If I was KT...

Colin Colenso said:
Listen mate!...I fought and died in 3 world wars so you could have your free speech!

If you don't like it, why don't you move to Hackistan:D

*Tongue almost poking through cheek*
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That ain't nothin - I flew on 14 kamakazie missions. :cool:

Jake
 
wayne said:
You probably know that hindsight is 20/20. Of course, starting from NOTHING Kevin Trudeau has done quite well from my perspective. The challenge match and 4 consecutive very exciting tournaments. The line-up would have been much different if all poolplayers knew what they know now. There probably would have been another few thousand applications and some of the players now struggling to get in might have been shoo-ins (think Tang Hoa).

It seems KT is into rewarding believers in him and what he is doing, and he doesn't mind penalizing the non-believers. Hence, his choice of Mike Sigel, the man who taught him how to play pool and now it seems he is a good friend and advisor. It makes total sense that KT reward him and continue to reward him for his contributions. The non-believers who now believe, well they are being made to pay a high price but the $2000 a pop is probably about right based on supply and demand. If it was $500 a pop you would probably have about 200 players each qualifier and they just couldn't accommodate that many. If they limited the field like they have been then a lot of the top talent wouldn't be in the field.

Now that he has set the bar so high it means lowering it (say $500 entry) would create an uproar for those who have been paying $2000 a pop.

Some food for thought.

Wayne
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A very well-judged post, Wayne.
 
wayne said:
You probably know that hindsight is 20/20. Of course, starting from NOTHING Kevin Trudeau has done quite well from my perspective. The challenge match and 4 consecutive very exciting tournaments. The line-up would have been much different if all poolplayers knew what they know now. There probably would have been another few thousand applications and some of the players now struggling to get in might have been shoo-ins (think Tang Hoa).

It seems KT is into rewarding believers in him and what he is doing, and he doesn't mind penalizing the non-believers. Hence, his choice of Mike Sigel, the man who taught him how to play pool and now it seems he is a good friend and advisor. It makes total sense that KT reward him and continue to reward him for his contributions. The non-believers who now believe, well they are being made to pay a high price but the $2000 a pop is probably about right based on supply and demand. If it was $500 a pop you would probably have about 200 players each qualifier and they just couldn't accommodate that many. If they limited the field like they have been then a lot of the top talent wouldn't be in the field.

Now that he has set the bar so high it means lowering it (say $500 entry) would create an uproar for those who have been paying $2000 a pop.

Some food for thought.

Wayne
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Santos Sambajon is one prime example; he was supposedly already "in the IPT". Now it would be very difficult for him to get back in.
 
wayne said:
You probably know that hindsight is 20/20. Of course, starting from NOTHING Kevin Trudeau has done quite well from my perspective. The challenge match and 4 consecutive very exciting tournaments. The line-up would have been much different if all poolplayers knew what they know now. There probably would have been another few thousand applications and some of the players now struggling to get in might have been shoo-ins (think Tang Hoa).

It seems KT is into rewarding believers in him and what he is doing, and he doesn't mind penalizing the non-believers. Hence, his choice of Mike Sigel, the man who taught him how to play pool and now it seems he is a good friend and advisor. It makes total sense that KT reward him and continue to reward him for his contributions. The non-believers who now believe, well they are being made to pay a high price but the $2000 a pop is probably about right based on supply and demand. If it was $500 a pop you would probably have about 200 players each qualifier and they just couldn't accommodate that many. If they limited the field like they have been then a lot of the top talent wouldn't be in the field.

Now that he has set the bar so high it means lowering it (say $500 entry) would create an uproar for those who have been paying $2000 a pop.

Some food for thought.

Wayne
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Hi wayne, you've repeated much of what I've said many times before however the fact that many thousand more people would have sent in applications if they knew what they knew now is irrelevant if he had chosen the field based on merit, there wouldn't have been the need for applications!

Also with regards to the lowering of fees, are you serious? It will be the same players trying to qualify for the "Open" events and end of year qualifiers as are trying to qualify now (if they aren't all broke). Are you seriously saying that if the IPT lower the entry to $500 instead of $2000+ at the end of the year qualifiers they are going to complain. Would Tang Hoa really stamp his feet and bang his fists screaming "but all the other tourneys where $2000 we don't want a discount?!" :eek:

I think there are many rooms that can handle a 256 player field quite easily, for example several rooms on the Euro Tour do it in 3 days. But if it took 5 days Im sure the players would prefer a single larger field qualifier with more spots.

SJM looks at the IPT as a fan and I think you do to Wayne, and as a fan I also think its absoloutely great, however as a player I think it can still be tweaked and improved. Nothing more nothing less, the IPT has shown it can listen and make changes in the past, I hope that they do again and give more people a chance to play on the IPT.
 
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Keep in mind that the qualifiers are doing exactly what KT wanted them to accomplish.

You have full fields of very accomplished players competing for the tour cards.

