ivory ferrels

A

almarktool

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Can anyone tell me the plus's and negatives in
using an ivory ferrel, a few freinds of mine are
using them on the Meucci sticks, the same
cue that i use as well, and was wondering if
i should change and do the same,

Thanks
Mark
 
I'd say no to installing ivory on a Meucci. It is not going to improve the playability of the cue due the diameter of the tenon and the thin wall of the ferrule. I believe it can and will crack. Its just a matter of time. Use a harder linen based ferrule or a new poly-resin like Saber-T.
 
Ivory serves no purpose except for collector's value or snob appeal. There's no advantage to it, and it's a liability in terms of durability and cost. I've played both. I don't like them. Doesn't mean that it's a poor choice, as some of the older players love ivory for the "feel". I like Ryan's advice - use a linen based ferrule (except ivorine 4 - this stuff is white g-10!) or the softer plastic like Sabre-T or Titan.
 
I can't attest to the mechanics of each cue but its definitely not something you want to break with.

Personally I have a few cues with ivory ferrules and as far as feel goes I like it a lot. Slightly firmer/crisper with a tad more response. I had my first custom done with one ivory and one non ivory ferrule with the exact same thickness and measurements and weight so I could see what I liked better. I liked the ivory.
 
Shawn Armstrong said:
Ivory serves no purpose except for collector's value or snob appeal. There's no advantage to it, and it's a liability in terms of durability and cost. I've played both. I don't like them. Doesn't mean that it's a poor choice, as some of the older players love ivory for the "feel". I like Ryan's advice - use a linen based ferrule (except ivorine 4 - this stuff is white g-10!) or the softer plastic like Sabre-T or Titan.
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I've heard from a few trusted sources that ivory generally puts more spin on the ball than most ferrules. I play with them and can't be certain either way on that since there are other factors involved. Some of the cuemakers on this site prefer it for playability.

To each his own.
 
axejunkie said:
I've heard from a few trusted sources that ivory generally puts more spin on the ball than most ferrules. I play with them and can't be certain either way on that since there are other factors involved. Some of the cuemakers on this site prefer it for playability.

To each his own.
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To put more spin on the ball, you need a softer ferrule than ivory. The reason people think ivory ferrules spin the ball more is due to the fibre pad at the base of the tip that shields the ferrule. Put the same fibre pad at the base of a linen ferrule, you get the same juice. I learned this one from Mike Webb, and the guys at Showcase Billiards.
 
I would not install it on a existing Meucci shaft as stated by RATCUES.

However if you like the way Ivory ferrules play, I would suggest to get a custom shaft made with Ivory. But make shure the ferrules are treaded and that the tenon from the shaft does not go all the way through the ferrule. The top 1/4" of the ivory ferrule should be solid.

I have 2 Black Boar cues with Ivory ferrules that I have used for 20+ hours a week for the last 15 years and I have not had the first problem with them. Not the first crack.

In my opinion and experence with ivory ferrules, A properly installed ivory ferrule is a good and long term investment in a cue. And ivory plays great!
 
No Problem

Bishop said:
I can't attest to the mechanics of each cue but its definitely not something you want to break with.
Click to expand...

I've been breaking with ivory ferrules for over 15 years. No problem yet.
 
Shawn Armstrong said:
Ivory serves no purpose except for collector's value or snob appeal. There's no advantage to it, and it's a liability in terms of durability and cost. I've played both. I don't like them. Doesn't mean that it's a poor choice, as some of the older players love ivory for the "feel". I like Ryan's advice - use a linen based ferrule (except ivorine 4 - this stuff is white g-10!) or the softer plastic like Sabre-T or Titan.
Click to expand...

Ivory ferrules have one big advantage over linen based ferrules. They won't take chalk. Even with proper chalking technique, it's pretty hard to keep the softer ferrule materials clean. I have cues that are thirty years old and the ferrules still look new.

Cosmetics aside, I don't think there is any advantage. All other things being equal, a shaft with an ivory ferrule would have a little more squirt than the other choices. As to durability, the only ferrule that ever cracked on me was one of those extra long POS that is standard on a Meucci, so I probably wouldn't go so far as to say liability.
 
Omar said:
Ivory ferrules have one big advantage over linen based ferrules. They won't take chalk. Even with proper chalking technique, it's pretty hard to keep the softer ferrule materials clean. I have cues that are thirty years old and the ferrules still look new.

Cosmetics aside, I don't think there is any advantage. All other things being equal, a shaft with an ivory ferrule would have a little more squirt than the other choices. As to durability, the only ferrule that ever cracked on me was one of those extra long POS that is standard on a Meucci, so I probably wouldn't go so far as to say liability.
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Those Meucci ferrules have an ultra thin wall to reduce cueball deflection. I'm talking about companies like McDermott, Joss, Schon, Viking, etc. who use a screwed and glued linen based ferrule like Aegis or Ivorine. I'm not talking about the performance ferrules like Pred or Meucci. Install an ivory ferrule like a Pred or a Meucci (3/8 inch tenon, 1/16 inch side wall, capped) ferrule, and see how long it lasts. Most ivory ferrules are installed with a 5/16 inside bore, or drilled and tapped to 5/16-18 with a threaded tenon. They have a solid cap, and then are usually padded with a fibre base at the bottom of the tip. If you did this to a phenolic or linen based ferrule, you could shoot masse shots all day, and never suffer any damage. True, the linen based ferrules pick up chalk. Have your cue guy wax the ferrule or seal it with some thin epoxy and buff it. That helps with the blueing a little. I chalk fairly neatly, so my ferrules stay white :).
 
