Ginacue popped over ivory, hopefully much or all fake.
- Thread starter ShootingArts
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LOL @ the poem. I think Trump should build the wall out of Ivory.
I don't think that it is fair to make items valueless that folks bought and paid for in a legal way. If you want to make ivory illegal going forward that's OK although it won't save African Elephants in the wild.
Toni Atkins is a left wing extremist and they always destroy people's property rights. This broad is the one that came up with the legislation in California that Brown signed.
What if I said that I wanted all the folks' home equity out there because it violated " environmental " policy. Don't laugh it could happen.
Homes and over building cause all kinds of problems for the " environment ".
Short of a massive birth control effort in Africa the Elephants are in trouble. This has been known forever. I used to take National Wildlife Magazine when I was a kid and the number one problem for wildlife anywhere in the world was human over population and that was in the 1970s.
Nothing has changed but the " Kumbaya " crowd never gets the real problems in their sights.
http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2008/05/080505-us-ivory.html
2008 study. Perhaps that's too old to be valid. But they state the US is the second largest retail market for ivory in the world. National Geographic published it. It hasn't been taken down....so I'm assuming no one has found them to be libellous, or misleading in any way. But they're a bunch of tree hugging liberals, right?
http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2008/05/080505-us-ivory.html
2008 study. Perhaps that's too old to be valid. But they state the US is the second largest retail market for ivory in the world. National Geographic published it. It hasn't been taken down....so I'm assuming no one has found them to be libellous, or misleading in any way. But they're a bunch of tree hugging liberals, right?
I am all for saving the elephants. But making my cues worthless when they were made with legal ivory is not gonna help the elephants.
I am fine with them making ivory illegal from this point forward. The reality is you will have to kill the poachers and we will see if the Africans are willing to do that.
Ivory can be harvested by the passing of elephants from old age. There are still countries in Africa where you can legally hunt them.
In fact you can legally hunt elephants right now in S. Africa, Zimbabwe, Mozambique, Namibia, Cameroon, Gabon and Tanzania. and its great for the elephant population to manage the herd.
Do the folks in Cali know that you can legally hunt elephants? Do they know that sport hunting brings mega needed cash into communities in Africa that need it and gives incentives to the populace to keep the resource alive?
Making my legal cues worthless while I can arrange a Safari as I write this is super ironic.
Sounds to me like there is a lot of ignorance out there.
That's great. What's your point with all of the above? I was asked to provide a credible source for my claim. I did.
It's too bad about your cues. Really. I feel for you. Oh, wait. I don't. Ivory has always come from elephants. Or didn't you know that? Tell you what...hold onto them. When the last elephant on Earth is dead, there will be no reason to ban ivory sales, and your cue's value will skyrocket.
Sean, I've tried to explain it to you. Keep blaming China. On a per capita basis, the US is about on par with China, regarding demand. There are 1.4 billion people in China. About 350M in the US. So, they are 4 times larger than the US. Lou threw out the number 95%. Joey ended up quoting NG at 70%.
Demand in the US isn't diminishing. Legal barricades are in place to curtail its availability. Otherwise, Bava would have 14 more ivory laden cues. And while we're talking about Chinese demand, wasn't Ernie caught exporting ivory goods into Asia? So, again, blame Asia. You have a case of an American facilitating the shipping of ivory into the very country you blame for the problem. Rich
To: Armstrong and Poppa
From: Martin Niemoller
First they came for the Socialists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Socialist.
Then they came for the Trade Unionists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Trade Unionist.
Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Jew.
Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.
----------------------------------------
I really don't think there is anyone that wants Elephants poached. Whether or not this new law will help reduce poaching is very debatable. What is outrageous to most level headed human beings is that the law punishes and/or prohibits the actions taken with what was once very legal. The result will have significant financial impact to a lot of people. Only a hateful, mean spirited soul would find pleasure in that. I have cues and most have Ivory. I didn't buy any of them because they had ivory in them. I bought them as part of a collection of great cues from the great American cue makers. I bought them because of their playability, their beauty and with the hope of a value increase over time. If Ivory was never used in cue making, I would still have these cues with some other material in place of the ivory. The fact that you are pleased that I will have significant financial loss is pathetic.
I hope no American or other world citizen will be financially hurt someday by a similar circumstance. Something you own or have invested in legally at the time, later confiscated or restricted by government resulting in financial loss or even financial devastation. Heed the famous quote from Martin Niemoller. That but for the grace of God be you.