The latest qualifier is full. (Or closed if you prefer).

The very fact that there are plenty of applicants tells me that the price is not too high. In fact, there have been several people who played who really had no chance to win. That tells me that if the price was set at $500 you probably would have 1,000 people trying to get in. Then what would KT do?

After this qualifier there will be one more at $2,000 a pop and after seeing the attendence at the first three I suspect that there will be a record turnout in Weert.

In the future KT may have to RAISE the qualifier fee to limit the amount of players. So I would suggest that if anyone is waiting to get on the tour you better start saving your pennies.

It reminds me of auctions where several of the same item were to be auctioned off one at a time and I held back on the first two hoping to get the rest at a cheaper price and lo and behold the last few went for more money.

Jake
 
jjinfla said:
Keep in mind that the qualifiers are doing exactly what KT wanted them to accomplish.

You have full fields of very accomplished players competing for the tour cards.

The latest qualifier is full. (Or closed if you prefer).

The very fact that there are plenty of applicants tells me that the price is not too high. In fact, there have been several people who played who really had no chance to win. That tells me that if the price was set at $500 you probably would have 1,000 people trying to get in. Then what would KT do?

After this qualifier there will be one more at $2,000 a pop and after seeing the attendence at the first three I suspect that there will be a record turnout in Weert.

In the future KT may have to RAISE the qualifier fee to limit the amount of players. So I would suggest that if anyone is waiting to get on the tour you better start saving your pennies.

It reminds me of auctions where several of the same item were to be auctioned off one at a time and I held back on the first two hoping to get the rest at a cheaper price and lo and behold the last few went for more money.

Jake
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Hi Jake, I think we all agree that 99% of pool players want to be a part of the IPT. I've been informed by Deno that the rooms that are holiding the qualifiers have various field restrictions. Surely we should find larger rooms, lets not let the tail wag the dog!

Look at the numbers, 6 billion people, probably several billion social players, man thousand top players, several hundred world class players. Now tell me why the qualifiers had only 40 runners, all these players for sure want to be part of the IPT, but only the privileged few with a stake horse or with cash to burn can tryout.

This is a class system, imagine standing outside a night club in the cold and rain waiting to get in. You're standing there when you notice 150 people get invited in, there's only about 40-80 people in the queue, but there's about 2-300 that really want to get in but can't afford it. :(

If the entry was lowered to $1000 you would get somewhere between 128-256. We also know that many rooms can handle this number of entries.

Take it from me, not one pool player is happy to pay $2000 per qualifier but they absoloutely all want to play on the IPT
 
That is our system we choose to live in.

The Daytona 500 allows anyone to come and watch. If you can afford the $260 admission price and the $60 parking fee. The attendance was over 200,000.

You want to race in it? I doubt $1,000,000 would be enough to get you and your team there.

The stars in the Olympics all started at the age of 3-7 with high priced coaches and an awful lot of work. By both parents and athletes.

Those are just the facts of life. It takes money to be successful. And a lot of hard work.

If the IPT takes off and continues past 2008 then the criteria to get on the tour will be even higher.

Right now the players are getting in on the ground floor. If they really think they are good enough then they will find the $2,000 entry fee, even if it means, gasp, finding a job. If they are just so-so short stops then they should not bother. Just stay at home and complain that life ain't fair.

Jake
 
Im not so sure the hype is about wanting to play IPT. When more so the hype is geared towards winning easy money by whatever shots merit a cash prize.

For me the IPT is lucrative early on but does not have the proven track record compared to the history and tradition of the Billiards Congress of America.
 
TheOne said:
if he had chosen the field based on merit, there wouldn't have been the need for applications!

Also with regards to the lowering of fees, are you serious?

I think there are many rooms that can handle a 256 player field quite easily, for example several rooms on the Euro Tour do it in 3 days. But if it took 5 days Im sure the players would prefer a single larger field qualifier with more spots.

SJM looks at the IPT as a fan and I think you do to Wayne, and as a fan I also think its absoloutely great, however as a player I think it can still be tweaked and improved. Nothing more nothing less, the IPT has shown it can listen and make changes in the past, I hope that they do again and give more people a chance to play on the IPT.
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You could say it should have been based on merit and maybe it should have been but it was an owner starting a business and he chose to do it the way he did it. I am sure he felt it was the best way to do it when he did it.

I don't think the fees will be or should be lowered based on the willingness to date of players to fill the fields. I expect there will be a lot more qualifiers to win spots in The qualifiers and the best players will be getting in this way. If you are waiting for him to lower prices so he can have larger fields at the qualifiers you may be waiting a long time.

Wayne
 
wayne said:
You could say it should have been based on merit and maybe it should have been but it was an owner starting a business and he chose to do it the way he did it. I am sure he felt it was the best way to do it when he did it.

