Is the Game of Pool Geometrically Correct and/or Complete?

Sloppy Pockets

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
PS: regarding "aiming systems" --------> "even walking down a flight of stairs requires a "stepping system". ;)

That's pretty funny, but also very true. Just the other day my three year-old grandson was showing me his system for going down the basement stairs without falling under the hand rail and onto the floor below. He actually had a specific method that he explained to me in great detail. I didn't share my system with him, but it would have been something like, "Well, Papa steps down with his right foot first, because that's the leg with the bad knee, and he doesn't want to bend it, then he quickly..."

You get the picture. Anyway, great post, CJ.
 

His Boy Elroy

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I can't help but wonder how anyone could think you could play pool (or anything else) at the highest level without a system. Whether we want to realize it or not there is a conscious or unconcious system for all aspects of pocket billiards. That goes for pocketing balls, playing zone position, lining up your eyes correctly relative to the line of the shot, etc.

The main thing with aiming is the way we connect the two balls together BEFORE getting down on the shot. If anyone doesn't think we have a system for that I will tell them they're living in a fantasy world.

The thing that intermediate players are missing is there's 2 lines when aiming and one uses the edge of the cue ball and the other uses the center of the cue ball. And to understand this you must stop looking at the balls like they're round....they are, for all intents and purposes FLAT and one dimensional for the purposes of aiming.

I go over a lot of this in my 3rd volume of Ultimate Pool Secrets, but after talking to Stan, Hunter, and Corey, I realized I was doing something else unconsciously that is more of the foundation of his system.

This has done wonders for my understanding how it all comes together and has enabled me to "remember" exactly how I was doing it in my prime. When playing good (gambling) I would expect to miss about one ball an hour (that I was trying to pocket) , and when I was playing great I would not make one ball every 2 hours.

When I played Efren in Seattle for 14 hours I missed 6 balls total (that's my top speed). If anyone thinks I didn't use a system to do that that's fine.....but I'd challenge them to shoot a gun or bow without sights, because that's how they're playing pool if they don't know how to utilize systems in their pool game. 'My Game is the Teacher'

PS: regarding "aiming systems" --------> "even walking down a flight of stairs requires a "stepping system". ;)

I understand why Pros say some of the things they do about him not having an aiming system....however, I also don't think they would say the same things to me in private....everyone has a system, and you also know if you analyze it too much without completely understanding it your game will suffer greatly....at some point it's essential to keep from "thinking" about the unconscious activity too much.

However, I for one have sacrificed my level of play quite a bit to figure this stuff out and when I start playing seriously again I'll also try to "not think about my game"....that's why it's virtually impossible to teach at a world class level and play at that level at the same time..
Well; when you start playing seriously again, you might just regain the same speed you had back in your road days. Maybe not; I understand it's not the case with most people, but I'm 54 years and 5 months and I insist... I absolutely insist, my hand eye coordination on the pool table has not deteriorated one teensy weensy bit since I was 18

I said this on a post when I was 53 and there was rapid skepticism in replys, so I backed off. I know this is uncommon and I didn't want to sound like a jerk touting it, but on the other hand, it is the case with me; therefore, I'm sure it must be the case with others and it should be talked about.
 

CJ Wiley

ESPN WORLD OPEN CHAMPION
Gold Member
Silver Member
'The Subconscious Game is the Teacher'

That's right, he's going to be "the apple of your eye" (our pupil).

Sometimes we forget {over time} that driving, walking, talking, writing, etc. requires a system before we can do it "naturally". Pool is a very complex game with very little "margin for error," therefore we have to use a systematic way to stand, set up for the shot, go down on the shot, hold and control the cue, judge all the physics involved with each shot, not to mention the "aiming," and aligning to the Line of the Shot.

