How handicaps match up?

weakfingers

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Let's say we're talking about 9 and 10 ball handicaps here; I'm playing a weaker opponent in a race to 7.

What would you consider a greater spot: giving him the 8/9 ball or two games on the wire? How do these handicaps match up in your mind, what makes you spot games rather than balls, or vice versa?
 
Let's say we're talking about 9 and 10 ball handicaps here; I'm playing a weaker opponent in a race to 7.

What would you consider a greater spot: giving him the 8/9 ball or two games on the wire? How do these handicaps match up in your mind, what makes you spot games rather than balls, or vice versa?

It depends on the level of the two players. A C player giving a D player the 8 is a huge spot. A top player giving another top player the 8 is almost no spot at all.
 
If you both play well and can run out on a regular basis, then the 8 ball is no spot, compared to the 2 games.

On the other hand if you both get 4-5 shots a game then the 8 ball is going to be a huge spot and probably worth more to the guy getting weight.
 
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I've played in leagues with that used both handicaps (balls or games). The beginner-intermediate league use the ball handicap, while the intermediate-advanced league spot games on the wire. 80% percent of the beginner league would be graded in as D,D+ in the advanced league.
 
The only way to find out is to bet 1000 a set each way :grin::grin::grin: Let us know the results.

and stream it so we can get in on the action!

Of course the level of the players is key, I always like to give odds on the money, or a ball spot. Giving games?....nah, you can never get them back once they are gone!.....make them win each game.
 
Handicap Guide

Is there a guide for ball handicapping? I play in some local weekly tournaments and the rate A to D- but I would like to know how they come up with the handicap such as the wild 8 or called 8 or breaks. Is there a chart some place that shows this. I just want to be sure they are not pulling it out of the air or some other dark place and are consistent.
 
Let's say we're talking about 9 and 10 ball handicaps here; I'm playing a weaker opponent in a race to 7.

What would you consider a greater spot: giving him the 8/9 ball or two games on the wire? How do these handicaps match up in your mind, what makes you spot games rather than balls, or vice versa?

This is a relative question. Are you a high A/open player giving a low to mid A player a spot, are you a low A giving a B player a spot, are you a B giving a C a spot? etc.

Think of it kinda like a sliding scale. If both players play fairly close(in the case of just giving 1 ball) and both players playing at a high B/low A speed or better, balls become negligible and games on the wire become a huge spot.

Conversely the lower cumulative level you both play, spotting balls becomes a huge spot.

Basically if your opponent is a skilled player, games on the wire become a huge spot compared to a ball.
 
It depends on the level of the two players. A C player giving a D player the 8 is a huge spot. A top player giving another top player the 8 is almost no spot at all.

This means that the table also has a large effect on the weight of a ball spot. I've played on tables where very few people could run out at nine ball.
 
This is a relative question. Are you a high A/open player giving a low to mid A player a spot, are you a low A giving a B player a spot, are you a B giving a C a spot? etc.

Think of it kinda like a sliding scale. If both players play fairly close(in the case of just giving 1 ball) and both players playing at a high B/low A speed or better, balls become negligible and games on the wire become a huge spot.

Conversely the lower cumulative level you both play, spotting balls becomes a huge spot.

Basically if your opponent is a skilled player, games on the wire become a huge spot compared to a ball.

This makes sense. I guess you really have to factor in a lot of things before offering a spot. I always saw spotting balls to be a huge factor especially in long races since they're constant and remain throughout the entire match, whereas in games, you can catch up and make it even, etc.

I'd call myself a B player; where I play in my college pool room we've got maybe a few Cs and mostly D+s and such, so I'd want to give enough weight where the match is fair; I didn't know how these things matched up. Interesting stuff. :)
 
This makes sense. I guess you really have to factor in a lot of things before offering a spot. I always saw spotting balls to be a huge factor especially in long races since they're constant and remain throughout the entire match, whereas in games, you can catch up and make it even, etc.

I'd call myself a B player; where I play in my college pool room we've got maybe a few Cs and mostly D+s and such, so I'd want to give enough weight where the match is fair; I didn't know how these things matched up. Interesting stuff. :)

Just tinker with the spot. Most people aren't really looking for "fair" games, they are always trying to get the edge over one another.

But, for a spot to be truly fair, you should have a lot of break even sessions. Or if they aren't break even, the games/races you play after you adjust the spot should be even.

Example: game is 9 ball. player X gives player Y the 8 ball. Player Y loses 3 sets. They adjust the spot to the 7 and 8 ball. Player Y wins 3 sets and is even. (now, don't let someone trap you and say "but we played all night and we're even) This is NOT an even spot likely. Now player X adjusts and gives only the 7 to player Y. The sets go back and forth, on any given day, one player wins a set or two.

This is an example of a fair handicap. In most pool rooms player X is going to argue for just the 8 and player Y is going to argue for the 7 and the 8, when in fact the fair spot is the 7, which neither player wants to do, because they break even a lot.

Depending on the gap in skill level I've also seen combination of games on the wire and balls spotted, but to do this you really need to be playing at a high A or open class speed.

I'd suggest making some stipulations. Such as: giving your opponent the 8 and agreeing once someone wins X amount of sets or games, you readjust. Stipulate either you will give them the 7 or X amount of games on the wire if you win, and you have to adjust to play even if you lose. The stipulation would be in play for every time someone gets ahead X number of sets or games with a given spot.

So if you give him X spot and win X number of sets, you adjust, if you win another X number of games with that spot, you adjust......etc etc

I won't play if someone isn't willing to continually adjust until we are playing back and forth. If they aren't willing to adjust the spot, they are obviously just looking for free money.
 
Lol

It depends on whether you are just looking for competition or if you are trying to make some money. If the latter, then you don't ever give up more than you have to, to get the game in the first place. If you do, you are not a very good gambler. And for what it is worth, everyone is looking for free money when they gamble, just depends on whether they are looking for a little or a lot.

I don't adjust after every set, that is for suckers. The initial negoitation is important. It is going off how well your opponent evaluated your game, how well you evaluated their game, and how much the bet is. A lot of players play great for $5 or $10 a game, but start to crumple when the bet is $100 or more a set. And how many players do you play where they consistently make the same mistakes over and over again to where you count on it when playing them, like taking low percentage shots vs a high percentage safety, or they make a mistake on the 1 ball after the break if they don't really have a good shot, like shooting at the 1 when they would be much better off pushing out.

All I can say is I am looking to win when I play an opponent, I am not looking to tie or lose, and I will do what is necessary to maximize my chances.
 
It depends on whether you are just looking for competition or if you are trying to make some money. If the latter, then you don't ever give up more than you have to, to get the game in the first place. If you do, you are not a very good gambler. And for what it is worth, everyone is looking for free money when they gamble, just depends on whether they are looking for a little or a lot.

I don't adjust after every set, that is for suckers. The initial negoitation is important. It is going off how well your opponent evaluated your game, how well you evaluated their game, and how much the bet is. A lot of players play great for $5 or $10 a game, but start to crumple when the bet is $100 or more a set. And how many players do you play where they consistently make the same mistakes over and over again to where you count on it when playing them, like taking low percentage shots vs a high percentage safety, or they make a mistake on the 1 ball after the break if they don't really have a good shot, like shooting at the 1 when they would be much better off pushing out.

All I can say is I am looking to win when I play an opponent, I am not looking to tie or lose, and I will do what is necessary to maximize my chances.

Reading comprehension isn't your strong point eh?

He said he wanted to make the game as fair as possible. And no one made a mention of adjusting every set.
 
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