Getting over a 'hump'

J

jimtauer

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I have been playing (mainly 8 ball) for about 15 years in various local leagues, and after a lot of practice and tinkering with equipment, I feel I am in a good place finally with my game. I am running racks on a fairly consistent basis, and consistently in the top 10 within my league's division in wins vs. losses.

I have noticed however a good percentage of the time, I come very close to running a rack, but do not run out. If there is a somewhat difficult shot to get on the 8 ball, or on the ball before the 8 ball, it seems like I have a tendency to blow it at times and miss, or not get the shape I want on the 8 ball. A lot of this has to do with the number of my opponents' balls still on the table at the time, needing to get really good accuracy towards that last ball or two.

My question is there anything specific I can practice to mimic these scenarios and get better at them? I have made notes of specific shots I've missed to try to reproduce them when they come up again, but other than that, any other recommendations?
 
Generally speaking, when you're unable to close out the rack, would you say it's because you're over or underplaying position? Either way, it often points to some flaw in how you set up and deliver the cue. Confidence plays a big role in this as well. You might want to consider getting a video evaluation of your stroke by a qualified instructor. If you let us know where you're located, we can probably steer you to someone who can help you figure out your issues. :D

Scott Lee
http://poolknowledge.com
 
jimtauer said:
... I have noticed however a good percentage of the time, I come very close to running a rack, but do not run out. If there is a somewhat difficult shot to get on the 8 ball, or on the ball before the 8 ball, it seems like I have a tendency to blow it at times and miss, or not get the shape I want on the 8 ball. A lot of this has to do with the number of my opponents' balls still on the table at the time, needing to get really good accuracy towards that last ball or two.

My question is there anything specific I can practice to mimic these scenarios and get better at them? I have made notes of specific shots I've missed to try to reproduce them when they come up again, but other than that, any other recommendations?
Click to expand...
Without seeing how you get into trouble it's hard to diagnose. One possible problem (or maybe it isn't) is shot selection so that the final shots will be more natural. It's not always possible to arrange that, but sometimes it's just a matter of what order you shoot the balls in.
For working on precise position in lots of scenarios, try my A2B drill, which was in my column in Billiards Digest a few months ago. For drills in general, try turning your problem shots into progressive practice drills.
 
Thanks for the replies. I would say in general I am over-playing position, shooting too hard. So maybe it's just the excitement of getting close to a break and run and I'm putting too much into it.

I am in the twin cities (Minneapolis/St Paul), MN.
 
I can't see what your doing so I'd be guessing. I play a lot of rotation & see this quite a bit from players right on the precipice of breaking through to the level of running out regularly & more often than not its a shift in their rhythm that I would point to as the issue.

They run 6-8 balls solidly playing proper patterns & position & as they near the end of the rack they seem to speed up & get out of the rhythm that got them through the rack to where they are. I don't know if it's adrenaline, excitement or a host of other things. A rock solid repeatable PSR applied on every shot, no matter how difficult or easy the shot will help keep you in a consistent rhythm that often disappears & causes those road bumps near the end of racks. Good luck
 
I agree with Colonel that players rhythm around the table will often get out of sync near the end of a rack. Most of the time the culprit is from speeding up.

I like to pick one thing to make sure I do that keeps me in rhythm, such as taking an extra step back from the table after each shot, for example. I like this a lot because it prevents you from jumping on to the next shot too quickly and keeps your rhythm around the table constant.
 
What sets the best from the almost the bests in 8 ball particularly is planning. The best players in the 8 ball world always choose the right pattern and then rely on their ability to see it out. I would seriously consider (depending on your ability) to try get a lesson with a pro or a local or state champion standard player in 8 ball.

When I transitioned from snooker into UK8B I was getting destroyed by average players. I simply didn't know how to go about the more complex run out patterns. I was playing snooker against some of the very best Britain had to offer at the time and holding my own but put me on a table half the size with fewer balls to pot and I played shocking even though my fundamentals were as solid as can be. I then asked Mark Selby for a little lesson in UK8B and after a few hours it all started to sink in and make sense. When you have a world champion telling you to play a rack a certain way you don't argue you just do it. You soon realise why they're a world champion.

Missing or messing position on the key ball is just a result of poor planning. If you plan the rack out after the break in its entirety then you will find you don't miss position half as much on the last ball. It isn't 9 ball where thinking just 2 or 3 balls ahead will suffice.
 
It seems to me that if you have enough self awareness to recognize that the problem occurs in relation to the number of balls your opponent has on the table, then it's clear to me that it's related to your mental game.

Is it possible that when your opponent has several balls to choose from, you become a bit more tense because if you miss, then you are likely done.....as opposed to a situation where your opponent has only one or two balls and you can easily play your shot to leave him ugly or safe should you miss?

If this is what concerns you, then what you're experiencing is a lack of focus. You may not even recognize it because you are subconsciously concerned about loosing control and since we execute the stroke on a subconscious level, your subconscious concerns are messing with the fluid delivery of your natural stroke rhythm....this is why you tend to over or under play your position.

