Hen's teeth?

They are not fake so to speak.

That later keys that came with the locks had a number stamp. I don't remember the number but I do have a couple with number stamps. Most of my keys have no number.

All of the ones that I have seen that came with Fellini cases had no numbers.

But numerous case makers used those locks over the decades.

We may call them Fellini "style" locks, but It's George used them, Schon used them, Bill McDaniel used them, Engles used them, Thomas used them, McDermott used them, and more.

If you buy a new key off of ebay it came with a lock. He is selling each lock with a single key and I believe each lock came with two keys. That is how he has keys to sell...I believe...though I could be wrong.

So if you buy one of those keys it certainly did not come from a Fellini case, it came from the stock of locks purchased by Engles for his cases.

So...it isn't exactly "fake", it was intended to be used on a cue case, but never was. It is NOS.

Those locks have not been made in a long time. AFAIK there was only one manufacturer. Tooling up to make them is really probably prohibitively expensive unless you intend to buy a lot of them. John Barton would probably know more details about the history of the locks and the original manufacturer.

Those locks have been used on other things, like diaries and small jewlery type boxes. In addition, I am aware of at least one box style cue case with a different lock that used the identical key, probably that lock and key came from the same manufaturer.

If you look at GTF cases he used a different lock. AFAIK he intentionally did not use these locks so he would not be accused of trying to copy the original Fellini. Ron Thomas also used some of the locks like Barton used. They are similar to the Fellini type lock and are actually flute case locks believe it or not.

There is one seller online that has nothing to do with cue cases that has a stock of latches identical to the Fellini style locks but without a keyhole...they are latches only. I think they sell for about $6 to $9. I found them a few months ago whicle researching these locks. I do not know where that site is, I did not save it, but it was current and live at the time. They sell various locks and latches like for jewelry boxes.

So such a key isn't "fake" if you bought it on Ebay, but it didn't come with a Fellini.

I have the original key for the Fellini that came with my Joss. I have no reason to think it is "fake" as I got it with the cue and case in 1985. The cue and case at that time was indeed probaly around 8 to 10 years old. But there was no internet and no Ebay so it is unlikely that somebody sourced a replacement key for the case. I also have collected over the years about two dozen or so additional keys. I have found a couple at the bottom of cases using a bore scope. I have also found two Fellini labels at the bottom of cases using a bore scope. If you see a Fellini without a label, there is a chance the label is at the bottom of the case. So now you know one of the secrets. There has been a Fellini for sale here on AZB lately without a label. Did the seller check it with a bore scope? :rolleyes:

Is there a key at the bottom of your own Fellini case? Maybe...:wink:

So I wouldn't call the Ebay keys "fake", I would call them replacement keys.
.
 
Last edited:
Chopdoc said:
They are not fake so to speak.

That later keys that came with the locks had a number stamp. I don't remember the number but I do have a couple with number stamps. Most of my keys have no number.

All of the ones that I have seen that came with Fellini cases had no numbers.

But numerous case makers used those locks over the decades.

We may call them Fellini "style" locks, but It's George used them, Schon used them, Bill McDaniel used them, Engles used them, Thomas used them, McDermott used them, and more.

If you buy a new key off of ebay it came with a lock. He is selling each lock with a single key and I believe each lock came with two keys. That is how he has keys to sell...I believe...though I could be wrong.

So if you buy one of those keys it certainly did not come from a Fellini case, it came from the stock of locks purchased by Engles for his cases.

So...it isn't exactly "fake", it was intended to be used on a cue case, but never was. It is NOS.

Those locks have not been made in a long time. AFAIK there was only one manufacturer. Tooling up to make them is really probably prohibitively expensive unless you intend to buy a lot of them. John Barton would probably know more details about the history of the locks and the original manufacturer.

Those locks have been used on other things, like diaries and small jewlery type boxes. In addition, I am aware of at least one box style cue case with a different lock that used the identical key, probably that lock and key came from the same manufaturer.

If you look at GTF cases he used a different lock. AFAIK he intentionally did not use these locks so he would not be accused of trying to copy the original Fellini. Ron Thomas also used some of the locks like Barton used. They are similar to the Fellini type lock and are actually flute case locks believe it or not.

