I'd like to know your thoughts on Viking Cues

[California Fats]

I have a Viking from 2006 that I absolutely love. I only recently bought a new cue for 2 reasons. The first, I didn't take care of it, so it got pretty beat up, and second reason was to get something that fit my style a little more. I have no complaints whatsoever about it though.

 

[DAVE_M]

I should have stipulated that I welcome you to try a new one, with the new LD shaft. As someone with prior experience playing a Viking, your feedback on the newer cues would be beneficial to us all.

Webb's Billiards Supply
sales@webbsbilliardssupply.com
Facebook.com/webbsbilliardssupply

He was questioning how many cues Viking sells, not how many you sell. He wasn't concerned with trying a new one or a new low deflection shaft.

To add to this threads quality and stay on topic. The vikings I have played with hit like no other. I won't compare cues, but it's worth it for anyone to try one out.

 

[dr9ball]

I personally find the trend towards rubber grips and leather wraps to be sad. I love the feel of well pressed irish linen.

To each their own. I have a high preference for leather or lizard.

 

[nobcitypool]

Oh I get it.....

A thinly veiled sales/PR thread.

Didn't see that one coming.

And what's wrong with that, it would make him one of MANY. LOL I'm not sure what kind of deal he is offering but if a number of AZ'ers can get a discount deal on a nice cue, more power to the guy. He's taking a bit of a risk, he's laying it on the line by having the confidence of putting together a deal and then actively asking for people to come back here and provide honest feedback. Sure would be great for AZ'ers if more pool suppliers did the same thing here.

Production cues shouldn't have a negative stigma. A 4 axis machining process was mentioned. Not many makers can afford that kind of capital investment. Production cue makers can because they have the volume to amortize the cost. The main advantages of a custom cue are (1) Theoretically, you can have the cue designed to your specifications; (2) You get to own a "one of a kind" cue; (3) Assuming it is a "bigger name" cue maker, it will likely hold it's value and even appreciate in value over time. However, when it comes to that mystical playability, many of the production cues play great.

I have the good fortune to afford some nice cues - Kikel, Barenbrugge, Hunter, Josey and Durbin. I recently acquired a Joss in a trade. I was blown away by how well the Joss plays. The balance was just incredible, as someone put it, it seems to float in your hands.

Thanks to Webb Billiards for supporting your product and offering some AZ'ers a good deal. I wish you and Viking great success with your AMERICAN made products.

 

[Donny Lutz]

I used this in the early 80's. Loved mine! It's a model Z90 or N160 not sure?

My second cue, purchased around 1973, was just like yours, only a kind of pastel lavendar rather than brown. Used it with some success for about eight years. Wish I still had that one. I think it was the Z90 precursor that appeared in the 1978 catalog.

 

[JB Cases]

And what's wrong with that, it would make him one of MANY. LOL I'm not sure what kind of deal he is offering but if a number of AZ'ers can get a discount deal on a nice cue, more power to the guy. He's taking a bit of a risk, he's laying it on the line by having the confidence of putting together a deal and then actively asking for people to come back here and provide honest feedback. Sure would be great for AZ'ers if more pool suppliers did the same thing here.

Production cues shouldn't have a negative stigma. A 4 axis machining process was mentioned. Not many makers can afford that kind of capital investment. Production cue makers can because they have the volume to amortize the cost. The main advantages of a custom cue are (1) Theoretically, you can have the cue designed to your specifications; (2) You get to own a "one of a kind" cue; (3) Assuming it is a "bigger name" cue maker, it will likely hold it's value and even appreciate in value over time. However, when it comes to that mystical playability, many of the production cues play great.

I have the good fortune to afford some nice cues - Kikel, Barenbrugge, Hunter, Josey and Durbin. I recently acquired a Joss in a trade. I was blown away by how well the Joss plays. The balance was just incredible, as someone put it, it seems to float in your hands.

Thanks to Webb Billiards for supporting your product and offering some AZ'ers a good deal. I wish you and Viking great success with your AMERICAN made products.