This is about putting those concerns aside, weighing your risk/reward ratios when choosing to take the shot or play safe and being fully committed to your choice when you take the shot. This will allow you to build confidence in your decisions and in return it will put those concerns out of mind.

We cannot ignore that once you're in trouble it's hard to get out so you may wish to evaluate your shot selection and strategy to mitigate situations that put you in a position where you're concerned about losing control.
 
Last edited:
Some pretty good advice in here. If it is mental and you're missing because of the pressure of your opponent having so many balls to choose from and thinking about if you miss where to leave the ball...then that's the wrong mentality Imo. When I plan on running out I do just that, plan to run out and it doesn't matter how easy your opponents balls are laying. Be aggressive but not stupidly aggressive and try not to think of the what ifs, just the what whens :-)
 
BilliardsAbout said:
Is there a link to your A2B drill, Bob? Thanks.
Click to expand...
I think Dr. Dave has a video of it on YouTube using cards to select two random points. I'm not sure whether it's on-line otherwise or not. Very briefly:

Select two random points on the table, maybe by breaking and taking the positions of the 5 and 7 (or whatever). Mark both points (A and B). Put a ball on A and with ball in hand make the ball in a chosen pocket and leave the cue ball as close to B as possible without using a cushion. Repeat until you feel you can get from A to B well enough. Do this using each of the 6 pockets and no cushions. If a shot allows a range of cue ball positions, explore the possible range that still allows you to get to B.

Next, pick a pocket and a cushion, and get from A to B using that pair -- one cushion contact. There are often far more combinations this way than with no cushion. Try as many as you can make work.

Lastly, try two or more cushion paths from A to B. The practical paths are generally far fewer than for the 1-cushion part.

As for what constitutes "close enough", I find that a typical student will be able to get the cue ball within about six inches of B in three or four shots. At first the student may need suggestions like "You'll have to hit that with more draw to get that angle," or such, but most quickly see which knob to turn to get the change they need.
 
Bob Jewett said:
I think Dr. Dave has a video of it on YouTube using cards to select two random points. I'm not sure whether it's on-line otherwise or not. Very briefly:

Select two random points on the table, maybe by breaking and taking the positions of the 5 and 7 (or whatever). Mark both points (A and B). Put a ball on A and with ball in hand make the ball in a chosen pocket and leave the cue ball as close to B as possible without using a cushion. Repeat until you feel you can get from A to B well enough. Do this using each of the 6 pockets and no cushions. If a shot allows a range of cue ball positions, explore the possible range that still allows you to get to B.

Next, pick a pocket and a cushion, and get from A to B using that pair -- one cushion contact. There are often far more combinations this way than with no cushion. Try as many as you can make work.

Lastly, try two or more cushion paths from A to B. The practical paths are generally far fewer than for the 1-cushion part.

As for what constitutes "close enough", I find that a typical student will be able to get the cue ball within about six inches of B in three or four shots. At first the student may need suggestions like "You'll have to hit that with more draw to get that angle," or such, but most quickly see which knob to turn to get the change they need.
Click to expand...

Lovely. Thanks very much.
 
Thank you for everyone's advice here, it is greatly appreciated. I think it is a mental block or something. I've tried practicing the past few days and even in practice, I either seem to mess up shape on my 7th ball, mess up shape on the 8 ball, or miss the 8 ball entirely. My first 6 balls are consistently good, when a rack seems good to run. Perhaps I have a subconscious fear of success or something. I actually wonder if this has anything to do with me never finishing projects around the house...:D maybe I am catching on to an issue in my broader life.
 
The next time you practice, establish a reward or penalty for achieving or not achieving your goal.

For example if it's a rack that you should run but you mess it up on the 7 or 8 ball then each time you screw up you have to contribute $2-$5 to a needy friend, charity or homeless person. If you're wealthy, raise the dollar amount to a sum that will force you to stay focused. Do this 6 or 7 times and I'm sure the amount will force you to get committed to your goal.

On the other hand, every time you are successful in getting through the last two balls, you can reward yourself with an equal sum that can be set aside for something special you want to purchase.

IMPORTANT: You have to actually write down the reward or penalty on a piece of paper and keep it with you while practicing. Sharing it with another person makes it even more powerful because now that it's in writing, you are accountable to pay the penalty/reward. Without accountability, this exercise has little value.

It sounds like you need to light a little fire under your level of motivation which is critical in maintaining focus.
 
Last edited:
Good advice from everyone here to help you get out more consistently. My own success in run outs in 8 ball comes from picking my last ball before the 8 ball first. Then work backwards from there. Having the last ball be a stop shot before the 8, or easy position roll will help you finish strong.
 
Excellent advice! Champion 8 ball players do exactly the same thing you do!

Scott Lee
http://poolknowledge.com

Sunchaser said:
Good advice from everyone here to help you get out more consistently. My own success in run outs in 8 ball comes from picking my last ball before the 8 ball first. Then work backwards from there. Having the last ball be a stop shot before the 8, or easy position roll will help you finish strong.
Click to expand...
 
Teach your kid how to practice and learn. If you can learn to practice properly on a pool table you'll realize you can learn to do anything.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top