There is one seller online that has nothing to do with cue cases that has a stock of latches identical to the Fellini style locks but without a keyhole...they are latches only. I think they sell for about $6 to $9. I found them a few months ago whicle researching these locks. I do not know where that site is, I did not save it, but it was current and live at the time. They sell various locks and latches like for jewelry boxes.

So such a key isn't "fake" if you bought it on Ebay, but it didn't come with a Fellini.

I have the original key for the Fellini that came with my Joss. I have no reason to think it is "fake" as I got it with the cue and case in 1985. The cue and case at that time was indeed probaly around 8 to 10 years old. But there was no internet and no Ebay so it is unlikely that somebody sourced a replacement key for the case. I also have collected over the years about two dozen or so additional keys. I have found a couple at the bottom of cases using a bore scope. I have also found two Fellini labels at the bottom of cases using a bore scope. If you see a Fellini without a label, there is a chance the label is at the bottom of the case. So now you know one of the secrets. There has been a Fellini for sale here on AZB lately without a label. Did the seller check it with a bore scope? :rolleyes:

Is there a key at the bottom of your own Fellini case? Maybe...:wink:

So I wouldn't call the Ebay keys "fake", I would call them replacement keys.
.
Click to expand...

I spoke to another collector after posting and he said something similar.

Real keys made later in the lock production. Thinks the number may have been stamped by the manufacturer to indicate it's pairing to that style lock set.
 
skins said:
I spoke to another collector after posting and he said something similar.

Real keys made later in the lock production. Thinks the number may have been stamped by the manufacturer to indicate it's pairing to that style lock set.
Click to expand...

I believe that is the case. And it makes simple sense.


.
 
Chopdoc said:
They are not fake so to speak.

That later keys that came with the locks had a number stamp. I don't remember the number but I do have a couple with number stamps. Most of my keys have no number.

All of the ones that I have seen that came with Fellini cases had no numbers.

But numerous case makers used those locks over the decades.

We may call them Fellini "style" locks, but It's George used them, Schon used them, Bill McDaniel used them, Engles used them, Thomas used them, McDermott used them, and more.

If you buy a new key off of ebay it came with a lock. He is selling each lock with a single key and I believe each lock came with two keys. That is how he has keys to sell...I believe...though I could be wrong.

So if you buy one of those keys it certainly did not come from a Fellini case, it came from the stock of locks purchased by Engles for his cases.

So...it isn't exactly "fake", it was intended to be used on a cue case, but never was. It is NOS.

Those locks have not been made in a long time. AFAIK there was only one manufacturer. Tooling up to make them is really probably prohibitively expensive unless you intend to buy a lot of them. John Barton would probably know more details about the history of the locks and the original manufacturer.

Those locks have been used on other things, like diaries and small jewlery type boxes. In addition, I am aware of at least one box style cue case with a different lock that used the identical key, probably that lock and key came from the same manufaturer.

If you look at GTF cases he used a different lock. AFAIK he intentionally did not use these locks so he would not be accused of trying to copy the original Fellini. Ron Thomas also used some of the locks like Barton used. They are similar to the Fellini type lock and are actually flute case locks believe it or not.

There is one seller online that has nothing to do with cue cases that has a stock of latches identical to the Fellini style locks but without a keyhole...they are latches only. I think they sell for about $6 to $9. I found them a few months ago whicle researching these locks. I do not know where that site is, I did not save it, but it was current and live at the time. They sell various locks and latches like for jewelry boxes.

So such a key isn't "fake" if you bought it on Ebay, but it didn't come with a Fellini.

I have the original key for the Fellini that came with my Joss. I have no reason to think it is "fake" as I got it with the cue and case in 1985. The cue and case at that time was indeed probaly around 8 to 10 years old. But there was no internet and no Ebay so it is unlikely that somebody sourced a replacement key for the case. I also have collected over the years about two dozen or so additional keys. I have found a couple at the bottom of cases using a bore scope. I have also found two Fellini labels at the bottom of cases using a bore scope. If you see a Fellini without a label, there is a chance the label is at the bottom of the case. So now you know one of the secrets. There has been a Fellini for sale here on AZB lately without a label. Did the seller check it with a bore scope? :rolleyes:

Is there a key at the bottom of your own Fellini case? Maybe...:wink:

So I wouldn't call the Ebay keys "fake", I would call them replacement keys.
.
Click to expand...

