how do you personally get the momentum back?

scottycoyote

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
it happened last night.....I was matched up with probably our best local player, getting the called 8 and the breaks, and the first 2 sets im just running over him, running out racks, my breaks working good......i didnt need the spot and we are both shooting really well but the tables just going my way.
Then about the 3rd set....i can feel it....things are changing. Im breaking and making a ball but im sewn up and have to push or kick.....it seems like i get to the table with impossible runouts, he comes to the table and its connect the dots. Next thing i know we are back to dead even. I started trying different things.......not breaking as hard so i dont leave such wide open tables.......getting more defensive, getting more offensive.....but i just couldnt seem to turn it around.
Do any of you guys have tricks or strategies you use when you feel a set turn on you like this......my shooting was still on but it was like my luck turned off.
 
scottycoyote said:
it happened last night.....I was matched up with probably our best local player, getting the called 8 and the breaks, and the first 2 sets im just running over him, running out racks, my breaks working good......i didnt need the spot and we are both shooting really well but the tables just going my way.
Then about the 3rd set....i can feel it....things are changing. Im breaking and making a ball but im sewn up and have to push or kick.....it seems like i get to the table with impossible runouts, he comes to the table and its connect the dots. Next thing i know we are back to dead even. I started trying different things.......not breaking as hard so i dont leave such wide open tables.......getting more defensive, getting more offensive.....but i just couldnt seem to turn it around.
Do any of you guys have tricks or strategies you use when you feel a set turn on you like this......my shooting was still on but it was like my luck turned off.

No tricks (would be nice if life was that simple), just go back to that moment when things did seem to change, within that moment lies the answer. The proofs in the pudding and you were doing well........ then changed your winning ways why, because you thought it should be your way, maybe look at your pride. Its like the poster that said when there opponent leaves the chalk upside down how it bothers them, thats a choice one makes, its kinda funny the posting was called "Chalk Talk", I could just see the irony of it, the chalk was talking inside the posters head. A favorite attitude saying I have, is the glass half full or half empty, I say hell know its just laying on its side. :D
 
scottycoyote said:
it happened last night.....I was matched up with probably our best local player, getting the called 8 and the breaks, and the first 2 sets im just running over him, running out racks, my breaks working good......i didnt need the spot and we are both shooting really well but the tables just going my way.
Then about the 3rd set....i can feel it....things are changing. Im breaking and making a ball but im sewn up and have to push or kick.....it seems like i get to the table with impossible runouts, he comes to the table and its connect the dots. Next thing i know we are back to dead even. I started trying different things.......not breaking as hard so i dont leave such wide open tables.......getting more defensive, getting more offensive.....but i just couldnt seem to turn it around.
Do any of you guys have tricks or strategies you use when you feel a set turn on you like this......my shooting was still on but it was like my luck turned off.

There was no luck - as in "chance" - involved. You did all those marvelous things early in the set. But you didn't pay attention to what you did because you thought "luck" was doing it. So, you stopped doing what worked and could not remember what worked in order to return to doing it.

Pay attention, always! Then, if things suddenly stop going your way, recall and do what worked.
 
scottycoyote said:
it happened last night.....I was matched up with probably our best local player, getting the called 8 and the breaks, and the first 2 sets im just running over him, running out racks, my breaks working good......i didnt need the spot and we are both shooting really well but the tables just going my way.
Then about the 3rd set....i can feel it....things are changing. Im breaking and making a ball but im sewn up and have to push or kick.....it seems like i get to the table with impossible runouts, he comes to the table and its connect the dots. Next thing i know we are back to dead even. I started trying different things.......not breaking as hard so i dont leave such wide open tables.......getting more defensive, getting more offensive.....but i just couldnt seem to turn it around.
Do any of you guys have tricks or strategies you use when you feel a set turn on you like this......my shooting was still on but it was like my luck turned off.

Ask him if he inhales or exhales on the final stroke. ;) Just kidding, I'd like to know the answer also.

Tracy
 
The best way ...

to beat a player that is on full bore, is to make his break stop working for him... I am not going to discuss details of that, but that is the best way to start changing 'the tide'. When 2 world beaters play each other, the winner will be the best racker or breaker, which ever side you want to look at it with.

