IPT sold to reputed "gangster"

bottom line ?

If KT really sold the IPT to Mr. Ho for $150 million .......
If Mr. Ho is really like a "Godfather" in Asia .........
If what you all say is true about the IPT not worth $150 million .......
then are you all saying that KT has conned the Godfather out of $150 million?

Hey, from what I've been told, those gangster types play pretty rough....
 
Well hopefully out of that 150 million, he coughs up 20 million of it, cause that's what it's gonna cost him to give 200 players 100,000 each in 2007. When I think about it...him shelling out 20million, I can't see it happening.
 
smashmouth said:
Easy gents,

There are plenty of wealthy owners in the world of sport with criminal pasts,
doesn't neccesarily mean anything.

Hell, there are plenty of IPT players with criminal records.

It's all irrelevant imo.

:eek: I have never heard of anyone in the pool business or sport that would ever do anything illegal.:rolleyes: yeah right!!!!:D
 
cuetechasaurus said:
Well hopefully out of that 150 million, he coughs up 20 million of it, cause that's what it's gonna cost him to give 200 players 100,000 each in 2007. When I think about it...him shelling out 20million, I can't see it happening.

Jeez, do you still not get it? Kevin has promised that each tour card holder will earn at least $100,000 in 2007 becaue of their being IPT tour card holders. He has personally guranteed that he will pay the DIFFERENCE if they do not earn that much. There are 150 TOUR CARD HOLDERS. So, for the last time, KT will MAKE UP the difference between what a tour card holder makes in 2007 and $100,000.

Would anyone care to BET that the $100,000 guarantee is part of the deal on the table with Ho interactive?

Now, as to whether Stanley Ho is a gangster or not and whether that's good or bad for pool. Let me be the first to say that Jesus said it best when he said let those without sin cast the first stone.

Go right ahead.

John
 
Good Post Linda

rackmsuckr said:
Whoa, you all are pretty gloomy for the outlook of the IPT. KT has committed to lead the charge for 5 more years and that should at least guarantee some kind of longevity on American soil. All his staff will remain and will probably grow from the home base of Chicago.

Next year's schedule in many other countries will be a reality. Ho will only be involved in the managerial aspects, but KT is the Commish. I am pretty sure he wrote in clauses that assured him complete control over running the tournaments, etc.

Things will pretty much stay the same, with bigger money added and more clout, which means more TV exposure and sponsorship, and products with the attendant trickle-down effect.

Thanks Linda, I too am hoping for the best.

I do see some changes to be made. Fans of Professional Pool will have to start paying an admission charge. Fans will hopefully buy some merchandise from the endorsee manufacturers.

Fans can be a BIG help to the program, by writing letters to ESPN, asking for TV Coverage. Get a petition signed from your local Pool Room (names, complete addresses, phone numbers) & send the petition to ESPN... one of these petitions from every Pool Room in the USA will help bring about change. Send a CC copy to all of the ESPN advertisers, that will help our cause, too. Then send another copy to the International Olympic Committee...

That will Get R Done...

There will always be time for criticizing the IPT, when it has truly gone asunder. For the time being, let's all be supporters & send in our petitions, attend a Tournament & buy some goods.

Let Me go first...
 
rackmsuckr said:
Whoa, you all are pretty gloomy for the outlook of the IPT. KT has committed to lead the charge for 5 more years and that should at least guarantee some kind of longevity on American soil. All his staff will remain and will probably grow from the home base of Chicago.

Next year's schedule in many other countries will be a reality. Ho will only be involved in the managerial aspects, but KT is the Commish. I am pretty sure he wrote in clauses that assured him complete control over running the tournaments, etc.

Things will pretty much stay the same, with bigger money added and more clout, which means more TV exposure and sponsorship, and products with the attendant trickle-down effect.

Stanley has a known value of 3.6 Billion U.S. $$$ and perhaps more that isn't known - he can float the IPT for amusement.
 
I'm thinking that Ho will use the same approach that poker tournament is using.

Also pool is big in Asia and some parts of Europe. Pool has a better advertising revenue potential in that region.

The only way pool will make money in advertising in the US is if Paris Hilton joins the tour. ;)
 
don't believe every thing you hear and half of what you read!

its a shame the papers can list bad info and the media just sucks it up but really is it any different then what the gov't is doing,there the biggest drug dealers ,just look around....

Eastpointcues
A J Gotti
 
cuetechasaurus said:
Well hopefully out of that 150 million, he coughs up 20 million of it, cause that's what it's gonna cost him to give 200 players 100,000 each in 2007. When I think about it...him shelling out 20million, I can't see it happening.