This Viking case belonged to Omaha Fats / Marty Kaman.
We used to call him Fat Marty.
You can still see the 'Viking' name scratched into the brass.

The key is from the asshole in Tennessee.
For ten bucks I didn't even look at the seller, but it was a surprise to see Violet Hindman.
What bothers me about hangemhigh besides the obvious, is what a incredible hypocrite he was/is.


IMG_20171024_035609.jpg

IMG_20171024_040006.jpg
 
Asked if they were original. Response - "check auction". Posted a pic of a box with "PRESTOLOCK".
 
Last edited:
Chopdoc said:
They are not fake so to speak.

That later keys that came with the locks had a number stamp. I don't remember the number but I do have a couple with number stamps. Most of my keys have no number.

All of the ones that I have seen that came with Fellini cases had no numbers.

But numerous case makers used those locks over the decades.

We may call them Fellini "style" locks, but It's George used them, Schon used them, Bill McDaniel used them, Engles used them, Thomas used them, McDermott used them, and more.

If you buy a new key off of ebay it came with a lock. He is selling each lock with a single key and I believe each lock came with two keys. That is how he has keys to sell...I believe...though I could be wrong.

So if you buy one of those keys it certainly did not come from a Fellini case, it came from the stock of locks purchased by Engles for his cases.

So...it isn't exactly "fake", it was intended to be used on a cue case, but never was. It is NOS.

Those locks have not been made in a long time. AFAIK there was only one manufacturer. Tooling up to make them is really probably prohibitively expensive unless you intend to buy a lot of them. John Barton would probably know more details about the history of the locks and the original manufacturer.

Those locks have been used on other things, like diaries and small jewlery type boxes. In addition, I am aware of at least one box style cue case with a different lock that used the identical key, probably that lock and key came from the same manufaturer.

If you look at GTF cases he used a different lock. AFAIK he intentionally did not use these locks so he would not be accused of trying to copy the original Fellini. Ron Thomas also used some of the locks like Barton used. They are similar to the Fellini type lock and are actually flute case locks believe it or not.

There is one seller online that has nothing to do with cue cases that has a stock of latches identical to the Fellini style locks but without a keyhole...they are latches only. I think they sell for about $6 to $9. I found them a few months ago whicle researching these locks. I do not know where that site is, I did not save it, but it was current and live at the time. They sell various locks and latches like for jewelry boxes.

So such a key isn't "fake" if you bought it on Ebay, but it didn't come with a Fellini.

I have the original key for the Fellini that came with my Joss. I have no reason to think it is "fake" as I got it with the cue and case in 1985. The cue and case at that time was indeed probaly around 8 to 10 years old. But there was no internet and no Ebay so it is unlikely that somebody sourced a replacement key for the case. I also have collected over the years about two dozen or so additional keys. I have found a couple at the bottom of cases using a bore scope. I have also found two Fellini labels at the bottom of cases using a bore scope. If you see a Fellini without a label, there is a chance the label is at the bottom of the case. So now you know one of the secrets. There has been a Fellini for sale here on AZB lately without a label. Did the seller check it with a bore scope? :rolleyes:

Is there a key at the bottom of your own Fellini case? Maybe...:wink:

So I wouldn't call the Ebay keys "fake", I would call them replacement keys.
.
Click to expand...

Actually Doc, I see what you mean, and it may be a bit of semantics. What I meant was if a replacement key was somehow advertised as originally belonging to a Fellini case, then that is fake, or misleading, however you choose to put it.

I liken it to original equipment manufacturer (OEM) parts on a car for example. There are the OEM parts on the new car, there are OEM parts available for replacement, and there are aftermarket parts. If any aftermarket parts are marketed as OEM, that is fake, fraudulent, however you put it.

Also, no knock on aftermarket parts. However, they are not OEM, that is the key, no pun intended. Also, hard to tell who here thought they were getting a replacement/aftermarket key, and who thought they were getting original. Hope that explains what I was getting at.

All the best,
WW
 
Chopdoc said:
I get it. I wasn't trying to say you were wrong really. Indeed it is a bit of semantics as you say.:smile:
.
Click to expand...

No offense taken. As I always say, if you don't have the original article, you probably don't have the covenant keys. :wink:

All the best,
WW
 

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