how do i learn to win?

scottycoyote

scottycoyote

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
my game is pretty strong now, my poolschool techniques have become ingrained and im shooting really well pretty much all the time. But here lately Im playing good players and I cant seem to win. I break even or I lose. And it always comes down to little things, not controlling the table, shooting a bad safe and selling out. I guess what Im looking for is tips on how to get my game strong. I keep a pool diary and i jot down things i run into so i can practice later, but is that it? I mean do i have to just play and play and get the experience, or is there other things i can be doing? I consider myself a student of the game, i read all the books, watch the matches, watch the videos. I feel like if i could get my safety game up to par I would really book some winners, but i just havent seen much on that, i got buddy halls tape and he covers a few safes, and i got gradys tape but its more straight pool oriented. I guess I know the answer is practice and im frustrated, but there has to be some shortcuts out there. Anybody have a book or website that really helped their game that way?
 
scottycoyote said:
my game is pretty strong now, my poolschool techniques have become ingrained and im shooting really well pretty much all the time. But here lately Im playing good players and I cant seem to win. I break even or I lose. And it always comes down to little things, not controlling the table, shooting a bad safe and selling out. I guess what Im looking for is tips on how to get my game strong. I keep a pool diary and i jot down things i run into so i can practice later, but is that it? I mean do i have to just play and play and get the experience, or is there other things i can be doing? I consider myself a student of the game, i read all the books, watch the matches, watch the videos. I feel like if i could get my safety game up to par I would really book some winners, but i just havent seen much on that, i got buddy halls tape and he covers a few safes, and i got gradys tape but its more straight pool oriented. I guess I know the answer is practice and im frustrated, but there has to be some shortcuts out there. Anybody have a book or website that really helped their game that way?
Click to expand...

I feel like I'm in the same boat as you. Many of my matches are lost because of the little things (especially blown safeties). I guess you have to learn to not attempt low percentage run-outs. Giving up the table is difficult, though.
 
i know its frustrating aint it? I will be running out a rack,and there will be a ball thats not playable and I cant break it out, and i will play for what i think is position on a decent chance at a safe, and i end up blowing the safe and getting the ball out where its playable and my opponent runs out....arghhhhhhhhhh
 
Knowledge and logic.

scottycoyote said:
my game is pretty strong now, my poolschool techniques have become ingrained and im shooting really well pretty much all the time. But here lately Im playing good players and I cant seem to win. I break even or I lose. And it always comes down to little things, not controlling the table, shooting a bad safe and selling out. I guess what Im looking for is tips on how to get my game strong. I keep a pool diary and i jot down things i run into so i can practice later, but is that it? I mean do i have to just play and play and get the experience, or is there other things i can be doing? I consider myself a student of the game, i read all the books, watch the matches, watch the videos. I feel like if i could get my safety game up to par I would really book some winners, but i just havent seen much on that, i got buddy halls tape and he covers a few safes, and i got gradys tape but its more straight pool oriented. I guess I know the answer is practice and im frustrated, but there has to be some shortcuts out there. Anybody have a book or website that really helped their game that way?
Click to expand...


I'm afraid I don't think that there are any shortcuts per se.

I would have to talk to you for a while and judge what your knowledge of the game is to determine what you should work on especially if you're trying to get better at safeties. Safety play can be complex. You have to have an ability to control the CB first and foremost. If you seem to over shoot or undershoot the spot you're going for then you need to work on that. If you have trouble getting in the right line then you may need to work on your knowledge of the game. If you have trouble discerning what safety to go for or when to go for a safety, you're going to have to work on practicing and really looking at every shot. If you can't normally make a shot you're looking at 75-90% of the time, you need to look for a safe.(in 9ball)

In topnotch pool, you need to cut that down to 95%. Then when you see the safe you've got to determine what the likelihood of making the safe is and then determine which you want to go for. You should also look for two and three way shots if you can. Wht I mean by that is this.

A two way shot is to make the ball you're going for and get natural shape on the next shot. It can also be a safety that if hit by the opponent, has a good chance of leaving you an out.

A three way shot is a shot that not only gives you shape on the next shot, it also, if by chance you miss or rattle, leaves a safe for the opponent. I do this a lot and many times my opponent thinks I got lucky when I had planned it out in advance.

I'll often even take a lower percentage shot that is a three way than take a higher percentage shot that isn't.

If you don't understand what the tangent line is, how draw/follow changes the trajectory and how english changes the aim tangent, then you need to improve your knowledge of the game.

If you just have trouble locking up the speed control of the CB on your safeties, then you need to work on control.

