Head coming up after the "set"....a bad thing?

mattman

mattman

Registered User
Silver Member
Ok....here's the deal. On long table shots I get down in my stance and basically adjust my head so that I can see the object ball. I do my warm-up strokes, set and then look at OB before my I start my backstroke. What I have been noticing lately is that the OB looks blurred and I think it's because my head is too low and my eyes are rolled to the top of my head...causing a blurred vision.

I just finished Randy G's pool school a couple weeks ago and thought I would video tape myself running the mother drills and then 10 racks of the Hopkins test (game). I notices at times (and most or the time on long shots where the CB is near the rail and the OB is a hanger at the opposite end of a 9ft table) that my head will come up about an inch or so. This is not during the stroke itself. It goes as follows. Warm-up storkes, set, head up, pause and then finish.

To me, it doesn't seem like it's interferring with my shot making, but at the same time, I want to correct any bad habits ASAP. Something came to mind while typing this post and I will have to review the tape again. I am wondering if after getting into my stance and and starting my warm-up strokes, my head is coming down....thus causing my head to come back up again to focus on the OB ball.......comfortably.

What do you think? Head up a bad thing?
Thanks,
Matt
 
You are talking about a small change, but it could change your perception of the shot. If you are shooting your shot with your head an inch higher, why not do your warm-ups and go into set with your head already in the position you are going to be shooting? It sounds like you may be trying to get as low as possible, but it may be too low to be comfortable. Since your goal is to remain in the same position throughout your shot, it might be better to drop into a comfortable shooting position to begin with. Since I haven't seen you shoot, and Randy has, he may have more specific suggestions.
Steve
 
Randy might have some suggestions, but I don't think I was doing this during class-time. I think I better work on not getting so low on the shot. I think it was mother drill #5 (speed control/25 pennies) were I noticed it. Even though there is no movement during the stroke, is my eye pattern changes on a shot during the stroke, then so will come movement of my head.

Thanks
Matt
 
lower

Actually if you think about it, the lower you get the less your head will have to come up!

I have noticed on long shots I do not pick the head up the lower I go. Think about it, it makes a strait line.

If you stand up more you will have to move your head more to see all the length of the table!

I had the same problem, but once I focused on correcting it I found that lower is better on longer shots.
 
txplshrk...Not necessarily! I think it can work either way. Myself, I see the shot better (long or short) standing higher over the cue. My chin is on average 10-12" above the cue, unless I have to be stretched out to reach a shot.

Mattman...You're correct, in that if your PEP changes from shot to shot, you will likely have some other problem, like the head movement you're describing. When the eyes wander, the mind is searching for information.
That's why we teach you to lock in your eye pattern, and keep the eyes steady on the OB, when delivering the cue through the CB.

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com
 
Thanks for the Tips guys

Just happened to be reading the forums and I can appreciate this set of tips. I will have to start watching my own 'shot and follow thru' habits.
 
mattman said:
Ok....here's the deal. On long table shots I get down in my stance and basically adjust my head so that I can see the object ball. I do my warm-up strokes, set and then look at OB before my I start my backstroke. What I have been noticing lately is that the OB looks blurred and I think it's because my head is too low and my eyes are rolled to the top of my head...causing a blurred vision.
Click to expand...

If the OB looks blurred to you, then it is not due to being low on the shot. Something else is wrong most likely. You could have the best stroke in the world and your head could be staying still, but something is not correct.

It is due to how your eyes are focusing, and also due to your head pointed to much towards the cueball. Yes, I have experienced the same sensation as you, so I raise my head a little (and towards the object ball) because I am too old to stay down low for a long time.

If when you get down on the shot and you are focusing on the cueball too much, or sighting down your stick obsessively, or watching too hard where your cuetip is going, YOU ARE NOT FOCUSING PROPERLY.

Most of your time focusing should be on the object ball (your eyes should be going back and forth just the same). It is okay, in my humble opinion, for the cueball to be a little blurry. No big deal, as I am now farsighted after laser vision and the cueball is a little blurry anyway.

You should be using 'hunter vision', a new term I am claiming :D , when you are stepping into the shot. Your eyes should be focusing on the object ball in most instances. It is easier to align your body if you are concentrating on the object ball when you are setting up. How close etc. you are coming to the cueball is feel. You will see this out of the corner of your eye, so to speak. Don't forgo ignoring where your tip is going though. This is very important also. And at the pause just before you pull the trigger should give yourself a moment to see if your cuetip is properly aligned.

Look up 'Quite Eye' on this forum and on the web. You will probably conclude after reading this that your eyes are not focusing on the object ball properly and this is why you are not shooting as well as you could.

Rodney Dangerfield
 
whitewolf said:
And at the pause just before you pull the trigger should give yourself a moment to see if your cuetip is properly aligned.
Rodney Dangerfield
Click to expand...
My eyes go to the object ball right after the set, then backstroke, pause and then pull the trigger. This is the way it was taught to me and I am sure somebody will support me on this one. On ocassion and very rarely, do I look at the OB at the time of the pause. If fact, the pause is the hardest thing to remember of my stroke.

I think where the blurred vision is coming from my head being tilted downward on the CB too much. When I look at the OB my eyeballs are straining from looking up too far. You can try it now. Roll your eyes up as far as you can....that is what it feels like. I will figure it out.