No chance it sold for $150M USD. With so many people on this forum professing to have so much business sense, I'm surprised to see that people are still talking about this $150M. I am going to go out on a limb here, with what little business sense I do have (which isn't much), and say that there is no way in hell that the IPT is worth $150M USD and there's even less of a chance that Stanley Ho, self-made billionaire, is going to spend that much on the IPT. Like I said in another post, it was probably 150M TWD, which equates to roughly $4.5M USD.
 
Jimmy M. said:
No chance it sold for $150M USD. With so many people on this forum professing to have so much business sense, I'm surprised to see that people are still talking about this $150M. I am going to go out on a limb here, with what little business sense I do have (which isn't much), and say that there is no way in hell that the IPT is worth $150M USD and there's even less of a chance that Stanley Ho, self-made billionaire, is going to spend that much on the IPT. Like I said in another post, it was probably 150M TWD, which equates to roughly $4.5M USD.

I would bet that the 150 million is an accurate figure BUT I would also bet that it's in stock options for the IPO of Ho Casino Online and also tied to performance benchmarks that the IPT has to reach.

Similar to the sale of Skype to Ebay. The final sale price is contingent on Skype's performance over a number of years.

As for whether the IPT is worth 150 million or not. Right now, no, but in a few years it could be. Sure, anyone could duplicate or perhaps do a better job than the IPT but sometimes it's better to just buy an existing model rather than spend time building one.

I know someone who has made a LOT of cash flipping websites. He builds ecommerce sites, gets them decent page rank and visitors and then sells them. There are a lot of buyers out there with money who lack the expertise and desire to build what he builds - they want a turnkey business and are paying a premium for it.

The only point that matters right now is that there are 200 world class players being treated like the world class athletes they are and getting PAID for it. Next year at this time the ONLY players on the IPT who will be there will be the ones who played their way there. Then they will deserve every dollar that Stanley Ho and KT have invested in them.

John
 
Just the facts, please!

onepocketchump said:
The only point that matters right now is that there are 200 world class players being treated like the world class athletes they are and getting PAID for it. Next year at this time the ONLY players on the IPT who will be there will be the ones who played their way there. Then they will deserve every dollar that Stanley Ho and KT have invested in them.

John
I copied this list that was posted by Linda C.

Not counting Mike S., because I'm sure he has "separate" arrangements, the only player that has been paid close to that of a "world Class" athlete is Hohmann with Manalo getting close. The majority have earned $5K or less.
Far below the average U.S. wage.

By the way, what has KT invested in them? The players made the IPT, not the other way around. Personally, I feel as though all of the players deserve a whole lot more than what they ARE getting, and I don't think that they'll end up with much more on this tour. KT is just too slick.

