Have a question for the Instructors - Please

[One Pocket John]

Quit playing about 10 years ago. Been Playing since '63.

At the time I quit I was doing well with my game. Could feel the stick and cue ball pretty well. Could feel putting whitey anywhere I wanted.

I started back about 2 months ago. I'm breaking down the mechanics and starting over to avoid creating any bad habits........again.

Reading all of the posts on this forum is helping tremendously.

Question: Grip and Stroke (back stroke and forward stroke)

From reading here....... it is my understanding that the triceps pull the cue back and the biceps pull the cue forward to push the cue ball where you want it to go. Am I on track here? (honestly I never did give this much thought in my pool shooting days - I just did it)

Now, the grip of the cue. What I have discovered while trying to get my game back is that the harder I try, the more I grip the cue trying to force the stroke and the shot.

Yesterday, I practiced with a loose grip. Cue cradled and the thumb hanging down to keep the cue in the cradle. This is a new feeling to me. I do have to say I'm impressed with the feel now.

My question on the grip is, on the shot stroke, making contact with the cue ball, is the grip intentionaly closed (light squeeze) to my end of stroke. I have noticed that on some shots that my cue hand actually opens and yes someone could easily pull the cue out of my hand.

Sorry for the long post. We just dont get many BCA instructors here in St. Louis.

Thanks guys.

 

[pooltchr]

From reading here....... it is my understanding that the triceps pull the cue back and the biceps pull the cue forward to push the cue ball where you want it to go. Am I on track here? (honestly I never did give this much thought in my pool shooting days - I just did it)

Absolutely correct. This is why a short pause at the end of the backstroke is desired. It allows the tricep to relax before the bicep takes over.
Now, the grip of the cue. What I have discovered while trying to get my game back is that the harder I try, the more I grip the cue trying to force the stroke and the shot.

Not a good thing

Yesterday, I practiced with a loose grip. Cue cradled and the thumb hanging down to keep the cue in the cradle. This is a new feeling to me. I do have to say I'm impressed with the feel now.

Much better plan!

My question on the grip is, on the shot stroke, making contact with the cue ball, is the grip intentionaly closed (light squeeze) to my end of stroke. I have noticed that on some shots that my cue hand actually opens and yes someone could easily pull the cue out of my hand.

Your grip should be more of a cradle with just enough pressure to keep the cue from unwanted movement. Think of holding a baby bird...not hard enough to hurt it...just enough to keep it from getting away. Pressure should remain constant throughout the entire stroke.

Sorry for the long post. We just dont get many BCA instructors here in St. Louis.

Thanks guys.

Welcome back to the game!

Steve

 

[BobN]

Keep practicing that cradle grip. My grip is loose to the point that when I finish my stroke on a hard high english shot, the cue actually will slip slightly in my hand. Tremendous how much action I can get on the cue ball that way. When I get tired (which is after many less hours of playing than it used to be), I tend to tighten my grip on the cue and I can tell because the cue ball action is not what it was early in the night. That's when I lay off for the evening. I don't like having to think about things when I'm at the table and the only way I could make sure my grip loosened back up is to consciously think about it. Time for me to go home then.

Bob

 

[greyghost]

one thing to add to steves post....you can judge the grip by how you finish.

When the stroke is done the grip hand should be at the chest....the chest is what stops your hand.

The knuckles of the grip hand should be positioned like this upon completion (pic one)

If the knuckles are horizontal then your gripping to tight and the tip of the cue will raise and the elbow will drop. (pic two)

and remember to keep that thumb pointed straight down....its worth its weight in gold

 

[One Pocket John]

Thanks for the help guys.

Yeah Ghost, I hear ya. I have noticed that on some shots my grip is very loose at the end of stroke. My index finger (first finger) ends up not being on the cue at all.

Thinking of holding a bird from flying away is helping when I'm at my
"set" position. (cue at the cue ball)

I believe it was Dr. Cue that mentioned, to let the "cue reach" out on shots. In my experience this is a positive mental image and forces you to commit on the shot and reach your end of stroke. (no turning back)

I cleaned off the ole AE Schmidt 4.5 x 9.0 this morning. Its been a gathering place for stuff for the last 10 years. Had to buy 4 new 4' lamps also. Needless to say, the table needs to be recovered but is good enough for now.

I really enjoy practicing the mechanics and feel at home. Use to practice about 40 hours a week. Then when I went out into the field the only thing I thought about was where to hit the object ball and where I wanted the cue ball to stop on the table. Nothing else. Man......that felt good.

My favorite game is one pocket where cue ball control is everything. Not to mention banking and kicking. A lot of fun. If ya cant feel it......it aint gonna happen.

I know there is a one pocket forum. Been there. All of my studying of the game has been through Grady Mathews. I have all of his tapes and all of his books. Man, what a great guy I dont think there is a selfish bone in his body. Got to meet him long ago, he autographed my book.

Thanks again.

 

[One Pocket John]

one thing to add to steves post....you can judge the grip by how you finish.

When the stroke is done the grip hand should be at the chest....the chest is what stops your hand.

The knuckles of the grip hand should be positioned like this upon completion (pic one)

If the knuckles are horizontal then your gripping to tight and the tip of the cue will raise and the elbow will drop. (pic two)

and remember to keep that thumb pointed straight down....its worth its weight in gold

Thanks Ghost.

I revisited my grip.........yup sure enough when I grip the cue my thumb was pointed at my belly rather than staight down. This has been corrected. I have noticed a ton of information being transmitted from the cue ball through the cue to my hand then to the brain.........just like it use to be.

Now all I have to do is to pick a spot on my butt hand (thumb or V) to get the sights on the back of the rifle lined up with the front sights. I'm using my thumb right now as the rear sight. Seems to be working very well the cue ball is going right where I'm looking allowing me to focus on the carom off the OB for position.

I look at my cue as a rifle. If the back sight is not lined up with the front sight then you cant expect the bullet (cue ball) to go where your looking.

I'm also working on the back stroke........trying to keep it to 4" to 6". To long of a back stroke.....for some, is not a good thing.

By the way Ghost, I have always used the method of pretending that I have a really long cue and am shooting the OB into the pocket with the cue.......its just that the CB happens to be in betwen the tip and the OB.

One good turn deserves another. One of my instructors (Harry Sims - 3 Cushion Billiard Champion from the '80s - Passed away a few years ago) suggested that you try to slide the OB into the pocket. Not only does this method help with preshot strokes but it also requires one to pay closer attention to how the OB is hit. Give it a try.

I am very grateful for everyones input.

Thanks again.

 

[greyghost]

Glad its working for you....great point on the cue being a rifle...i use the same analogy when helping others.

Especially how you said the CB is just in the way...I don't aim the CB, just like you don't aim the bullet...you aim the rifle.


The thing about the thumb is great if you have problems with the wrist.


If the thumb is down it straightens the wrist and gives you a straight pendulum stroke when you just move the forearm back and forth.

Get down with your thumb crooked and move the forearm back and forth in a straight line. You can do this, but even tho the forearm is moving correctly in a straight line, the crooked wrist makes the stroke cuve in and out...it adds another axis to it...BAD BAD BAD.....thats why you see guys like Earl twisting their wrist on the delivery...they are subconsciously getting the cue back in line with the shot.

keep up the good work,
Grey Ghost