Anther point is, you may have changed something without being aware of it. Even if you don't, that is just Pool. The tide can and will change over a playing session. Playing Pool isn't just about finding out what works, it's abouit knowing what works at the given time per the table conditions, the environment you're in, and per your opponent.

To paraphrase Sun Tzu (The Art of War):

If you know yourself well, you will win some of your matches.
If you know your opponent well, you will win half of your matches.
If you know both yourself and opponent well, you will win most of your matches.

In other words, it is about preparation to play a match BEFORE you embark upon playing it. That emcompasses a lot. You ever heard the term, "There is more to Pool, than just knowing how to make a shot".
 
Slow the pace of the game down...turn the game into a defensive battle...dont let him/her shoot...this will normally cool the heat and allow you to have a chance to swing the momentum your direction.
 
bomber said:
Slow the pace of the game down...turn the game into a defensive battle...dont let him/her shoot...this will normally cool the heat and allow you to have a chance to swing the momentum your direction.

ill have to try that next time...........and scott......yeah thats kind of what i was thinking.........we were both shooting pretty even......things went my way for awhile then things went his way for awhile. I was getting tired so i stopped after the 4th set.........things might have been about to swing back my way who knows.
 
scottycoyote said:
it happened last night.....I was matched up with probably our best local player, getting the called 8 and the breaks, and the first 2 sets im just running over him, running out racks, my breaks working good......i didnt need the spot and we are both shooting really well but the tables just going my way.
Then about the 3rd set....i can feel it....things are changing. Im breaking and making a ball but im sewn up and have to push or kick.....it seems like i get to the table with impossible runouts, he comes to the table and its connect the dots. Next thing i know we are back to dead even. I started trying different things.......not breaking as hard so i dont leave such wide open tables.......getting more defensive, getting more offensive.....but i just couldnt seem to turn it around.
Do any of you guys have tricks or strategies you use when you feel a set turn on you like this......my shooting was still on but it was like my luck turned off.

------------------
I will occasionally take a break when things are not going my way. Maybe wash my face, get a drink of water. Let my opponent cool off.
JoeyA
 
THE EBB AND FLOW OF THE BIG "MO"

Momentum is a frickin fickle friend!...:D I do try to notice the swings during a match, especially when I'm sitting in the electric chair. When I'm ahead I might shoot a little lower % shot to twist the knife, when behind, a tight safety might just get me an easy out to swing things back my way. I NEVER try to alter my normal pace of play because that can cause more harm than good. If you can easily change your pace then fine, if not I wouldn't.

Try to keep track of a few things to help with Mo swings like:

when and what did you eat last?

where's your energy level?

what do you feel like that given day?

what kind of player are you playing?...fast starter then fades?...neutral?...ramps up as you go?

these are just a few, but no 2 situations are the same, so pay close attention to some of the outside influences that we all forget at times...good luck

Gerry
 
WildECoyote, when the roadrunners beating ya down and your standing there with the ACME anvil about to drop on your head don't despare.. If you take my advice and it works I expect a small commission check in the mail at some point in the future. ;) :D

Now I've been critisized on here for my viewpoints on here in the past for two things in particular with regards to gambling. So I've been a little hesitant to put anything on here that might be "controversial" but being that (If I'm reading this right) some people implied that you should flat shit rack the guy if things are going down hill, I figure the critizers will probably go after them before me..

In the situation that you just described above, I read it as your playing "the best player around" with the 8 ball and at some point you "didn't need the spot" becuase you were killing him and all of a sudden the tides changed.

So there's alot of different angles we can approach this with.. When you were beating the guy there's a chance you were playing "Over your head." By that I mean better then your average game. Or there's a chance that he was playing Below his average game, where you would've beat him with or without the spot. We could go on with all the mumbo jumbo all day long on the psychology of the set itself, and whether or not it was you that lost the edge, or him that caught a gear (which I hope this thread does get into later becuase I find that kinda stuff purely fascinating) but lets focus on some simple things to just kinda turn the tide in the middle of a set.

As someone said it before change the rack.. Now I'm not a big believer in shit racking, point in fact if I'm playing sets and I accidentally shit rack a guy and they break funny I'm always the 1st to offer to rerack and let them break again. As a machinist though I am a believer in "margin of error" or "tolerances" LOL.. So lets focus on some basic racking tricks.

