be redirected towards more important things (like science and math). Instead of one kid belittling another because their parents can't afford the latest greatest, everyone is put on the proverbial level playing field.

Really? I doubt it first of all, second kids must go through these things to be a well rounded person/adult. Everyone knows the weirdo that was home schooled that never got friends, never got picked on was just brought up with no confrontation in their lives.......many are sad excuses and fearful of everything.....to scared to be normal. (this is of course a broad generalization, as there are many wonderful kids today)

Am i to understand that you feel that confrontation is not only an important part of growing up, but an integral part of the school curriculum? Exactly which type of confrontation are you talking about? Fisticuffs in the back 40 or a well defined academic challenge in which one child gets to prove their worth not by the strength of their arm but by their mental prowess? I am unconvinced you favor the latter...

 

[hdgis1]

I know my generation was starting to get full of them with the advent of PC bull corn and the computer and stuff begining the phases of unsociability.

As the PC stuff has gotten worse and the general public desyntsized (spelling sorry) the younger kids are getting worse and worse.

Its not their/our fault.....its really the PC (PC meaning politically correct not computers if I was misunderstood)

Yeah to hell with political correctness! Lets go back to calling black people ni***** and gay people f*****s! Do you put any thought into what you type? and What on earth does political correctness have to do with desensitization? I am beginning to think your idea of being a role model is way off base.

Chris

 

[9ball]

I agree and am very sorry for that, I have edited my comments accordingly.
Please never hesisitate to jump me at any time if I ever cross over that line, I owe you one for that.

thanks and very sorry,
-Grey Ghost-

Thank You! , I know in the heat of an argument we tend to chose the first words out of our mouths, Apology accepted! Manny, you may continue reading. :smile:

 

[paksat]

I`m an old guy who played the game the old way, quit playing for eleven years, and then was rudely introduced to the new way. In the old days if you shot an intentional safety you would probably have to fist fight, that was just not the gentlemanly way to play. We played shoot to make the ball back then. Push out with the ball in hand after two consecutive fouls was the next evolution and I liked it because you usually pushed out to a location where you felt like you had the shooting advantage. Todays game is boring because of all the safety play. I once enjoyed seeing great players go at it full bore offense. Todays player do not compare to the old champions in this regard. Thanks for the post poolteacher

Sounds like bar pool... firing at everything even when it doesn't make any sense.... is there any wonder that SVB destroyed earl in the TAR challenge match.. because i believe that was a perfect example.

 

[neal916]

so wait? we're mad at the younger generation for playing to win? im confused now.

 

[greyghost]

Nobody said anything about rednecks Keeb.
the way you mentioned about your daughter using her brain instead of muscles....i took it as a shot at my peers which many are rednecks lol....but very very smart men

The idea of children wearing school uniforms is only marginally related to the reduction of bullying. Proponents of school uniforms point out that school uniforms are one tool by which students energy can be redirected towards more important things (like science and math). Instead of one kid belittling another because their parents can't afford the latest greatest, everyone is put on the proverbial level playing field.

What about individuality? The schools are trying to put out cookie cutter citizens and it don't work like that. Kids will find something to make trouble.....its fight or flight in life, we are humans so we are not limited to fighting with only our hands and feet. How is someone going to learn to stand up to someone or for their beliefs if they have never been in that kind of situation....doesn't necessarily mean they punch each other.....maybe the kid outsmarts the bully and never even has to get in a fight? Maybe they do end up fighting and b/c best friends.....I've seen it happen more than once. You have to have grievances as you grow so you know how to communicate with others and associate with them.

I mean come on thats why they call it: "GROWING PAINS"



Am i to understand that you feel that confrontation is not only an important part of growing up, but an integral part of the school curriculum? Exactly which type of confrontation are you talking about? Fisticuffs in the back 40 or a well defined academic challenge in which one child gets to prove their worth not by the strength of their arm but by their mental prowess? I am unconvinced you favor the latter...

I FAVOR BOTH! EQUALLY!(your shocked I know lol but dont get ahead of me)

Confrontation is a part of growing up. As you so duly noted there are multiple types of confrontation.

You can have a verbal arguement or a debate if your being diplomatic about the conversation.

You can have a fight, where either both parties agree, or one in the party attacks the other and forces the other to either defend or defend&attack, or sit there and get punched.

SOMETIMES...SOMETIMES, a kid will actually tell a teacher.....this results in a talk with the other kid and some slap on the wrist. Then later the other kid teases him more for being a tattle tale and a chicken bla bla bla......he can take it or he might cry....sometimes the bully don't even bother to tease.....he just walks up and beats up the other kid b/c he got him in trouble.