Thanks
Matt
 
whitewolf said:
Look up 'Quite Eye' on this forum and on the web. You will probably conclude after reading this that your eyes are not focusing on the object ball properly and this is why you are not shooting as well as you could.

Rodney Dangerfield
Click to expand...

Ray...mattman has been to pool school, and understands EXACTLY how his personal eye pattern works...for him! BTW, it may be here in the forum archives as "Quite Eye", but the real study (which can be found by googling 'quiet eye'), done by the University of FL and again by the University of Quebec, is called the Quiet Eye Study.

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com
 
mattman said:
My eyes go to the object ball right after the set, then backstroke, pause and then pull the trigger. This is the way it was taught to me and I am sure somebody will support me on this one. On ocassion and very rarely, do I look at the OB at the time of the pause. If fact, the pause is the hardest thing to remember of my stroke.

I think where the blurred vision is coming from my head being tilted downward on the CB too much. When I look at the OB my eyeballs are straining from looking up too far. You can try it now. Roll your eyes up as far as you can....that is what it feels like. I will figure it out.

Thanks
Matt
Click to expand...
Almost everything we do is middle or lower hemispherical, as far as the eyes are concerned. Pool, however, is for most players an upper hemispherical activity. Alex Pagulayan's facial positioning requires extreme upper hemispherical activity with the eyes:
paguluyan.jpg

I find that when I play certain shots, my face gets into a position like Alex's, and the balls do look strange from that position. I make a conscious effort to have my face as close to vertical as possible. This takes away the problems associated with upper hemispherical eye activity. I still have my chin on the cue, but my eyes are not as forward of my chin like Alex's. I think that helps me see better - you may want to give it a try.

-djb
 
?????????

What Poolteacher said!!!!!!!! Comfort zone- and when you pull the trigger never be looking at the cue-ball aways have your eyes focused on the target.
Pinocchio
 
Well, I used to be one of those guys with a funny tilt to his head due to wearing glasses. I quit playing for 25 years and in the meantime I had Lasik. Now I have to move my head too when I shift my gaze from the OB to the CB. Of course I look at the OB when I complete my final stroke, but just prior to firing, after the set, I have to move my head slightly in order to get the OB in focus. I went to pool school with Stan Shuffett and he was concerned about this practice but found that I HAD to do it. I think we decided when I did it was ok, but he would have preferred that I quit it. After addressing the CB I just can't see the OB without a slight movement of the head. I think I move it several times, back and forth, but finish with the eyes on the OB. I hope this isn't another major issue :rolleyes: ...Tom
 
Tom????????????

A mans gotta do what a mans gotta do. I too have eye problems (cataracts) an had to do a major stroke an alignment overhaul. I know Stan an if proof is in the pudding Stan's the man by that I mean look at Landon.
Pinocchio
 
mattman said:
Ok....here's the deal. On long table shots I get down in my stance and basically adjust my head so that I can see the object ball. I do my warm-up strokes, set and then look at OB before my I start my backstroke. What I have been noticing lately is that the OB looks blurred and I think it's because my head is too low and my eyes are rolled to the top of my head...causing a blurred vision.

I just finished Randy G's pool school a couple weeks ago and thought I would video tape myself running the mother drills and then 10 racks of the Hopkins test (game). I notices at times (and most or the time on long shots where the CB is near the rail and the OB is a hanger at the opposite end of a 9ft table) that my head will come up about an inch or so. This is not during the stroke itself. It goes as follows. Warm-up storkes, set, head up, pause and then finish.

To me, it doesn't seem like it's interferring with my shot making, but at the same time, I want to correct any bad habits ASAP. Something came to mind while typing this post and I will have to review the tape again. I am wondering if after getting into my stance and and starting my warm-up strokes, my head is coming down....thus causing my head to come back up again to focus on the OB ball.......comfortably.

What do you think? Head up a bad thing?
Thanks,
Matt
Click to expand...

Matt,

Since Randy has not replied, I will share my experience at pool school with you. Randy actually added a head "nod" into my routine because I was getting too low. Specifically, my routine is get down, one "dance" stroke, head bob to look at the object ball, head down to look at cue ball, two practice strokes, set, head raise with my eyes going to the object ball, smooth back, pause and finish.
 
Pinocchio said:
Sounds like you've got a pretty good stroke!!!!!!!
Pinocchio
Click to expand...

I owe it all to Randy G. He showed me a lot of things, and can explain it to just about anyone. If you want a stepping stone to getting better more quickly, Randy can definitely increase your learning curve.
 
?????????????Shakes

I definitly lack skills. I've been playing since I was 12 an so far my high run in 9ball is a one-pack.I scratched on break in second rack think I got to excited. I am 63 yrs. old an plan on turning pro at 72. I know I have a lot of work to do but I practice about 2 hrs. daily. Who is Randy? Maybe Randy could get me over the hump. Thanks
Pinocchio
 
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If I'm not mistaken Scott is a disciple of Randy's and teaches along the same standard. I went to Randy's Pool School in Texas for a 3 day course, and it really helped me a lot. Let me know if you decide to go, I'd be happy to take the weekend off and go take a refresher course with you. (As long as it isn't the weekends of Sept 8th or 16th, I'll be in the Caymans.) Randy's website is http://www.poolschool.info/ . How did you like your lessons from Scott? I've been meaning to see when/if he might be coming through Mississippi.
 
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