From: Martin Niemoller
First they came for the Socialists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Socialist.
Then they came for the Trade Unionists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Trade Unionist.
Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Jew.
Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.
----------------------------------------
I really don't think there is anyone that wants Elephants poached. Whether or not this new law will help reduce poaching is very debatable. What is outrageous to most level headed human beings is that the law punishes and/or prohibits the actions taken with what was once very legal. The result will have significant financial impact to a lot of people. Only a hateful, mean spirited soul would find pleasure in that. I have cues and most have Ivory. I didn't buy any of them because they had ivory in them. I bought them as part of a collection of great cues from the great American cue makers. I bought them because of their playability, their beauty and with the hope of a value increase over time. If Ivory was never used in cue making, I would still have these cues with some other material in place of the ivory. The fact that you are pleased that I will have significant financial loss is pathetic.
I hope no American or other world citizen will be financially hurt someday by a similar circumstance. Something you own or have invested in legally at the time, later confiscated or restricted by government resulting in financial loss or even financial devastation. Heed the famous quote from Martin Niemoller. That but for the grace of God be you.
The outlawing of sport hunting always ends up in the decimation of the game. Hunters place so much cash in these communities that can't be made up when game hunting is outlawed. Then the locals are starving and start poaching.
I think that I will do more for the elephants than your lame A$$ will ever do. I think I will book a Safari soon. No time like the present to actually take effective action.
Its Jumbo time. A friend of mine has a son that is a hunter in S. Africa. I think I will contact him about possibilities. Will have to practice up with the .375 H & H Magnum.
http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2008/05/080505-us-ivory.html
2008 study. Perhaps that's too old to be valid. But they state the US is the second largest retail market for ivory in the world. National Geographic published it. It hasn't been taken down....so I'm assuming no one has found them to be libellous, or misleading in any way. But they're a bunch of tree hugging liberals, right?
lol, did you even read the article?
"Cleva also took aim at the report's conclusion. 'The vast majority of U.S. seizures ... involve small non-commercial quantities, a fact that refutes the claim that large-scale illegal ivory trade exists in the United States,' she said."
Sandra Cleva is the spokesperson for the US F&WL Service, lmao.
Lou Figueroa
I think you are correct. Sorry for that.
As far as I can tell, no.
But all of it is speculation anyway, including your own statement.
I think your throttle is stuck wide open....
.
GINACUE popped over ivory
HI Back in the 1800 they slaughered over 10,000 elephants in
Africa just to make Pool or Snooker Balls until someone decided
to make there own balls because of lack of Elephants
HI Back in the 1800 they slaughered over 10,000 elephants in
Africa just to make Pool or Snooker Balls until someone decided
to make there own balls because of lack of Elephants
He's already guilty of a crime. Under current law, it is illegal to sell any goods containing ivory after July 6, 2016. Even within the state. There are some exceptions, but they don't apply in this case. So, at the very least, he's in some hot water.
A sale is completed when the goods change hands. So, he's already committed a criminal act. How criminal is yet to be determined.
justaplayer
Banned
For clarification, these are the actual charges from the US Department of Justice. He is in a very bad spot here.
U.S. Attorneys*»*Central District of California*»News
Department of Justice
U.S. Attorney’s Office
Central District of California
FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE
Thursday, July 28, 2016
North Hollywood Pool Cue Maker Charged with Helping Smuggle Elephant Ivory
**********LOS ANGELES*– A North Hollywood man surrendered to U.S. Marshals this morning after an arrest warrant was issued on federal charges of aiding and abetting the illegal smuggling of protected elephant ivory.
********* Cesar Ernesto Gutierrez, 75, was charged in a criminal complaint filed Wednesday in United States District Court with aiding and abetting the attempted illegal exportation from the United States to Taiwan of protected African elephant ivory.
********* The affidavit in support of the criminal complaint alleges that Gutierrez, a well-known custom pool cue maker in the United States, operates Ginacue, a custom pool cue manufacturing business in North Hollywood. Gutierrez allegedly manufactured and sold two people approximately 41 sections of custom pool cues containing the protected elephant ivory inlays.* The two individuals were subsequently arrested at Los Angeles International Airport when agents with U.S. Customs and Border Protection and U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service discovered the pool cues in their luggage.* The seized pool cues were purchased from Gutierrez for approximately $75,000 to $85,000.* Gutierrez is charged with aiding and abetting the attempted illegal smuggling of the high-value pool cues.
