Instructor or training material for pattern play improvement

[wetwilly58]

@FranCrimi: Pattern play for 8-ball is my primary focus.

@GorramJayne: Your post did speak to me in that picking up the "ball movement tricks" that help move the CB around effectively. I'd definitely like to find better ways to train on not only on optimal pattern choice but also shots that make getting to better angles less of an effort. Hopefully that makes sense.

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[BilliardsAbout]

Thank you all for explaining further. I'd heard and used the term "sequence" or "sequencing" before, but not "pattern play".

 

[FranCrimi]

Thank you all for explaining further. I'd heard and used the term "sequence" or "sequencing" before, but not "pattern play".

Who, besides yourself, refers to pattern play as sequencing?

 

[FranCrimi]

@FranCrimi: Pattern play for 8-ball is my primary focus.

@GorramJayne: Your post did speak to me in that picking up the "ball movement tricks" that help move the CB around effectively. I'd definitely like to find better ways to train on not only on optimal pattern choice but also shots that make getting to better angles less of an effort. Hopefully that makes sense.

Sent from my SM-N910P using Tapatalk

So basically, you're asking: "How do I become a smarter pool player?" As far as learning patterns, nothing beats a good book with patterns laid out that you can study. The first pattern books I read were Willie Mosconi's little red and blue books with photos of 14.1 pool table layouts where you could test yourself and imagine how you would run the balls, and compare it to Willie's answer. I'm sure there's something out there in 8-Ball that you can study. That's what you should look for.

As for position play, there is plenty of material out there on that. Just try to find things that are more specific for the game you prefer.

 

[Bob Jewett]

One training aid I've seen for this is a set of color-coded little spots (like donuts but no holes) to mark all the balls with so you can repeat the same multi-ball position and find out what works for you.

There are lots of fixed-pattern drills with a bunch of balls on the table in set places but those are usually nothing like the patterns you see during play.

One point about learning patterns is that you need the positioning tools that make the pattern possible. As you develop more tools, the patterns you play will change. For example at 14.1 when you are clearing the balls in the rack area when they are mostly broken apart but still crowded, if you can short little stun shots with accuracy, you can often get through most of the rack without going to a cushion and shooting only very short shots. If you don't have accurate short stun shots in your repertoire, you will need to shoot longer shots and go to cushions.

 

[BeiberLvr]

So basically, you're asking: "How do I become a smarter pool player?" As far as learning patterns, nothing beats a good book with patterns laid out that you can study. The first pattern books I read were Willie Mosconi's little red and blue books with photos of 14.1 pool table layouts where you could test yourself and imagine how you would run the balls, and compare it to Willie's answer. I'm sure there's something out there in 8-Ball that you can study. That's what you should look for.

As for position play, there is plenty of material out there on that. Just try to find things that are more specific for the game you prefer.

OP (or anyone) can pull up YouTube and watch thousands upon thousands of matches. 8 ball, 9 ball, 14.1

When the player comes to the table with an open shot. Press pause, and see if you can guess the exact pattern. If at any time the player does something different. Pause the video again and reassess.

 

[BilliardsAbout]

I just did a Google search and I see that pattern play is a prevailing term in the pool world.

I've been saying "sequencing" for some time because students know the word means "order" and it's making order(s) from what looks like a random or confusing table.

I've talked with pro friends in person and online about patterns, sequences, triangles, inside-outside, outside-inside, and I hadn't heard the two words "pattern play" before that I can recall. I also remember conversations like "read a table" and "solve the puzzle".

Was it in a George Fels book that he wrote "Nothing gives you a glow like a nicely executed sequence..." and "It takes years to learn the right order for taking the balls of the table..." Was it Mastering Pool...? I'm not trying to take credit for a new concept, either.

I know you dislike people coining new terms without justification, and that was not my intention here. I do find pattern play a bit close to position play as both are p alliterations. Obviously, several of us were already confused on this thread. I can use the term pattern play going forward.

Thanks.

 

[BilliardsAbout]

OP (or anyone) can pull up YouTube and watch thousands upon thousands of matches. 8 ball, 9 ball, 14.1

When the player comes to the table with an open shot. Press pause, and see if you can guess the exact pattern. If at any time the player does something different. Pause the video again and reassess.

That is very good advice. We all want to see what is "correct" on the table. There are some great shortcuts, for example, having a triangle of balls to shape toward next. You can play towards the center of the triangle of three balls and have three shots to choose from on the next stroke.

You'll see an Eight Ball player miss a shape on a tough ball with six balls left on his table, rather than play shape on two, three or even more balls to maximize his or her chances of continuing the run.

 

[skipbales]

One training aid I've seen for this is a set of color-coded little spots (like donuts but no holes) to mark all the balls with so you can repeat the same multi-ball position and find out what works for you.

There are lots of fixed-pattern drills with a bunch of balls on the table in set places but those are usually nothing like the patterns you see during play.