Your playing cheap and your plaing all day. Realize that the "spot" on the table is about an inch long.. You control where the rack sits on that spot. Typically if it's sitting with the 1 ball dead center thats where it "should" be. But if you push it forward to where the apex of the one is meeting the front of that spot it's within "tolerance." Players will usually say something if you go towards the back of the spot, but amazingly will almost never say something if you go forward with it.

Pay attention to where you rack.. Typically (It's amazing) if you actually just sat there and racked and measured where YOU put them, you'd be amazed at how close the repeatabillity of where YOU put it is.. Your opponent has now developed a break based upon that baseline. When your racking, your all of a sudden having trouble getting the balls to settle (if ya know what I'm saying) and adjust the rack forward a hair (A hair can = up to a half an inch, but usually a 1/4 inch is fine).. or Back a hair, doesn't matter just don't keep putting it in the same spot. Unless you find one that's working for you (not him)

Now onto some more things.. Most players when they are racking will take the two balls below the wing balls and rotate them into the rack to get the rack tight. Reverse the rotation of those two balls. You want to push them into the rack same as you always do, but rotate them out and away from the rack, this will cause them to settle in just a slightly different spot. Goto a pool hall and rack both ways and break the same way, and you'll see what I'm saying. They break considerably different. People might argue that this isn't going to do shit for you. Even if it's on some mental level that you feel your gaining an edge and that's it, that helps..

Alot of players will grab the one stick it in the front of the rack, and random balls everywhere with the 9 in the middle. What they don't realize is in alot of cases on a more subconscious level they are actually sticking a few balls in the same place in the rack everytime. Again rack a rack the same way a few times, and watch where the balls go. When you get a feel for where their going, adjust the balls in the rack to make it more suited to you. Going to be playing defense? Then rack the 2 in the front the 3 in the back corner, the 5 on the tail, the 6 in the front etc.. Offense? (run out game) etc.. etc..

The most obvious, but also one of the most effective is to change the tempo of the game. Speeding up rarely works as the slower player is generally controlling the "tempo" of the game. Slow it down a click, and once you get back in the groove, but throw them off kilter so to speak then return back to the normal tempo of the game.

There's age old sharking tricks (see sharking thread) but if you save it for emergencies only (as in the keyball in the rack in every 2nd or 3rd game) if you do the ole stare in the whites of there eyes when their shooting you'd be amazed at how often it works. Again not in their line of sight, but periferral vision. I firmly believe that this works on a subconscious level. Think about it, you can almost "feel" somebody staring at you even if you can't see them.

When all hell is breaking loose though and your falling apart at the seems.. The all time smartest move you can do is go to the bathroom, throw a little water on your face and calm down. Realize it's just a game and not the end of the world at the end of the day, and come up with some mantra that works for you. Repeat it into the mirror once or twice and now that your cool, calm and collected (and dry.. don't want to walk out looking like your sweating bullets) return. Sometimes even a 1 minute break can mean the difference between choking it up, or running em out. As far as Mantra's don't use anything "negative." I've read that your subconscious DOES NOT understand negatives.. I.E. If you say "Don't screw this up" your subconscious says "Screw this up." So becareful with your wording, especially if your one of those "having a conversation in your head while your shooting" type of players. Use phrases like "this is easy" in your head while shooting on 9 balls. The mantra in the bathroom, well you know yourself better then anyone else soooo, use your best judgement. Some suggestions though "I'm better then this guy, and I'm going to take every damn penny he's got on him, and then buy his girl drinks with his money." LOL.. I'm joking but seriously, just say whatever it's gonna take for you to realize that YOU ARE IN CONTROL OF YOUR OWN DESTINY on a pool table. Unless the guy is ridiculously better then you (which it doesn't sound like he is) then your losing on your mistakes, not on his unbelievable skill. Limit the mistakes, and make him have a few of his own.

Hope that helps, if nothing else atleast you know your not alone.. LOL

DJ
 
thanks dj.......excellent post lots of good stuff for people to think about.