I believe people should stand up for themselves in which ever way is best at the moment. Sometimes you got to fight back, sometimes its best to talk it over, sometimes its best to get the help of an adult or whomever.

It would be wonderful if we could only all just settle our differences by talking......but this is just not always the case in reality.

FIGHTING IS NOT WRONG, FIGHTING WITHOUT A GOOD REASON IS

 

[greyghost]

Yeah to hell with political correctness! Lets go back to calling black people ni***** and gay people f*****s! Do you put any thought into what you type? and What on earth does political correctness have to do with desensitization? I am beginning to think your idea of being a role model is way off base.

Chris

Political correctness takes away all the feeling in life. They are trying to make a pretend world that doesn't exist.

And the terms your talking about are not what I'm refering to.

I'm speaking of things like The Pledge being taken out of school. School uniforms. Not being able to whip your kids (and i don't mean beat! i mean a whipping) like if you spank your kids your a POS....COME ON! Getting my butt whooped when i done bad was one of the best things that ever happend to me in life.

They are dumbed down in school just so everyone "feels" good lol.

cellphones, email, reality tv, much of the internet......its all media the rottenest crap in the world for a young kid.

You can't tell a kid anything these days. The things I hear said, I couldn't have said as a child........and very sure that my father could have NEVER NEVER GOTTEN AWAY WITH WHAT THE KIDS DO TODAY from their parents.

And the teachers tell the parents what to do.....so does the tv.....and the govt is along for the ride working those cookie cutter kids with mush for brains and individuality about as unique as a door knob.

They play nintendo, and farmerville and they text......this is life


and we play pool? jesus they must think we are Fred Flintstone.....not that kids today know who the hell Fred Flintstone is since they are too busy watching SPONGE BOB SQUARE PANTS!

I'd never let my children watch that trash. G.I. Joe was much better b/c knowing is half the battle kidz!

-Grey Ghost-

 

[greyghost]

so wait? we're mad at the younger generation for playing to win? im confused now.

I'm not......at least I hope I wasn't misunderstood.


I hate the style of play cuz its BORING......oh yea young buk shoots great but he's a bore to watch.....NO FLAIR


IF YOU WANT PEOPLE TO WATCH THEN YOU GOT TO GIVE THEM A REASON TO!

There was another fella that believed in that you might have heard of him.....

MINNESOTA FATS

-Grey Ghost-

 

[jlrowe]

Play the percentages, play the safties, take advantage of the rules and win the money. Im not mad but it is friggin boring. Kids turn on the TV see a pool match watch a few minutes and says this is boring. Well what are the chances of him or her actually ever playing the game. It doesnt have to be a circus but at least some character. I can say one thing i got the opportunity to know cornbread red in the last years of his life and even then when i was around him i was either embarrassed, scared, or lmao. But one thing i wasnt and that was bored.

 

[justadub]

While reading this thread, I told myself not to get into it. I know how these things go, and it isn't pretty. I enjoy GreyGhosts posts 99.99% of the time, and I can tell he is passionate about this subject.

Sadly, there are a few problems with your arguments, GGhost. I'm not going to get into the whole thing, but I do want to point out one glaring difference that kids today face compared to when we were kids. You think a little conflict and confrontation is good for kids, and getting punched sometimes will happen. Tell me this: do you ever remember kids bringing guns to school when we were kids, much less actually using them? It is scary being a kid today. The pressures are FAR different than when we were kids. Weapons are far more readily available, and the whole population is desensitized to their being used. Kids get KILLED for their freakin sneakers. For "disrespecting" another kid. And a whole host of other reasons. Not even starting with the drugs that are available today compared to our generation.

Going to school is a nightmare for many kids. There isn't enough supervision and kids get abused big time. Even the ones who aren't necessarily "weirdos" like you describe. I think by your post, you believe that it's good for kids to get beaten up now and again. What are you as a parent supposed to tell your kid when they are scared to death to go to school? That they aren't tough enough?

And then there is this wonderful outlet we are using right now. The internet, and everything related. Facebook, Twitter, text messaging, and the rest. Kids get ridiculed and bullied at a far greater level than we ever thought of, and a far faster pace.

Too weak, too sensitive, too protected? I do everything I can possibly do to protect my kids in todays world, and I know it isn't necessarily enough. We've been lucky so far, and my guys are wonderful kids. And they can stand up for themselves if they need to. But I see many of their peers who have been on the wrong end of things and it ain't because they were weak. It was because they weren't as protected (or as lucky) as my kids are.

As for the rest of your opus, I'll gladly pass on making further comment. I understand where you are coming from, and many or your frustrations. But don't think that kids today aren't facing conflict or are over-protected compared to our generations. Because they sure as hell aren't.

Carry on, and good shooting. One and all.