One point about learning patterns is that you need the positioning tools that make the pattern possible. As you develop more tools, the patterns you play will change. For example at 14.1 when you are clearing the balls in the rack area when they are mostly broken apart but still crowded, if you can short little stun shots with accuracy, you can often get through most of the rack without going to a cushion and shooting only very short shots. If you don't have accurate short stun shots in your repertoire, you will need to shoot longer shots and go to cushions.

Great points. In Tor Lowry's new pattern play cd he explains those concepts well. There are always a lot of choices. Knowing which ones produce the most consistent outcomes is the practical application of the positioning techniques the player knows. You can almost always get position in more than one way. Choosing the series of those techniques which are likely to yield the best outcome is very helpful (at least to me). The more techniques you know the better your choices are. I believe the most common mistake players make is trying to do things they are not as consistent at as they think they are. Choosing patterns which employ the kinds of shots a player can successfully complete is a good place to start. Then adding and improving those techniques brings it together.

Tor starts with the last ball and says "where would I like to be to shoot this ball and what is the easiest way to get there". Sometimes the patterns go exactly as planned and sometimes they get modified but a game plan seems to be helpful.

 

[BilliardsAbout]

You hit the nail on the head with "modified" plans. It takes discipline when you make a ball, but miss your planned shape, to plan freshly. This is why good Eight Ball or other non-rotation game players will make a shot, then pause for quite a while, then continue their run.

 

[FranCrimi]

I just did a Google search and I see that pattern play is a prevailing term in the pool world.

I've been saying "sequencing" for some time because students know the word means "order" and it's making order(s) from what looks like a random or confusing table.

I've talked with pro friends in person and online about patterns, sequences, triangles, inside-outside, outside-inside, and I hadn't heard the two words "pattern play" before that I can recall. I also remember conversations like "read a table" and "solve the puzzle".

Was it in a George Fels book that he wrote "Nothing gives you a glow like a nicely executed sequence..." and "It takes years to learn the right order for taking the balls of the table..." Was it Mastering Pool...? I'm not trying to take credit for a new concept, either.

I know you dislike people coining new terms without justification, and that was not my intention here. I do find pattern play a bit close to position play as both are p alliterations. Obviously, several of us were already confused on this thread. I can use the term pattern play going forward.

Thanks.

Anyone worth their salt in this game knows and uses the term 'pattern play' correctly. Quit trying to rationalize your lack of knowledge.

 

[skipbales]

You hit the nail on the head with "modified" plans. It takes discipline when you make a ball, but miss your planned shape, to plan freshly. This is why good Eight Ball or other non-rotation game players will make a shot, then pause for quite a while, then continue their run.

Exactly. Pool is a "game of opportunity".

 

[FranCrimi]

Exactly. Pool is a "game of opportunity".

What do you mean by " Pool is a game of opportunity?"

 

[BilliardsAbout]

Anyone worth their salt in this game knows and uses the term 'pattern play' correctly. Quit trying to rationalize your lack of knowledge.

There was no need for this statement. I've been teaching for over 25 years and have hundreds of successful students.

This is not the first time you have criticized someone for using different terminology than you. I have apologized for using a different term and have explained myself, so there was no need for you to be anything but kind.

 

[skipbales]

What do you mean by " Pool is a game of opportunity?"

Opportunities present themselves you did not expect. You have a ball you could only make from a tiny little sliver of space on the table. You are getting shape on a different ball and happen to stop exactly in that space. You have the opportunity to change your mind and pursue a different plan.

It is something you see all the time. A player intends to do one thing but an unexpected opportunity presents itself and the player changes his/her plan. 9 ball is loaded with opportunity. Someone kicks a ball and lines the next ball in sequence up for a simple combo on the 9 ball and the next player has an unexpected opportunity.

I think this is a pretty commonly used term. I did not coin it.

 

[skipbales]

There was no need for this statement. I've been teaching for over 25 years and have hundreds of successful students.

This is not the first time you have criticized someone for using different terminology than you. I have apologized for using a different term and have explained myself, so there was no need for you to be anything but kind.

There needs to be a definitive glossary of worldwide official definitions of pool terms
I too have been caught in a snare of exact pool terminology here. I repeat some term used by a world class instructor and someone challenges the exact meaning.

As far as pattern play being expressly limited to ball selection, there are MANY professional instructions who teach pattern play for nine ball. Bob Jewett has a nice video on Dr. Dave's VEPPS cds entitled pattern play for 9 ball. Tor Lowry has a new 3 cd set about pattern play and he alternates between 8 ball and 9 ball.

Deciding which ball to hit in which order is only one component of a pattern. Planning out an entire rack of 9 ball and visually creating a road map of what you intend to do based on the skill set you have and the likelihood of success is a pattern. It may not be a pattern according to a specific definition as established in some nationally accepted dictionary of terms (oh that one actually existed for pool) but it is a pattern.

If you decide to hit the one ball in the side so you can easily get position to hit the 2 ball in the corner so you can use the 3 for a breakout ball for the 5 and so forth, that is a pattern. It is a different pattern than if you decide to shoot the one ball int the corner and do something completely different, even though the sequence of balls is the same. The pattern is completely different. Position is getting the cue ball where it needs to be to complete the pattern. To me the pattern is just that, a pattern. It is the strategic level. Position is the tactical level.