To do this consistently we must utilize a system that may someday become "unconscious" for some, and others will always need a "check list," either mentally, or physically. It's the same way in golf, tennis, martial arts, and even communication.....thank Goodness we don't have to think about every aspect and can rely on our subconscious to "take care of the details" once we create our way of doing things. 'The Subconscious Game is the Teacher'
brain_thoughts_subconscious.jpg



That's pretty funny, but also very true. Just the other day my three year-old grandson was showing me his system for going down the basement stairs without falling under the hand rail and onto the floor below. He actually had a specific method that he explained to me in great detail. I didn't share my system with him, but it would have been something like, "Well, Papa steps down with his right foot first, because that's the leg with the bad knee, and he doesn't want to bend it, then he quickly..."

You get the picture. Anyway, great post, CJ.
 

Colonel

Living The Dream
Silver Member
That's right, he's going to be "the apple of your eye" (our pupil).

Sometimes we forget {over time} that driving, walking, talking, writing, etc. requires a system before we can do it "naturally". Pool is a very complex game with very little "margin for error," therefore we have to use a systematic way to stand, set up for the shot, go down on the shot, hold and control the cue, judge all the physics involved with each shot, not to mention the "aiming," and aligning to the Line of the Shot.

To do this consistently we must utilize a system that may someday become "unconscious" for some, and others will always need a "check list," either mentally, or physically. It's the same way in golf, tennis, martial arts, and even communication.....thank Goodness we don't have to think about every aspect and can rely on our subconscious to "take care of the details" once we create our way of doing things. 'The Subconscious Game is the Teacher'
brain_thoughts_subconscious.jpg

You know as well as I do this is pre shot routine. Letting the conscious mind make the decision on the course of action, then click it off by visualizing this course of action allowing the "visual" to engage the subconscious to execute what you've just "seen" in the minds eye. It's rote routine, never wavering & yes that can be called systematic, almost machine like when you're in the zone.


Why am I the Colonel? Because I always get the chicken
 

336Robin

Multiverse Operative
Gold Member
Silver Member
Great Description

You know as well as I do this is pre shot routine. Letting the conscious mind make the decision on the course of action, then click it off by visualizing this course of action allowing the "visual" to engage the subconscious to execute what you've just "seen" in the minds eye. It's rote routine, never wavering & yes that can be called systematic, almost machine like when you're in the zone.


Why am I the Colonel? Because I always get the chicken

Nice description.

Its just crazy how many perceptions there are that seem to work. I think you have to want to find the answer for yourself. You ask yourself a lot of questions. You find some answers, then you let it flow, until the next question and answer are found. Rinse and Repeat.
 

Lucky_Lew66

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
you know the table and sticks and balls are supposed to be geometrically correct,but we know tables roll off,rails become dead and dont bank geometrically true all the time anyways. Also cloth gets worn and developes holes and rail tracks, and balls and sticks get warped. Maybe on a one piece diamond thats newly set up,new balls,and a new stick,but even then the cloth slides before it banks,and isnt true geometrically. Thats what makes the game so exciting, trying to compensate for all the factors and play great anyways. Its amazing how good we are actually playing when we are controlling all the physics of the game and running racks. I think at that time we are as close to being a robot in a controlled laboratory experiment as we can be. Controlling the all the elements involved is what keeps us playing the game,for the times we play perfect pool.
 

CJ Wiley

ESPN WORLD OPEN CHAMPION
Gold Member
Silver Member
It's humbling when we "real eyes" that our minds don't always tell us the truth.

That's right, it was the "zone" that really got me obsessed about understanding the deeper level's of pool.....physically, mentally, and even emotionally.

Reading books like 'Inner Tennis,' 'Zen in the Art of Archery,' and studying martial arts, meditation, hypnosis, helped to unlock the mysteries of the subconscious for me. It's amazing what's possible when we start to train our "minds" to work together instead of suffering in the separation. It's humbling when we "real eyes" that our minds don't always tell us the truth.....and in some instances outright lie to us.