Place Player Name # Prize Money

1 Hohmann, Thorsten $350,000

2 Manalo, Marlon $99,000

3 Orcollo, Dennis $80,000

4 Reyes, Efren $65,000

5 Souquet, Ralf $50,000

6 Stalev, Evgeny $40,000

7 Chamat, Marcus $30,000

8 Peach, Daryl $30,000

9 Appleton, Darren $30,000

10 Alcano, Ronato $30,000

11 Bustamante, Francisco $30,000

12 Pagulayan, Alex $30,000

13 Owen, Gabriel $30,000

14 Diks, Rico $30,000

15 Nevel, Larry $30,000

16 Hann, Quinten $30,000

17 Lining, Antonio $17,000

18 Martinez, Rafael $17,000

19 Deuel, Corey $17,000

20 Adkins, Dee $17,000

21 Putnik, Ivica $17,000

22 Hill, Michael $17,000

23 Feijen, Niels $17,000

24 Strickland, Earl $17,000

25 Immonen, Mika $17,000

26 Kirkwood, Jason $17,000

27 Van den Berg, Nick $17,000

28 Tot, Sandor $17,000

29 Lely, Alex $17,000

30 Sambajon, Santos $17,000

31 Hundal, Raj $17,000

32 Morris, Rodney $17,000

33 Beaufils, Yannick $17,000

34 Putnam, Shawn $17,000

35 Archer, Johnny $10,000

36 Boyes, Karl $10,000

37 Hatch, Dennis $10,000

38 Moore, Steve $10,000

39 Williams, Charles $10,000

40 Varner, Nick $10,000

41 Heuwagen, Lee $10,000

42 Juva, Markus $10,000

43 Lohtander, Marko $10,000

44 Schmidt, John $10,000

45 Potier, Paul $10,000

46 Ellerby, Sarah $10,000

47 Morris, Carl $10,000

48 Younger, Johl $10,000

49 Kucharo, Jon $10,000

50 Wetch, Jimmy $10,000

51 O'Sullivan, Ronnie $10,000

52 Walden, James $10,000

53 Hunter, Bobby $10,000

54 Sigel, Mike $5,000

55 Ortmann, Oliver $5,000

56 Frank, Troy $5,000

57 Marquez, Marco $5,000

58 Groce, Brian $5,000

59 Okumura, Takeshi $5,000

60 Breedlove, George $5,000

61 Salvas, Luc $5,000

62 Garrahan, Theodore $5,000

63 Broxson, David $5,000

64 Butera, Sal $5,000

65 Raybone, Neil $5,000

66 Klasovic, Andreja $5,000

67 Montal, Edwin $5,000

68 Bartram, Christopher $5,000

69 Petroni, Fabio $5,000

70 Daulton, Shannon $5,000

71 Fisher, Allison $5,000

72 Mckenna, Robert $5,000

73 Davenport, Kim $5,000

74 Gay, Leil $5,000

75 Eckert, Ralph $5,000

76 Jahnke, Bernard $5,000

77 Macias, Johnathan $5,000

78 Storm, Tom $5,000

79 Calderon, Jerry $5,000

80 Beckley, Jeff $5,000

81 Chohan, Tony $5,000

82 McCready, Keith $5,000

83 Vickery, Howard $5,000

84 Zimmerman, Michael $5,000

85 Harrison, Philip $5,000

86 Jones, Jeremy $5,000

87 Majid, Imran $5,000

88 Joyner, Cliff $5,000

89 Hopkins, Allen $5,000

90 Watson, Gerry $5,000

91 Wims, John $5,000

92 Catledge, Wayne $5,000

93 San Souci, George $5,000

94 Jones, Samuel $5,000

95 Basavich, Daniel $5,000

96 Hofstatter, Gerda $5,000

97 Townsend, Scotty $5,000

98 Jones, Loree Jon $5,000

99 Kiamco, Warren $2,000

100 Kennedy, Thomas $2,000

101 Massey, Michael $2,000

102 Dominguez, Ernesto $2,000

103 West, Dallas $2,000

104 Fisher, Kelly $2,000

105 Eberle, Max $2,000

106 Fusco, James $2,000

107 Murphy, Austin $2,000

108 Alcaide, David $2,000

109 Davis, Michael $2,000

110 Bryant, Charles $2,000

111 Reljic, David $2,000

112 Robles, Tony $2,000

113 Van Boening, Shane $2,000

114 Parica, Jose $2,000

115 Santl, Stefan $2,000

116 Corr, Karen $2,000

117 Wheeler, Adam $2,000

118 Schwartz, Larry $2,000

119 Carvajal, Alejandro $2,000

120 Acosta, Roland $2,000

121 Wiseman, Ronald $2,000

122 Facquet, Vincent $2,000

123 Incardona, William $2,000

124 Di Liberto, Daniel $2,000

125 Brienza, Paul $2,000

126 Tourangeau, Stan $2,000

127 Butera, Louis $2,000

128 Holtz, Patrick $2,000

129 Dodson, Robin $2,000

130 Miller, Jason $2,000

131 Runnels, Ike $2,000

132 Colenso, Colin $2,000

133 Roberts, James $2,000

134 Martin, Ray $2,000

135 Saleh, Brian $2,000

136 Di Toro, John $2,000

137 Edey, Tyler $2,000

138 Czetli, Aaron $2,000

139 Sakai, Miyuki $2,000

140 Kelly, Edwin $2,000

141 Gulyassy, Mike $2,000

142 Webb, Monica $2,000

143 Minici, Joseph $2,000

144 Chenman, Lee $2,000

145 Leonardo, Gunnar $2,000

146 Jakulj, Zlatko $2,000

147 Travers, Laurent $2,000

148 Thornfeldt, Helena $2,000

149 Franken, Aaron $2,000

150 Manabu, Mori $2,000

151 Laurance, Ewa $2,000

152 Goh, Tuan Kiat $2,000

153 White, Jimmy $2,000

154 Mathews, Grady $2,000

155 Carter, Linda $2,000

156 Alvarez, Frank $2,000

157 Crane, Wade $2,000

158 Kenniston, Mary $2,000

159 Amine, Ouahbi $2,000

160 Jones, Tammie $2,000

161 Kutcher, John $2,000

162 Friend, Bernard $2,000

163 Cernero, Michael $2,000

164 Keller, Ryan $2,000

165 LeBron, Mike $2,000

166 Broadhurst, Jackie $2,000

167 Gonzalez, Rafael $2,000

168 Raney, Jim $2,000

169 TBD

170 Pete Fusco

New Qualifiers Chronologically

171 Kevin Becker Germany

172 Jeff Melton USA

173 Garrett Schaar USA

174 Frank Hernandez USA

175 Glenn Atwell USA

176 Brady Gollan Canada

177 Ramil Gallego Phillipines

178 Joern Kaplan Germany

179 Thomas Engert Germany

180 Kazuo Furuta Taiwan

181 Hung Ming Chu Taiwan

182 Tony Drago Malta

183 Hiroshi Takenaka Japan

184 Akikumo Toshikawa Japan

185 Chris Melling England

186 Toni Judet Romania

187 Roman Hybler Czech Republic

188 Oezer Bulunmaz Turkey

189 Ben Davies Wales

190 Jasmin Ouschan Austria

191 Ben Nunan Australia

192 Goh Takami Japan

193 Davide Pascasi Italy

194 David Alcoberro Spain

195 Danny Harriman USA

196 Hsia Hui-Kai Taiwan