But that is just how I see it. Others may differ and they can easily be more correct than me. I am more interested in the concepts than the definitions. I also hate to see all the conflict here. This forum is a place for me to communicate with others and share ideas. I hate to see all the dissension. I think it is mostly a weakness of text vs. verbal communication. With text there is no way to interpret the inflection intended with a comment and it is easy to read too much into things.

As for me, I like and appreciate everyone who contributes and have no axe to grind with anyone. It is perfectly OK to disagree with me about anything. It is even ok for me to be wrong about all my ideas. My wife would certainly agree with that.:wink:

 

[BilliardsAbout]

There needs to be a definitive glossary of worldwide official definitions of pool terms
I too have been caught in a snare of exact pool terminology here. I repeat some term used by a world class instructor and someone challenges the exact meaning.

As far as pattern play being expressly limited to ball selection, there are MANY professional instructions who teach pattern play for nine ball. Bob Jewett has a nice video on Dr. Dave's VEPPS cds entitled pattern play for 9 ball. Tor Lowry has a new 3 cd set about pattern play and he alternates between 8 ball and 9 ball.

Deciding which ball to hit in which order is only one component of a pattern. Planning out an entire rack of 9 ball and visually creating a road map of what you intend to do based on the skill set you have and the likelihood of success is a pattern. It may not be a pattern according to a specific definition as established in some nationally accepted dictionary of terms (oh that one actually existed for pool) but it is a pattern.

If you decide to hit the one ball in the side so you can easily get position to hit the 2 ball in the corner so you can use the 3 for a breakout ball for the 5 and so forth, that is a pattern. It is a different pattern than if you decide to shoot the one ball int the corner and do something completely different, even though the sequence of balls is the same. The pattern is completely different. Position is getting the cue ball where it needs to be to complete the pattern. To me the pattern is just that, a pattern. It is the strategic level. Position is the tactical level.

But that is just how I see it. Others may differ and they can easily be more correct than me. I am more interested in the concepts than the definitions. I also hate to see all the conflict here. This forum is a place for me to communicate with others and share ideas. I hate to see all the dissension. I think it is mostly a weakness of text vs. verbal communication. With text there is no way to interpret the inflection intended with a comment and it is easy to read too much into things.

As for me, I like and appreciate everyone who contributes and have no axe to grind with anyone. It is perfectly OK to disagree with me about anything. It is even ok for me to be wrong about all my ideas. My wife would certainly agree with that.:wink:

Good points. It's always good to consider multiple pockets for object balls along with multiple routes for the cue ball.

 

[Jimbojim]

If you don't have access to an instructor, check out Zero-x Billiards.

 

[FranCrimi]

There was no need for this statement. I've been teaching for over 25 years and have hundreds of successful students.

This is not the first time you have criticized someone for using different terminology than you. I have apologized for using a different term and have explained myself, so there was no need for you to be anything but kind.

No, sorry, that doesn't fly. You claim to be an instructor yet you don't know what pattern play is. You have a track record of trying to rationalize your way out of your errors and lack of knowledge. If you're going to keep rationalizing, then I'm going to keep catching you at it.

 

[BilliardsAbout]

No, sorry, that doesn't fly. You claim to be an instructor yet you don't know what pattern play is. You have a track record of trying to rationalize your way out of your errors and lack of knowledge. If you're going to keep rationalizing, then I'm going to keep catching you at it.

I saw a recent note you posted about functional conflict on these forums being good for the game and for knowledge, and I welcome your future insights, but you are mistaken here, in my humble opinion.

A search for pattern play on Google I did this week, prompted by your first comment, brings a few pages to the fore. Several of us were confused by the term on this very thread. There is no governing body for pool jargon. Just because you have had lovely "pattern play" conversations with some fellow pros doesn't mean I haven't talked about "sequence" with other pros. Nor did my pro friends correct me during my conversations, and say, "You mean pattern play, Matt." Your good friend George Fels used the term "sequence" in his books. And even on this thread, people are still debating this term.

Please continue to call out bad pool knowledge when you see it, but arguing with me about word choices is a waste of our time.

Thank you for the new knowledge about "pattern play". I think it is a confusing term, since we first have to choose patterns and then shoot, and I will continue to use "sequence". I'm sure you and I and the game of pool will survive these sorts of choices.

Then again, perhaps I'm wrong and you will correct me again. Perhaps one thinks pattern play is choosing cue ball routes, as a poster suggested, but you will continue to reprove him because you are "right" that it "really means" sorting balls for play in non-Rotation games. I call that "sequence". "Patterns" include, for me, things like "triangles" and "inside out" or "outside in" (the last two are Fels terms before you blast away, so be aware).

But however you respond to him or me, please be respectful and polite.

Is that too much to ask? That you treat me the way I treat you on these forums, with respect, with dignity?