Tell you what, back when I was coming up a lot of the top players from up north came down to Florida with Joss cues. All of us would have given a nut to play with a Joss after we tried them. Joss and Schon were THE cues in the 80s and 90s for a lot of us.

Eventually I did get my Joss, I had a few of them, and they play every bit as good as any cue made in that you CAN get the cash using one. A Joss does everything you ask of it. I would probably be willing to give up a nut right now to get my last Joss back. It was extra special and I was extra stupid to ever sell it.

 

[Patrick Johnson]

JB Cases:
If you think that there isn't such a thing as playability then you ought to be able to shoot equally well with any pool cue.

Any one that I'm accustomed to, yes.

pj
chgo

 

[JB Cases]

Any one that I'm accustomed to, yes.

pj
chgo

Then you would be willing to gamble for say $5000 against a player of equal ability if I gave you a day to practice with the cue I provided on the stipulation that you were not allowed to make any modification beyond dressing the tip?

The cue would of course be the same general specifications as what cue makers would use for the descriptions of their cues. Leather tip, maple shaft, plastic ferrule, tapered from 12-13mm at the top to about 1.125" at the bottom, rubber bumper, wrap, not doctored in any way, simply a cue that's purchased off the shelf from a retail store and not opened until you first touch it.

Is 24 hours enough time for you to get accustomed? Although I don't understand why you need to get accustomed if you do not believe in differing degrees of "playability".

Of course it could just be that word, so let's stick to performance. Surely you believe that cues have differing levels of performance when used to do the same task. That should be self evident by the existence of deflection and shafts with differing degrees of deflection.

 

[Patrick Johnson]

JB Cases:
Then you would be willing to gamble for say $5000...

LOL

What I'm not willing to do is join in one of your obsessive nitpicking "debates" about nothing. Bring it down to something like rational conversation or take it up with somebody else.

pj
chgo

 

[sfleinen]

Kind of late to this thread, but one of my most favorite cues is a Viking G-01 that I acquired a couple years ago from an Ozone Billiards "American-made cues 4th of July sale." I was in need of a decent wrapless cue, at an inexpensive price, to "bounce around with" (i.e. a traveling league that was a "for fun" league that had more social than competitive aspect to it). That is, a cue that plays very well, but if it became banged up or whatever, it wouldn't irk me.

When it finally arrived and I opened the box, I was blown away by the quality of cue inside. I couldn't believe the quality of the G-01 -- and this was the entry-level of Viking's line. The balance was perfect, the finish was perfect, the taper was wonderful -- all in all, the cue *felt* like a weapon in my hands. And that cue lasted through all the rough treatment without a scratch.

I'm not fond of the Viking quick-release joint, but it definitely does the job, and better -- it results in a wood-to-wood joint, which is a plus, hit-wise, for me. And, it appears Viking's "proprietary" quick-release joint is not a show-stopper for after-market shafts, like Tiger or OB (both companies offer their shafts with the Viking quick-release joint).

I would definitely put Viking at the top of my list if I'm in need of another cue. Highly recommended for playability and quality!

-Sean

 

[JB Cases]

LOL

What I'm not willing to do is join in one of your obsessive nitpicking "debates" about nothing. Bring it down to something like rational conversation or take it up with somebody else.

pj
chgo

Well, you said you don't believe in playability. To me playability is how well a cue feels and performs in your hands. If you don't believe that cues feel and perform differently, i.e. that they can more or less playability then to you all cues are the same.

Is that what you believe? If so would you play an important match with any cue that someone handed you? Five minutes or 24 hours to get used to would you do it.

 

[Patrick Johnson]

To me playability is how well a cue feels and performs in your hands.

What I mean by it is strictly objective performance characteristics, which I believe boils down to more or less squirt. What other objective performance characteristics do you believe there are?

pj
chgo

 

[JB Cases]

What I mean by it is strictly objective performance characteristics, which I believe boils down to more or less squirt. What other objective performance characteristics do you believe there are?

pj
chgo

Draw, Follow, Masse, Jump Shots.