If none of what I just said makes sense to you, then get a pro trainer or just play for fun and accept the level you play at now.
 
I've been working on a book manuscript about learning to play pool better in a practical, fun (not boring drills), efficient way. Since I don't think I'm going to be able to get it finished anytime real soon I wouldn't mind sending you a copy of what I got if you would cover the printing and shipping costs.

My manuscript has over 100 different pool games with rules and diagrams. The games were developed to really challenge a player and develop their skills. It also has listing of games by ability levels, difficulty, skills developed, number of players, ect..

Playing thru the games really helped me jump my game to the next level.

If you or anybody is interested please let me know.
 
Scott,

You and I talked a little bit in Charlotte, and I believe told you that I completely quit playing for 14 years? Well, after I started back, it really didn't take me long to learn how to play pool again. As a matter of fact, I started playing pretty well, then of course, let Randy G work me over to get my game and technique ironed out, sought aiming methods from Hal Houle, filled my brain with every bit of information I could, etc, etc, etc. All of that came pretty easy, since I had played since age 8. What ate my lunch was the mistakes that come from NOT knowing how to win. I'd blow last ball, or key ball, or blow an easy safety or miss a straight in shot that would have got the win for me.

Speaking as one of your instructors, there's nothing wrong with your fundamentals. You have a great stroke and you shoot pretty much down the center of the pocket, but learning to win is a whole different animal. I don't really know HOW I learned to win again, but it took me nearly a year after Pool School before I had the confidence in myself and my game to win again. Once that came, then I just relaxed and played pool. All the thinking stopped, all the worry stopped, all the fretting over a tough cut shot stopped, the concern about whether I would beat someone who played under me stopped. I just relaxed and shot pool. Then the wins just started coming. Many of them over players that I never had a chance against before.

I wish I could say "Hey, Scott, I've got this magic formula to get that mental side of the game dead on track", but I don't. All I know to tell you is relax, go through your preshot and shooting routines every time (eventually, you'll do them without thinking) and play pool. YOU STROKE WELL! YOU AIM WELL! Now, just let it happen and the magic will come out.

Later,
Bob
 
Winning ...

Winning is a mental state of mind. Playing good Pool
and being able to win are NOT the same thing. I was
probably played 20 years before I really learned how to
WIN. That means being able to play the smartest Pool
you can with what you have got to work with, shots,
safeties, strategy, and performance. Having the right
mindset will allow you to win even when the odds are
against you, be able to come back and win when opponent
is on the hill, knowing when to take a risk or not take a risk,
knowing that you are playing more like a professional because
of your decisions while playing.
Some safeties are natural to see and do, many others are not.
Practice safeties, practice on controlling cue ball for a safety,
including freezing the cue ball behind one of your balls.
Learn how to hit cue ball and make it go 1/2" forward to freeze
up, and 1" forward to freeze up.
THE ONLY WAY FOR A LESSOR PLAYER TO BEAT A BETTER
PLAYER IS WITH DEFENSE. Think about that some....
Your offense is not as good, is it? So, you have to create
chances by using defense that you would not have otherwise.
If your defense is not up to par, then how do you expect to
beat a better player? What does any good player do when
they are on the verge of being beat, they use defense to
get a chance to run out the next turn. Even the pros miss
kick shots sometimes, don't they? The song the Gambler has
some good lyrics in it ... lol
 
scottycoyote said:
my game is pretty strong now, my poolschool techniques have become ingrained and im shooting really well pretty much all the time. But here lately Im playing good players and I cant seem to win. I break even or I lose. And it always comes down to little things, not controlling the table, shooting a bad safe and selling out. I guess what Im looking for is tips on how to get my game strong. I keep a pool diary and i jot down things i run into so i can practice later, but is that it? I mean do i have to just play and play and get the experience, or is there other things i can be doing? I consider myself a student of the game, i read all the books, watch the matches, watch the videos. I feel like if i could get my safety game up to par I would really book some winners, but i just havent seen much on that, i got buddy halls tape and he covers a few safes, and i got gradys tape but its more straight pool oriented. I guess I know the answer is practice and im frustrated, but there has to be some shortcuts out there. Anybody have a book or website that really helped their game that way?
Click to expand...
I like that you said that you want to learn how to win. Instead of what do I do in this situation or how do I get better. Winning is what is about to me. When I first started playing pool I lost a lot before I started winning. When I lost I would replay certain situations in my head that I remembered from a certain game. Then I would shoot some balls around just practicing from these situations. I really think you have to put yourself under a lot of pressure early. Once you stop being nervous to close someone out, then you will win. I also read that you were playing better players. Thats good for your mental game as well. You may not win right now, but you will learn off of your mistakes.
 