The pace and stress of this world age has really torn people apart mentally, and emotionally. Unless we are shown how to change our ideas, attitudes and emotions we have a long, arduous journey ahead of us. 'The Game {of Life} is the Teacher'
jack-ziegler-come-along-son-we-are-at-but-the-beginning-of-a-long-and-arduous-journey-new-yorker-cartoon.jpg



You know as well as I do this is pre shot routine. Letting the conscious mind make the decision on the course of action, then click it off by visualizing this course of action allowing the "visual" to engage the subconscious to execute what you've just "seen" in the minds eye. It's rote routine, never wavering & yes that can be called systematic, almost machine like when you're in the zone.


Why am I the Colonel? Because I always get the chicken
 

Colonel

Living The Dream
Silver Member
That's right, it was the "zone" that really got me obsessed about understanding the deeper level's of pool.....physically, mentally, and even emotionally.

Reading books like 'Inner Tennis,' 'Zen in the Art of Archery,' and studying martial arts, meditation, hypnosis, helped to unlock the mysteries of the subconscious for me. It's amazing what's possible when we start to train our "minds" to work together instead of suffering in the separation. It's humbling when we "real eyes" that our minds don't always tell us the truth.....and in some instances outright lie to us.

The pace and stress of this world age has really torn people apart mentally, and emotionally. Unless we are shown how to change our ideas, attitudes and emotions we have a long, arduous journey ahead of us. 'The Game {of Life} is the Teacher'
jack-ziegler-come-along-son-we-are-at-but-the-beginning-of-a-long-and-arduous-journey-new-yorker-cartoon.jpg

I agree, it's amazing to me how few realize that understanding both the conscious & subconscious both have a very important role in this game & to play it world class you need to identify not only what these roles are but to train your mind to get your conscious & subconscious to work in concert with one another to keep each in its place throughout the course of a session to achieve optimum play. What's really interesting is when doing this you entrench yourself so deep in your game that nothing affects you & you really don't miss much if you've developed a proper physical game as well & the real beauty is how this precision like detachment can cause your opponent to implode while locked down in the chair.


Why am I the Colonel? Because I always get the chicken
 

logical

apart of their 'semi public'
Silver Member
The "playing field" is certainly correct and complete and geometric. So it follows that it should be the easiest of all games to master.
The game unfortunately involves a human.
 

CJ Wiley

ESPN WORLD OPEN CHAMPION
Gold Member
Silver Member
I've described it as a "7 Layer Cake", and it all starts at the feet.

The "playing field" is certainly correct and complete and geometric. So it follows that it should be the easiest of all games to master.
The game unfortunately involves a human.


Getting to caught up in the physics and complex explanations is unnecessary. I seriously have my doubts that anyone actually better by understanding spin/squirt ratios. The physics of the Game are simple, the geometry is slightly more difficult, and the mind/body/cue relationships are the most important.

The systems are simple, if willing to learn the basic foundation of the Game. You must have a system to set up the same relative to the "line of the shot" every time and build on that in levels. I've described it as a "7 Layer Cake", and it all starts at the feet.

If you aren't able to get your feet in the same place relative to the shot, then you will have no chance of getting the rest of you body set correctly. Pocket Billiards has such slim margins for error I believe it's essential to concentrate on your the basics. It will make the more sophisticated aspects of the Game much easier and playing at a high level well within your reach.
 

Push&Pool

Professional Banger
Silver Member
I agree, I think it's one of the main reasons we humans are fascinated by this game.
 

CJ Wiley

ESPN WORLD OPEN CHAMPION
Gold Member
Silver Member
Do we play the Game, or does the Game play us? 'The Game is the Teacher'

I agree, I think it's one of the main reasons we humans are fascinated by this game.

Pool teaches that the answers are usually opposite of what's "logic".......life is full of paradoxes as well.....the classic example is "it's better to give than to receive".....it's absolutely true, and it still takes many people a lifetime to "real eyes" ...such is life - The Game is the Teacher'
th
 
Top