Being as how I once had a nice shop with a great table surrounded by about 100 cues I often played with different cues to experience them. With some cues the cue ball was easier to draw than with others, some cues were good for jumping balls while others were not at all good, some cues were unwieldy and strangely balanced while others sat nicely in the hand and seemed to be easier to stroke with.

With some cues I could do almost trick-shot worthy masse shots with relative ease and with others those same shots were almost an impossibility for me no matter how hard I tried.

Anyway, I can accept squirt as being a measurable performance characteristic.

So I ask you again, since you famously play with a low squirt cue of your own devising, if I handed you a cue that is brand new and not changed in any way would you play an important match with it if you had 24 hours to acclimate yourself to it? For the sake of argument let's assume that this cue is on the opposite end of the squirt spectrum compared to your low squirt cue.

 

[rrich1]

I think this thread got a little off topic


Btw....john i sent you a pm

 

[Patrick Johnson]

What I mean by it is strictly objective performance characteristics, which I believe boils down to more or less squirt. What other objective performance characteristics do you believe there are?

pj
chgo

John:
Draw, Follow, Masse, Jump Shots.

I agree only with jump shots and only because of tip differences.

John:
Anyway, I can accept squirt as being a measurable performance characteristic.

So I ask you again, since you famously play with a low squirt cue of your own devising, if I handed you a cue that is brand new and not changed in any way would you play an important match with it if you had 24 hours to acclimate yourself to it? For the sake of argument let's assume that this cue is on the opposite end of the squirt spectrum compared to your low squirt cue.

I've already said squirt is the one performance characteristic I recognize.

pj
chgo

 

[JB Cases]

I agree only with jump shots and only because of tip differences.

Nope. I mean that you can have two cues with the same tip brand/hardness and one will be easy to jump with and the other will be nearly impossible.

I've already said squirt is the one performance characteristic I recognize.

pj
chgo

So then one cue can have better playability using squirt as the single criteria?

 

[charlieeeh]

Nope. I mean that you can have two cues with the same tip brand/hardness and one will be easy to jump with and the other will be nearly impossible.

Example of such jump cues?

 

[Patrick Johnson]

...you can have two cues with the same tip brand/hardness and one will be easy to jump with and the other will be nearly impossible.

Maybe if one is much lighter than a typical cue.

So then one cue can have better playability using squirt as the single criteria?

"Playability" is subjective - I prefer less squirt; others prefer more. Squirt is an objective performance difference that can go either way for "playability".

pj
chgo

 

[JB Cases]

Maybe if one is much lighter than a typical cue.

Wrong again. It would be wise of you to defer to my extensive experience with jump cue and jump shots. I know that is something you might find distasteful but I guarantee you it's true.

Let me state this again:

You can have two cues which both weigh the same. Both with the same tip brand and hardness. Both are "normal" playing cues and ONE of them will be great for jumping balls and the other will be terrible.

"Playability" is subjective - I prefer less squirt; others prefer more. Squirt is an objective performance difference that can go either way for "playability".
pj
chgo

Well then based on that alone there IS a difference in cues. But it's more than that. Cues are not simply the sum of their parts. They can be tuned in a sense by which parts are used. That's why some cues just feel better than others. Does this make a difference in performance? To a degree it does, to what degree is not known and of course highly debatable.

Still though I very much doubt that you would go into battle in an important match with a stock Kmart cue. Even if your current cue and the Kmart cue were put on a machine and found to have very close squirt properties I still think that when the outcome is super important you would not use that Kmart cue if you have a choice.

 

[CJ Wiley]

Viking was the first two piece cue I bought when I was a kid

I've posted a few threads about Vikings lately, and received no comments whatsoever. So please tell me your thoughts on the matter.

Viking was the first two piece cue I bought when I was a kid. I saved up and spent $27 on it and still remember going into the Billiard Room in Kirksville Mo. and how nervous and excited I was to have my own cue.