wanna play got to hook them

i believe there is a nineball type game out there called you wanna play you got to hook them...maybe you want to win you have to hook them....also heard of a video with it...video comes from a player named tom bourdeaun... a player from wyoming.... if you find info this i think you could help out your safety game
 
I heard it was called Wanna Win Hook 'em. A safety nineball game. Helps quite a bit, but I can't really remember all the rules.:cool:
 
Three winning strategies

Here are some things to consider. I have not seen you're game, so I am only making some very general points, but I think these are common flaws and we are all guilty of them from time to time.

First, stay within yourself. Don't try to break and run a miracle rack. If the run requires several breakouts and you are not sure you will be able to get them, don't attempt them. Play position earlier on so you can lay down a nice safe instead. If you are aware of your limitations ahead of time, you can prepare so you are not faced with a do or die safety. Look for safeties before you are in defensive position.

Second, stay aggressive. I find that a lot of safeties are blown because, once a player is faced with a safety they often loose their aggressiveness. Instead of trying to nail the safety, they find themselves trying not to miss it. This anxiety causes tension will often cause a slight deceleration in stroke. This is subtle, but it wreaks havoc on your position. Try to stay aggressive and stroke through even the softest of safeties. Take a deep breath and make sure you are positively committed to making a good stroke no matter how soft.

Lastly, and most importantly, stay positive! Winning is 100% mental. You must visualize winning. That’s obvious, but when faced with an out you feel you should get, take this tip. Don’t think “I am supposed to get out here”, instead think “I am going to steal this win!”. The difference is in the attitude. If you phrase your self-talk as “I am supposed to get out” the tendancy is to fear failure. You don’t want to miss an out that is well within your ability. By phrasing it instead as “I am going to steal this win” you present yourself with a challenge. This should aid you in staying focused. Think about how sweet the victory will be, and see yourself getting it. Always watch the table and anticipate your opponents mistakes. If they error, and you are expecting it you have a much better mindset to steal the win. If their error catches you by surprise the tendancy is to just get up their and shoot without properly analyzing the situation.

I hope these tips remind you of some things you already knew.
 
scottycoyote said:
How do I learn to win?
Click to expand...

You can take the approach of one poster in particular (we won't mention his name, but it implies that he can't play like he used to) and just match up like a locksmith. It's tough to lose those games. ;)
 
Learning to win isn't half as difficult as learning not to lose.

There is no cookie cutter answer to this question. I had a lot of materal available at my web site, but I have taken it down. I will post some book excerpts and articles on this subject from time to time, and don't hesitate to get with me via e-mail blkjackds12@yahoo.com - my number is in my profile. Not trying to sell you anything, free material, priceless returns.
 
Scott,
There are some good tid-bits in all the answers above. But the bottom line is you learn to win by winning. I had a guy on the tour whose goal was to get in the money. He got in the money, but never first place. That wasn't his goal, so he had little chance. Make winning your goal...but not the whole tournament. Make winning EVERY GAME your goal. If you win 7-1 in a race to 7, ask yourself what you could have done better. When you bring it down to winning games, tournaments will happen. And you win games by making the right shots. I know you have the skill to make shots, and control the cue ball. What is going through your head when you are at ball address? Is it all about the shot at hand, or are thoughts of "If I win this match, I have a chance of getting in the money."?
Plan your shot in your head, Line it up, Warm it up, and make the shot. Anything else going through your head is just getting in your way.
We will talk at length the next time we get together.
Steve
 
You don't learn to win or Lose - But You can develop The Three C's.

THE THREE C's

"Concentration - Confidence - Consistency"!

You can get better by playing better & better players and you can learn not to lose by pure pain and agony (IF YOUR NOT A DYED IN THE WOOL SUCKER) - Some people are you know! But most of them are now at the Casinos.

TY & GL
 
alot of you guys have some excellent points, and thanks to Bob and Steve my poolschool gurus especially, you guys really help my confidence level. Schypda had a really good point i hadnt thought about, he said sometimes with a safety you hesitate a little bit because you are scared of blowing it and thats exactly what i do! Im going to try to be as aggressive with those as i am with the rest of my game and see how it works for me.
And yeah seems like i remember a safety game too, i believe you just break and play like 9ball but the object was to safe your opponent as many times as possible. Ive tried it before, its hard to find someone who wants to play that lol, guess that will be a practice time thing.
thanks again for all the input
 
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