Ok first off yall missed the part where i said i was getting the called 8 AND THE BREAKS lol..........so i couldnt change the rack on him..and he was giving me good racks. But yeah dj you have good points, ive done some reading on the rack and i do pay attention to how the balls are racked and where.......changing it around, etc

Also when i said i didnt need the spot.....i just meant i was running out and the spot wasn't making any difference in the games, i was shooting really well and running to the 8, could have run to the 9, wants combo'ing the 8 or making it on the break, but i didnt give the spot up.

And i wasnt shooting over my head and he wasnt shooting bad, or caught a gear later.........the whole game just changed. The first 2 sets id break......make a ball......nice pattern and id runout. Or We would trade safeties and id come out on top with a nice table to work with. Then it was like someone threw a switch.......id make something on the break but the rack was impossible, or i was hooked......or id have a super tough safety to try....it was always something in my way. On the flip side now he always seemed to have the nice tables......all stop shot runouts, etc.....it was just a complete 180 from the first 2 sets.
I tried breaking different, i tried going for more shots...more safes......nothing seemed to help.
Next time I think i will try messing with the tempo some, maybe taking the bathroom break, i dont know......Im just looking for something I can pull out of my bag of tricks when i feel this swing of momentum coming on. Maybe its inevitable with a closely matched game, i dunno. But our games remained the same throughout......it just seemed like what we had to work with got flipflopped.
 
I like what bomber said. The first thing I do is actively decide that I'm not going to let the other guy have control anymore. The guy who has the control is going to win. You want to be the person pushing the other guy around. Here's an example from a tournament I played in last week.

First round of a handicapped 9-ball tournament, I have a bye and so I'm watching my buddy play his match, because I'm going to play the winner. My buddy is a 4+1, opponent is a 5. This means they play 4 games to 6. Mr. Opponent is playing incredibly well for a 5. He is running out what seems like every time he gets a shot. My buddy got pretty spooked, couldn't shoot, ended up losing 6-0.

Now, I'm sitting here watching this. My friend doesn't play that much worse than I do (we got eachother into the game), but I'm a 5, 2 spots higher than him. So, I get no handicap against Mr. Opponent. I had just sat and watched this guy crush my friend, and I'm a bit spooked too! So right off the bat, this guy is kicking my butt around the table. I managed to get one game, and the score was 1-3. The guy was still running everything out. At this point, I realized what was happening. I realized that I had given him control ever since the score was 2-0 in my friend's match! So, I decide that this guy is going to go into the vice. I stopped trying to run out. That's the most important thing, read it again. Stop trying to run out. Start playing safe. Safe, Safe, Safe. Play safeties until you _know_ you can run out. Run two balls and duck. Set yourself up so that when the guy finally misses that kick, you can get out. And, if you get ball in hand, and can't get out, run 1 or 2 more balls, and duck again. This shortens the runs you need to make to actually win the game also, which results in you feeling like you're more in stroke. Now you _know_ you can run these 3 balls, now you _know_ you can run 4 balls again, etc...

I can't tell you how well this strategy has worked for me. It's helped me beat a master level player, and another player who I had to spot two games to. She got to the hill first (2 playing to 3, I was going to 5) while I was at 1 game. It was for 1st place, so there was some pressure.:)

The other thing I do when I'm trying to get my momentum back is to Shut Up. Stop talking, stop joking around with your friends, stop complimenting the guy when he makes a great shot. This seems to ensure that I'm concentrating on the right things when I get to the table.
 
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That is great advise aresnius. (What's the screen name mean?)

By playing safes you are in fact taking back control of the game (unless of course your playing a guy that can kick in balls like a mule, but that's rare.)

Another thing not really mentioned is in aresnius's story the opponent was in control and he took it back. If your playing someone that is better then you, you can actually "break them down" pretty quicly with safety play. If you really want to "F" with a guy even if you have an out and ball in hand.. If there's a safety to be had (the "jail" kind where Efren is 50/50 on it) then lock em up again just to do it.. LOL I'm no psychologist, but you've heard of the sales techniques where you get a guy saying yes all the time, then when it's time to buy they are more likely to say "yes." Get a guy coming up to the table and failing his objectives everytime, and he's more apt to continue failing. I.E. Breaking them down.

DJ
 
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