Is this a foul?

[DynoDan]

‘Refereeing’, in general, is no doubt a stressful/thankless job. The prizefight referee who stops a fight early to prevent serious injury, is accused of complicity with the criminal gambling element. If he lets the fight continue, and the result is crippling or death, he is labeled an accomplice to murder. Because the rules are sometimes less that exact, and humans often make mistakes, doesn’t excuse blind justification (IMHO). Common sense should prevail regardless, but sometimes the rules don’t reflect this.

 

[soyale]

And I imagine that those businesses have someone on staff who is paid to deal with the rules. Or maybe even a whole group of people.

The WPA Vice President frequently refers rules questions to me. I was the chief editor of the current revision of the WPA World Standardized Rules. Much of the wording is mine. If that is enough authority for you, a ruling has been given, but I have no official position within the WPA.

@Bob Jewett maybe you can answer a question that has been bothering me for a while.

Per WPA 10 ball rules:

9.6 Safety

The shooter, after the break at anytime may call “safety” which permits him to make contact with the legal object ball without pocketing a ball and end his inning. However, if the shooter pockets the legal object ball the incoming player has the option to play the shot as left, or hand it back to his opponent. (See 9.7 Wrongfully Pocketed Balls which also applies during a
safety.)

can you give an example of when it would benefit the player to call a safety in 10 ball?

the way its worded, it seems to me that if you call safe and don’t pocket anything, it is the same result as if you had not called safe. However, if you do pocket a ball, you are at a disadvantage as the other player retains the option to play the shot or pass it back.

would it not then be at the player’s advantage to always call a pocket, rather than a safe? if you can clear this up for me i would appreciate it. thank you

 

[Bob Jewett]

... can you give an example of when it would benefit the player to call a safety in 10 ball? ...

There is no real benefit at any time to the player to call a safety at 10 ball, as you noted. The rules should not mention the call.

Most of the current version of the World Standardized Rules were worked on by an international committee that met in late 2006 in Gary, Indiana. Various revisions to the original draft were made and votes were taken on some of the more problematic rules. The rules of 10 ball were not discussed at all in that committee nor did they appear in the draft. When they appeared in the full rules in January 2008, I was rather surprised. I do not know who worked on them.'
'
The only benefit of calling a safe at 10 ball that I can think of is to let the referee and your opponent know that you think it is impossible for any ball to be pocketed on your next shot and you are not calling anything. I think saying "no call" would better cover that.

 

[Black-Balled]

I bet with Bob and against coocoo cowboy every time.

Pay off every 500. Send me the money.

 

[soyale]

There is no real benefit at any time to the player to call a safety at 10 ball, as you noted. The rules should not mention the call.

Most of the current version of the World Standardized Rules were worked on by an international committee that met in late 2006 in Gary, Indiana. Various revisions to the original draft were made and votes were taken on some of the more problematic rules. The rules of 10 ball were not discussed at all in that committee nor did they appear in the draft. When they appeared in the full rules in January 2008, I was rather surprised. I do not know who worked on them.'
'
The only benefit of calling a safe at 10 ball that I can think of is to let the referee and your opponent know that you think it is impossible for any ball to be pocketed on your next shot and you are not calling anything. I think saying "no call" would better cover that.

Thanks Bob, im glad to know that i wasn’t missing anything.

The only situation i could think of was if you wanted to “tempt” your opponent by calling safe, PLAYING safe, and pocketing a ball, which would give your opponent the option similar to a Push shot, but again i can only see this as a disadvantage to the shooter.

 

[straightline]

‘Refereeing’, in general, is no doubt a stressful/thankless job. The prizefight referee who stops a fight early to prevent serious injury, is accused of complicity with the criminal gambling element. If he lets the fight continue, and the result is crippling or death, he is labeled an accomplice to murder. Because the rules are sometimes less that exact, and humans often make mistakes, doesn’t excuse blind justification (IMHO). Common sense should prevail regardless, but sometimes the rules don’t reflect this.

This is typical of the rule of law. For example:

No one is above the law.
How about two then?

Equal justice under the law.
The law is above equal justice?

I imagine anyone with trial experience has volumes of those.