I don't think the fees will be or should be lowered based on the willingness to date of players to fill the fields. I expect there will be a lot more qualifiers to win spots in The qualifiers and the best players will be getting in this way. If you are waiting for him to lower prices so he can have larger fields at the qualifiers you may be waiting a long time.

Wayne
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I'm not really talking about myself wayne, I could comfortably afford to enter all the qualifiers, I'm just passing on the feelings of all the players, even the players who are stumping up the money are not happy as mentioned in other posts. The problem is they have no choice and many dont want to complain publicly, every pool player wants to play in the IPT.

If you was planning to enter a qualifier yourself and you thought the 2k was fair I would respect your comments more. However I can only assume you, like Jake and everyone else in favour of the fee are not planning on paying the cash yourselves? If I'm wrong I apologise.

The very fact that there's hundreds of players in the world dreaming about playing on the IPT but only a fraction are entering enough evidence in my book that the IPT is not accessible enough.

I'm simply fighting the players corner, yes maybe they should have applied earlier, or whatever, but they've missed out, they have to go through the qualifiers now but lets not kick a guy when he's down.

Cut the fee, open up the IPT!


Ra Ra Ra:D
 
If I were KT

I think I'd be out scuba diving in the Cayman Islands. I wouldn't be a sexy ***** like I am now, but I'd be having fun anyway.
 
Jimmy M. said:
I think I'd be out scuba diving in the Cayman Islands. I wouldn't be a sexy ***** like I am now, but I'd be having fun anyway.
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As long as you don't go to the nude beach where I do my scuba diving we'll be okay!:eek:
 
Rude Dog said:
Hey man, fat people got feelings too. Oh Missssssssssssster Willlllllllllllllllllllllllson!:D
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If he deletes my posts I'll hog-tie Mike to an ant-hill. I know where he lives, too. You reading this, Mike? I'll show up at your doorstep with my muscle - the Gangster Cheeseburger!
 
TheOne said:
The very fact that there's hundreds of players in the world dreaming about playing on the IPT but only a fraction are entering enough evidence in my book that the IPT is not accessible enough.
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I suspect it's *intentionally* set up not to be "accessable enough" to just anyone. The main reason they're claiming (I say "claiming" because they haven't actually done it yet) that they'll be paying out a minimum of $13k this year, and $100k next year, to every tour player, is because there's a maximum number of players allowed on the tour.

If it were open to anyone, then there's no way they could pretend to offer such monetary incentives/promises.

Are the pro golf tours "accessable enough" to your average golf player? Of course not. Bowling? Arm Wrestling? Etc. :P

I suspect the high qualifier fee is also kind of a qualifier itself (different definition of the term) - it's to weed out the folks who aren't as serious from the people who are. People tend to value things they've paid more money for than things they get for free - though that, of course, is only really applying to the folks getting the eight spots that came open - correct me if I'm wrong, but the other 142 folks who were chosen for the tour didn't have to pay any money to get in, did they? They just had to apply on time and get chosen?
 
TheOne said:
I'm not really talking about myself wayne, I could comfortably afford to enter all the qualifiers, I'm just passing on the feelings of all the players, even the players who are stumping up the money are not happy as mentioned in other posts. The problem is they have no choice and many dont want to complain publicly, every pool player wants to play in the IPT.

If you was planning to enter a qualifier yourself and you thought the 2k was fair I would respect your comments more. However I can only assume you, like Jake and everyone else in favour of the fee are not planning on paying the cash yourselves? If I'm wrong I apologise.

The very fact that there's hundreds of players in the world dreaming about playing on the IPT but only a fraction are entering enough evidence in my book that the IPT is not accessible enough.

I'm simply fighting the players corner, yes maybe they should have applied earlier, or whatever, but they've missed out, they have to go through the qualifiers now but lets not kick a guy when he's down.

Cut the fee, open up the IPT!


Ra Ra Ra:D
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My point was it is very unlikely the fee is going to be lowered based on the interest to date. If they had a qualifier and only 10 people showed up then they would have to start to reconsider. As it stands now there are enough people willing to pay the entrance fee, and it is generating a lot of excitement, so it seems successful and when something is successful then KT is not going to change it.

The way a lot of players can get around paying the $2000 themselves is by winning their way in through a small entry fee tournament that pays for their spot. Here in L.A. they could hold these type of tournaments at a number of different poolhalls and could generate enough money to pay for a lot of entries. If I decide to give it a go I would try to do it through one of the lower entry tournaments.

Another option would be to match up with someone and win the entry fee that way. If you are going to be on this side of the world anytime soon I may give you this opportunity.

Wayne
 
How come no one is comparing the IPT to Poker where the stake is $10,000 to get in? I never hear anyone say that the $10,000 entry fee is not fair.

They held a mini tournament here where they wanted 20 people at $100 each and the winner gets an entry to the qualifier. They only got 17 people so they actually paid $117 each. I didn't find out who won and went to the qualifier.

Jake
 
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