197 Chia-Ching Wu Taiwan

198 Jimitri Jungo Switzerland

199 Jayson Shaw United Kingdom

200 Tang Hoa USA
 
if you people think for one second that ho payed 150 million for the ipt your dreaming.5 million maybe,its not worth anything,its a losing venture until they get t.v. going
 
Perhaps Jimmy, you could point me to another "job" that offers $2000 a week with the opportunity to earn between that and several hundred thousand in the same week. Since you want to compare it to the "average" US wages we can do that. Extrapolated out, the IPT tour card holders will earn $13,000 this year for three week's worth of work, so that equates to what....about $200,000 a year for a full time worker. I'd say that that is well above the US average.

I can't believe that anyone would nitpick a tournament series that pays LAST PLACE. When will you get it that KT has already done more positive good for professional pool than almost any other promoter in the last decade. The only other man that comes close is Barry Hearn. When Barry held the world championsips with the winner getting $65,000 everyone heralded this as a great milestone.

We may not agree, but if money is the wayto keep score, IPT players are way ahead of players in any other promoter's tours and tournaments for average winnings per player. Check your facts on that one.

John
 
So many people continue to knock KT and the IPT. As far as I know all the players have recieved their money. It has been the best thing to happen to pool. The $ potential for the players is so far beyond what they had in the past that there is no comparison. If there is not another tournament it has still been a fabulous ride. There is no need to continously nit pick just enjoy what is happening and be happy for the players.
 
The players didn't make the IPT. You want "just the facts" then face them. The facts are that Kevin could have put up 200 VNEA players and called them the IPT Pros and 99% of the world's population would have accepted them as the creme de le creme of professional pool.

I was a "professional" high diver. What did that mean? It meant that I got up and performed tricks that 99% of the world's population can't do and can't discern as to whether I am "good" or not. I and my "professional" colleagues didn't have to be competition perfect in order to entertain and awe.

In fact, if you want a perfect parallel then explain the popularity of "Trick Shot Magic". If there isn't one of you who isn't bored to death with that series of shows by now please stand up. Why, because we know better, we are the diehards who study this.

Make no mistake Jimmy - Kevin Trudeau created the IPT and the PLAYERS are just actors on the stage. He has invited the very best to compete and created a platform that insures the best will emerge. But don't think for one moment that Efren Reyes carries the IPT - it's the other way around. If it weren't then the IPT might not exist because then the players would have already had the star power and negotiating power they yearn for. You know, the things promised to them by the UPA, if you want the facts.

In fact, speaking of facts, where was the UPA in the collective bargaining process when this whole thing started? Why wasn't every single UPA member automatically a member of the IPT? Not only do the players have NO POWER, they don't even have unity or a voice when one is promised to them.

If Mick Hill wins this tournament do you think it will be diferent than if Efren Reyes does? Only in Manila. That's the only place on planet earth where the public at large knows about or cares about who wins this tournament.

If the IPT gains the kind of publicity and notoriety that Kevin evangelizes then it will be something. Kevin is closer to making this a reality THAN anyone ever before as far as I know. That is a FACT no matter how the reported 150 million dollar deal is structured. The FACT is that Keving has created a brand, he created an organization, he has funded it, the participants are happy with it and it has attracted some corporate sponsors beyond billiards.

I rest my case.

John
 
"By the way, what has KT invested in them? The players made the IPT, not the other way around. Personally, I feel as though all of the players deserve a whole lot more than what they ARE getting, and I don't think that they'll end up with much more on this tour. KT is just too slick."

Um, when was the las time you saw a green room with free massages? Oh that's right - the last IPT tournament? Even the WPBA doesn't have green rooms. When was the last time you saw such well appointed tournament facilities and a staff like the IPT has? What has KT invested in the players? How about 8 million in prize money this year and 13 million next year? How about a million dollars a tournament in production costs.

Are you blind or just blinded by rhetoric, rumor and misplaced morals?

It's real simple - if you don't like Kevin Trudeau and who he associates with then don't consume their products. Don't be a hypocrite and chastise the system while using it. If you want change then be change. I will happily support your tour as well.

John
 
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