Shawn Armstrong said:
Those Meucci ferrules have an ultra thin wall to reduce cueball deflection. I'm talking about companies like McDermott, Joss, Schon, Viking, etc. who use a screwed and glued linen based ferrule like Aegis or Ivorine. I'm not talking about the performance ferrules like Pred or Meucci. Install an ivory ferrule like a Pred or a Meucci (3/8 inch tenon, 1/16 inch side wall, capped) ferrule, and see how long it lasts. Most ivory ferrules are installed with a 5/16 inside bore, or drilled and tapped to 5/16-18 with a threaded tenon. They have a solid cap, and then are usually padded with a fibre base at the bottom of the tip. If you did this to a phenolic or linen based ferrule, you could shoot masse shots all day, and never suffer any damage. True, the linen based ferrules pick up chalk. Have your cue guy wax the ferrule or seal it with some thin epoxy and buff it. That helps with the blueing a little. I chalk fairly neatly, so my ferrules stay white :).
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Just in case someone caught it before me, Viking uses a plastic ferrule. Sorry for the misinformation. Point was, screwed and glued with thicker walled ferrule design.
 
Ivory ferrules on a Meucci?

That's like putting racing gas (`118 octane) in a Prius! :p

-von
 
Cuaba said:
I've been breaking with ivory ferrules for over 15 years. No problem yet.
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When I had my custom Joss from Dan Janes, I broke with it all the time, about 4 years, IIRC. Never had a problem. That was one of only two cues I've owned with ivory ferrules. The other was a Scruggs. I've always liked the feel of ivory and that feel is what's important. I guess the reason I haven't had any other cues with ivory is cost. The only knock I had against both my Soutwest cues was the ferrules, which yellowed on both cues. Didn't like the feel, either. I think my current cue has Ivorine 3.
I would NOT put ivory ferrules on a Meucci.
 
Shawn Armstrong said:
To put more spin on the ball, you need a softer ferrule than ivory. The reason people think ivory ferrules spin the ball more is due to the fibre pad at the base of the tip that shields the ferrule. Put the same fibre pad at the base of a linen ferrule, you get the same juice. I learned this one from Mike Webb, and the guys at Showcase Billiards.
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I've never heard that theory but it could well be true. One of my shafts has the pad, the other doesn't and I don't notice a difference in spin properties. Maybe it's too minute for me to tell...
 
almarktool said:
Can anyone tell me the plus's and negatives in
using an ivory ferrel, a few freinds of mine are
using them on the Meucci sticks, the same
cue that i use as well, and was wondering if
i should change and do the same,

Thanks
Mark
Click to expand...
Meucci cues are designed to use the thin soft plastic ferrule. This is one part of their low deflection design and if you go to a hard ferrule you will change the deflection characteristics of your cue.
 
Shawn Armstrong said:
Those Meucci ferrules have an ultra thin wall to reduce cueball deflection. I'm talking about companies like McDermott, Joss, Schon, Viking, etc. who use a screwed and glued linen based ferrule like Aegis or Ivorine. I'm not talking about the performance ferrules like Pred or Meucci. Install an ivory ferrule like a Pred or a Meucci (3/8 inch tenon, 1/16 inch side wall, capped) ferrule, and see how long it lasts. Most ivory ferrules are installed with a 5/16 inside bore, or drilled and tapped to 5/16-18 with a threaded tenon. They have a solid cap, and then are usually padded with a fibre base at the bottom of the tip. If you did this to a phenolic or linen based ferrule, you could shoot masse shots all day, and never suffer any damage. True, the linen based ferrules pick up chalk. Have your cue guy wax the ferrule or seal it with some thin epoxy and buff it. That helps with the blueing a little. I chalk fairly neatly, so my ferrules stay white :).
Click to expand...

Good points. Although, my Meucci cracked in the mid 80's well before the Predator revolution. I think they used those ferrules because they were cheap and it only became a "feature" when everybody started talking about squirt. In case you haven't guessed, I am a natural born cynic! :D
 
Those old Meucci ferrules were soft for a reason. They also had a rather large tenon - 3/8". I used to play a Meucci years ago, but never cracked a ferrule. The thin ferrule was to reduce cueball deflection. Later, with the Predator shaft and other innovations, Meucci started capping their ferrules. There's not much cost savings in building a cue with a plastic ferrule or a linen ferrule. Price of plastic is about 70 cents for a ferrule. Linen is about $3. Usually, it's how the maker wants the cue to hit.
 
Shawn Armstrong said:
Those old Meucci ferrules were soft for a reason. They also had a rather large tenon - 3/8". I used to play a Meucci years ago, but never cracked a ferrule. The thin ferrule was to reduce cueball deflection. Later, with the Predator shaft and other innovations, Meucci started capping their ferrules. There's not much cost savings in building a cue with a plastic ferrule or a linen ferrule. Price of plastic is about 70 cents for a ferrule. Linen is about $3. Usually, it's how the maker wants the cue to hit.
Click to expand...

Well, you experience is very different than mine. Back in 1983-1986, my league operator sold Meucci's out of his house. A lot of guys played with them. It was quite common to see cues with a hairline crack the length of the ferrule. I also have a friend who shattered the ferrule on a sneaky pete.

Luckily, mine got stolen before that happened. :D
 
Not saying it didn't happen. It happened A LOT. I was just lucky to never have had one with my old Meucci. Was probably one of the only to not have this problem.
 
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