********* “The protection of threatened and endangered wildlife is an international concern,” said United States Attorney Eileen M. Decker. “Illegal trafficking of protected species, even small parts of them, creates a market and demand that can lead to the decimation*of these vulnerable populations.”
********* Gutierrez appeared this afternoon in United States District Court and was released on a $10,000 appearance bond.* Post-indictment arraignment was scheduled for August 24.
**********A criminal complaint contains allegations that a defendant has committed a crime. Every defendant is presumed to be innocent until and unless proven guilty in court.
********* The charge alleged in the complaint carries a statutory maximum penalty of 10 years in federal prison.
********* This case was investigated by the United States Fish and Wildlife Service, with assistance by United States Customs and Border Protection personnel. This case is being prosecuted by Assistant United States Attorney Amanda M. Bettinelli of the Environmental and Community Safety Crimes Section.
16-179
USAO - California, Central
U.S. Attorneys*»*Central District of California*»News
Department of Justice
U.S. Attorney’s Office
Central District of California
FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE
Thursday, July 28, 2016
North Hollywood Pool Cue Maker Charged with Helping Smuggle Elephant Ivory
**********LOS ANGELES*– A North Hollywood man surrendered to U.S. Marshals this morning after an arrest warrant was issued on federal charges of aiding and abetting the illegal smuggling of protected elephant ivory.
********* Cesar Ernesto Gutierrez, 75, was charged in a criminal complaint filed Wednesday in United States District Court with aiding and abetting the attempted illegal exportation from the United States to Taiwan of protected African elephant ivory.
********* The affidavit in support of the criminal complaint alleges that Gutierrez, a well-known custom pool cue maker in the United States, operates Ginacue, a custom pool cue manufacturing business in North Hollywood. Gutierrez allegedly manufactured and sold two people approximately 41 sections of custom pool cues containing the protected elephant ivory inlays.* The two individuals were subsequently arrested at Los Angeles International Airport when agents with U.S. Customs and Border Protection and U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service discovered the pool cues in their luggage.* The seized pool cues were purchased from Gutierrez for approximately $75,000 to $85,000.* Gutierrez is charged with aiding and abetting the attempted illegal smuggling of the high-value pool cues.
********* “The protection of threatened and endangered wildlife is an international concern,” said United States Attorney Eileen M. Decker. “Illegal trafficking of protected species, even small parts of them, creates a market and demand that can lead to the decimation*of these vulnerable populations.”
********* Gutierrez appeared this afternoon in United States District Court and was released on a $10,000 appearance bond.* Post-indictment arraignment was scheduled for August 24.
**********A criminal complaint contains allegations that a defendant has committed a crime. Every defendant is presumed to be innocent until and unless proven guilty in court.
********* The charge alleged in the complaint carries a statutory maximum penalty of 10 years in federal prison.
********* This case was investigated by the United States Fish and Wildlife Service, with assistance by United States Customs and Border Protection personnel. This case is being prosecuted by Assistant United States Attorney Amanda M. Bettinelli of the Environmental and Community Safety Crimes Section.
16-179
USAO - California, Central
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You purchase a gun and you sell it to someone and he make a holdup
in a bank Are you responsible for that
Let me get this straight. A study comes out slamming the US over their enforcement of the importing and exporting of illegal ivory, and the spokesperson for the agency under fire vehemently disagrees? Shocking.
Did you read the full article, Lou? Or just look for the loophole?
I believe the transaction took place prior to July. Besides, he was not charged with selling goods containing ivory. He was charged for aiding and abetting the illegal export of ivory.
I truly think you have no idear what you are talking about ...... again- just like when you responded to my post saying drugs were never legal. CLUELESS
HE IS NOT ALREADY GUILTY OF A CRIME ---- INNOCENT TILL PRO VPN GUILTY????? Ever heard of that obscure thought ? ?? Once again you have no idea r what you're talking about. Not to mention it's gonna take some doing to PROVE he knew what was gonna happen to the cues once they left his possession. Get a clue, get a life.
Same thing here ------ PROVE IT!!!!
NO, no I am not. As long as it was a legal gun, and I could legally have it and I followed the state rules for private party gun sales ( which are very lax ) I have ZERO liability after the sale. Period.
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